Ali's nicknames for his opponents

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 14 Oct 2005, 06:43

I grew up watching Ali, and some of his bantering was amazingly entertaining. Some of his funniest stuff were the nicknames he gave to his opponents. Some that I remember:

Liston was the bear
Patterson was the rabbit
Frazier was the gorilla
Shavers was the acorn

Who remembers some of the others? He called somebody the mummy. Was that Foreman? Did he have a name for Norton?

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 14 Oct 2005, 06:50

Foreman was the mummy. I think Holmes was peanut head.

Slapsie Maxie · Post by **Slapsie Maxie** » 14 Oct 2005, 06:50

I am a huge fan of Ali but some of this "bantering" strayed towards the downright vindictive and nasty.

Frazier has never forgiven him for the "Uncle Tom" thing and, quite frankly, I don't blame him

Slapsie

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 14 Oct 2005, 06:52

Chuvalo was 'the washer woman'!!!..

.. which I've always found amusing!

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 14 Oct 2005, 08:27

Slapsie Maxie wrote:I am a huge fan of Ali but some of this "bantering" strayed towards the downright vindictive and nasty.

Frazier has never forgiven him for the "Uncle Tom" thing and, quite frankly, I don't blame him

Slapsie

I agree that some of it went over the top but Ali has apologised quite a few times now and I think Frazier has long lost the moral high ground with his crass comments over the years about Ali's health. Ali also praised Fraizer a lot as a fighter, especially after Manila... its not like he never gave him any credit.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 14 Oct 2005, 09:05

At the time some of his hype leading up to fights was a bit much, but Ali understood how to promote an event, having borrowed much of his act from professional wrestling. While some of it was spoken with true anger and meaning, most of it was nothing more than publicity seeking hype. Actually, during most of his career I was one of those hoping to see him get his ass kicked so that he'd shut up. He sucked me right into the act.

But even with my dislike of his antics at the time, I still enjoyed much of his banter, especially with the pokes taken at the expense of the equally overblown Cosell. Great stuff -- even when you see it 30+ years later.

Grimm · Post by **Grimm** » 14 Oct 2005, 09:38

Why did he call Ernie Shavers the acorn???

wlvrne · Post by **wlvrne** » 14 Oct 2005, 10:14

Grimm wrote:Why did he call Ernie Shavers the acorn???

I think it was because of the shape of his head.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 14 Oct 2005, 10:37

The Great John L wrote:At the time some of his hype leading up to fights was a bit much, but Ali understood how to promote an event, having borrowed much of his act from professional wrestling. While some of it was spoken with true anger and meaning, most of it was nothing more than publicity seeking hype. Actually, during most of his career I was one of those hoping to see him get his ass kicked so that he'd shut up. He sucked me right into the act.

But even with my dislike of his antics at the time, I still enjoyed much of his banter, especially with the pokes taken at the expense of the equally overblown Cosell. Great stuff -- even when you see it 30+ years later.

The thing is that most of the time when he said that stuff he said it with a bit of a grin and a twinkle in his eye. The only time he was really annoyed at his opponents was against Terrell and Patterson and perhaps Frazier the first time becuase he had 'taken' his title.

barry · Post by **barry** » 14 Oct 2005, 10:41

Spinks was "Dracula!" I still get a chuckle out of hearing Ali being interviewed before his bout with Archie Moore where he says, "Why don't someone just give that old man a pension, or something."

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 14 Oct 2005, 11:14

Slapsie Maxie wrote:I am a huge fan of Ali but some of this "bantering" strayed towards the downright vindictive and nasty.

Frazier has never forgiven him for the "Uncle Tom" thing and, quite frankly, I don't blame him

Slapsie

Agreed. His baiting of Joe was way over the top!!!

I can understand why Joe is so upest; he's more black than Ali!!!!!!

Ali is mixed race. He had no right to call Joe an Uncle Tom!!!!

ShoeShine · Post by **ShoeShine** » 14 Oct 2005, 11:30

Slapsie Maxie wrote:I am a huge fan of Ali but some of this "bantering" strayed towards the downright vindictive and nasty.

Frazier has never forgiven him for the "Uncle Tom" thing and, quite frankly, I don't blame him

Slapsie

that was 30 yrs ago ....Frazier needs to get over it.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 14 Oct 2005, 11:32

barry wrote:Spinks was "Dracula!" I still get a chuckle out of hearing Ali being interviewed before his bout with Archie Moore where he says, "Why don't someone just give that old man a pension, or something."

I remember him saying to Liston "You're 40 if a day! and you don't belong in the ring with Cassius Clay!".
I read something not long ago where Chuck Wepner recalled meeting Ali recently and he said at first Ali looked like he was going to walk past him, but then he turned and came over to Wepner and stood on his foot!... in reference to Wepner standing on his feet in their fight!!!...

walshb · Post by **walshb** » 14 Oct 2005, 11:43

I know Ali gave Joe a lot of stick thru the yrs, but he ultimately respected and really liked Joe. It was at a time when Blacks had no damn rights and he was so outspoken. He didn't like the fact that Joe seemed to be so chilled even though he was considered second class at the time. He also did apologise to Joe. It was all part of Ali's personality, he belittled his opponents, more out of hype and fun than actual malice.....

tagjohnson · Post by **tagjohnson** » 14 Oct 2005, 15:58

Ali called Ernie Terrell the Squirrel.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 14 Oct 2005, 17:30

I believe your correct about Ali being really only annoyed with Patterson and Terrell more so Terrell.

I met Joe Frazier after his second fight with Ali and he had no sense of humor on the subject at all. We stayed on music subjects more than fighting because he made it clear to me that he did not want to talk Ali and had little respect for him in any way.

It was a very serious sore spot with him. His band said that the subject was totaly taboo unless you wanted Joe Frazier annoyed. (Something absolutely no one wanted.) Otherwise in every other way he was a gem of a guy and a very jovial character from what I experienced.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 16 Oct 2005, 08:51

BoxBuzz wrote:I believe your correct about Ali being really only annoyed with Patterson and Terrell more so Terrell.

I met Joe Frazier after his second fight with Ali and he had no sense of humor on the subject at all. We stayed on music subjects more than fighting because he made it clear to me that he did not want to talk Ali and had little respect for him in any way.

It was a very serious sore spot with him. His band said that the subject was totaly taboo unless you wanted Joe Frazier annoyed. (Something absolutely no one wanted.) Otherwise in every other way he was a gem of a guy and a very jovial character from what I experienced.

You have to remember that Frazier's whole life is dominated by Ali.

Ali insulted him & his children & yet all people ever want to talk to him about is Ali. I don't blame him for being bitter.

Ali is a great guy, but he often got carried away in his younger days & didn't think before speaking.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 16 Oct 2005, 09:52

Here is my take on it, we give people the power they have over us, we can also take it away. Usually an old fashioned concept of forgiveness does the trick. If we are bitter it robs us, not the object of our bitterness. But there are some things that are so powerful it takes a lifetime to find that forgiveness.

And one thing for sure the things that were in play between those two drew half the world into the discussion. It was much bigger than just their dispute, Pretty damn powerful stuff. So I'm not criticizing Frazier one bit. We all have things in our gut that we don't let go of, even if it would be to our benefit to do so.

Ask any divorced couple with kids.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 16 Oct 2005, 10:38

BoxBuzz wrote:Here is my take on it, we give people the power they have over us, we can also take it away. Usually an old fashioned concept of forgiveness does the trick. If we are bitter it robs us, not the object of our bitterness. But there are some things that are so powerful it takes a lifetime to find that forgiveness.

And one thing for sure the things that were in play between those two drew half the world into the discussion. It was much bigger than just their dispute, Pretty damn powerful stuff. So I'm not criticizing Frazier one bit. We all have things in our gut that we don't let go of, even if it would be to our benefit to do so.

Ask any divorced couple with kids.

I agree. Frazier is one of my favourite fighters as is Ali of course, but I think Frazier would be much more populr figure today had he been able to shrug off the real and imagined insults that Ali hit him with. Had Frazier read between the lines and looked at the positive things Ali said about him then he would be a more contented and happy man.
People have to realise that Ali wasn't responsible for what other people said to Frazier or his children. It should also be remembered that Ali had heaps of abuse hurled at him throughout his career, including death threats, threats of prison, and he also lost 3 and a half years of his career... his peak years... (and was penniless by the time he was allowed back)...yet all this did not and has not made Ali bitter like Frazier.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 16 Oct 2005, 11:17

Agreed.

Although sometimes we put a slant on things that we feel are deficits when the question can be asked is this really so?

For example.

Ali is my all time favorite. With this said I am not so sure that in retrospect his lost "prime" does not add further to his positive legacy. There is nothing he could have accomplished during this time that would have "inflated" his influence or reputation. Not even great victories over good opponents. And to add to this he took no beatings for this length of time, something that only added to his ultimate longevity as a fighter.

His fight with father time holding him temporarily to a "draw" was part of his mistique. Of course Foreman was able to hold the great time keeper at bay for what seemed to be an even more impressive stalemate.

Anyway between these 3 great names of that era, Frazier is coming out third in many historians estimations. A historical accounting that he truly does not agree with in any way shape or fashion.

In my mind this was the greatest Tri Fecta of talent ever to ascend to the HW division at one time.

If cultus should read this I expect he would excuse himself to have nice long vomit at what I have just written.

Ali's nicknames for his opponents

Ali's nicknames for his opponents

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