Bellew World class?

[Ezzard]

I did actually score it a draw.

Bellew had toruble with a a very skillful defensive fighter. No shame in that.

I think the needle…after the bell shots…head use…were a tactic to try and get the guy to open up more in the middle of the ring.

Few people will look good against this guy.

I seem to remember half the forum stating categorically that Froch was not up to it after the Dirrell fight.

[johnswan1]

I actually hate seeing Bellew fight these days. As much as he seems a decent person, I cannot bear watch these fights where no risks are taken and a fighter tries to take a decision with the minimum of fuss. I couldn't understand Bellew jumping around afterwards as though he had been robbed. He simply didn't do enough to clearly take the fight. Ever since the McKenzie fight Bomber has been all about safety first. It's horrible to watch. I prefer to see fighters who think more about the now and their current opponent rather than always be looking ahead and just trying to fiddle through fights.

[Tomasino]

I actually hate seeing Bellew fight these days. As much as he seems a decent person, I cannot bear watch these fights where no risks are taken and a fighter tries to take a decision with the minimum of fuss. I couldn't understand Bellew jumping around afterwards as though he had been robbed. He simply didn't do enough to clearly take the fight. Ever since the McKenzie fight Bomber has been all about safety first. It's horrible to watch. I prefer to see fighters who think more about the now and their current opponent rather than always be looking ahead and just trying to fiddle through fights.

That's how I see it too. I had some mates over and they went as far to suggest Bellew had shit himself. It was not a fight that gets people enjoying boxing.

[handsofstone]

I had it 114-114,havent watched it again,most people seem to have Chilemba winning on 2nd time of viewing,when most people have got it for either fighter by no more than 2 points then nobody can say it was a robbery either way.
I do think Bellew needs to figure out what type of fighter he wants to be,if its a technical style of boxing as his amateur pedigree suggests he might be capable of doing then great, play to your strengths,no-one can begrudge him that but he is starting to get this all bark no bite reputation.if he wants to talk a good game to sell tickets then he must accept flak that comes his way when he seems gun shy

[winkveron]

How do you all define "world class"? I really like Tony, and while I won't say he's an all time great or anything, you can't deny that he is mixing it towards the top of his division. He's almost worked his way to the top of the tree for the most prestigious belt, and was narrowly beaten by another world champion in Cleverly. So maybe he's not in the top echelon in his weight but he's towards the top of the second tier in my opinion.

[earsjohn]

How do you all define "world class"?

Somebody who has won a Big 4 belt by beating a belt holder (ie, not winning a vacant title or being handed a title as a deserving contender) or by winning a unification fight.

I have levels above "World Class" that sort the Andre Wards from the Paulus Ambunda's but as a definable starting point it suits my needs.

[tonyevs]

I seem to remember half the forum stating categorically that Froch was not up to it after the Dirrell fight.

I think after watching Carl against Dirrell it highlighted Carls limitations.
The same limitations that Kessler and Ward found to their advantage shortly afterwards .. so maybe people on this forum had a valid point.


Point to remember here too. Is that Carl has fought the same way up to his world titles. And only the very top guys have been good enough to beat him.
Tony Bellew is 31yrs old this year. Been beaten already by another up and coming guy yet to hit his peak .. and been lucky to get a draw against a guy who hardly looks top class ... Is he going to improve that much more?

[tonyevs]

How do you all define "world class"?

Somebody who has won a Big 4 belt by beating a belt holder (ie, not winning a vacant title or being handed a title as a deserving contender) or by winning a unification fight.

I have levels above "World Class" that sort the Andre Wards from the Paulus Ambunda's but as a definable starting point it suits my needs.

I would define world class as somebody who is competitive against the very top guys in their division.
A world title belt holder is not always world class .. sometimes they are just very lucky!

[earsjohn]

How do you all define "world class"?

Somebody who has won a Big 4 belt by beating a belt holder (ie, not winning a vacant title or being handed a title as a deserving contender) or by winning a unification fight.

I have levels above "World Class" that sort the Andre Wards from the Paulus Ambunda's but as a definable starting point it suits my needs.

I would define world class as somebody who is competitive against the very top guys in their division.
A world title belt holder is not always world class .. sometimes they are just very lucky!

Agreed, my system has its flaws, but it's a basis, not the final answer.

I reserve my "Super World Class" status for the very best, purely on a judgmental basis. I also have "Silver World Class" for those who have the potential to be "world class" but have not had the opportunity to fight for the status and "Emeritus World class" for those who were once "world class" but have since dropped down a level (to "Intercontinental world class", "European World class" or even "Southern Area World Class").

[earsjohn]

Agreed, my system has its flaws, but it's a basis, not the final answer.

I reserve my "Super World Class" status for the very best, purely on a judgmental basis. I also have "Silver World Class" for those who have the potential to be "world class" but have not had the opportunity to fight for the status and "Emeritus World class" for those who were once "world class" but have since dropped down a level (to "Intercontinental world class", "European World class" or even "Southern Area World Class").

Mr. Sulaiman, welcome to the forum, please try not to twat anyone.

That kind of insolence will see you stripped of your "Forum antagonist Diamond World Class" belt that i recently awarded you for a small fee.

[winkveron]

Hahaha at the above posts :)

Anyway, from your replies it seems the majority of people must think Bellew is world class. Because he surely is top 20 in the world at his weight and was competitive with a world champion, albeit perhaps one of the weakest current holders. As we know he hasn't won one of the big 4 belts by beating a credible holder though.

To compare him to a football team maybe Arsenal would be a good analogy. Good enough to be in the mix with the big boys but falls a little short. No shame in that though. I'm still a fan and will be supporting him with his next fight.

[Lenny]

To compare him to a football team maybe Arsenal would be a good analogy. Good enough to be in the mix with the big boys but falls a little short. No shame in that though. I'm still a fan and will be supporting him with his next fight.

Maybe more Stoke. Raw and capable of pulling off an upset but against opposition with a bit of class, will look out of their depth. All too predictable in how they are going to go about things, relying on their overrated power advantage

[TheCobra]

Bellew not world class for me, he's Euro class at best so far. You have to beat someone decent at world level in half-decent fashion to be world class, which he hasn't done yet.

[tonyevs]

To compare him to a football team maybe Arsenal would be a good analogy. Good enough to be in the mix with the big boys but falls a little short. No shame in that though. I'm still a fan and will be supporting him with his next fight.

Maybe more Stoke. Raw and capable of pulling off an upset but against opposition with a bit of class, will look out of their depth. All too predictable in how they are going to go about things, relying on their overrated power advantage

X2

[lillywhite14]

World class in thrown around too often.

In terms of world class fighters, light heavy is bare. You could easily argue a couple of the belt holders at the weight aren't even world class fighters.

Bellew might be approaching world class light heavyweight level but he isn't a world class fighter.

If that makes sense!

[bripez]

World class in thrown around too often.

I agree.

It wasn't that long ago Bellew was struggling against McKenzie and Ajisafe, and his biggest fights since then he has lost and drawn - I don't get how that promotes you to "World Class" ?

In the first McKenzie fight Bellew was out on his feet and as soon as he landed a shot the ref stopped the fight ! - also Ajisafe had Bellew down.

Ever since then he has adopted a safety approach - which is fine, as long as you don't go around screaming and shouting about how he is going to smash people up and is "willing to die in the ring".

[nh1]

Haven't been on here for a while, and so it was good to read that I wasn't the only one who saw a *completely* different fight to the Sky commentators.

I had it 115-113 for Chilemba. How they had Bellew winning all those rounds I can't fathom. Sure, Chilemba's shots didn't hurt or bother Tony, but the shots were connecting and scoring. Tony struggled to land anything.

Tony was furious and frustrated afterwards--fine; understandable. But I do hope he watches that again over and over. It shows he has a long way to travel if he wants to be as good as he would like to be.

[hurlock]

Watched the fight & scored it this time & made Chilemba the winner. I was not impressed at all by bellews performance.he needs to get rid of the South Park chef for a start!
Bellew seemed to pass the blame on to his corner saying they was happy so he didn't exert himself! 8000 paying fans should be an incentive!
He left farnell after the ovil war & reunited with Mcallister & I think that fight shook him up personally even though he's drawn from it that he can climb back up & go on, I think he has been over cautious & tried to be clever & without knowing it played away from his strengths as a fighter.
I think if he wants to do well he needs a trainer like tibbs,Harrison,Colin lake,Brian lawrence, Alan smith