Floyd Patterson vs Riddick Bowe. What If?

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 19 Oct 2005, 13:45

Who wins out of these two former Heavyweight Champions, if they could have met in their primes? Would Floyd be too skilled and fast? Or would Big Daddy Bowe be too big and hit too hard for Patterson.

Floyd Patterson.
http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=009038

Riddick Bowe.
http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=001640

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 19 Oct 2005, 17:19

Bowe swats him like a fly. He takes his china and once again visits the deck.

meade95 · Post by **meade95** » 19 Oct 2005, 18:33

Bowe TKO surly - Somewhere between the 4th-9th round -

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 19 Oct 2005, 18:39

floyd patterson is by far the better boxer, although his chin is a little suspect, i think he had enough speed and power to bring it too bowwe... i see floyd winning a UD by a large margin...even more of a margin if its a 15 rounder... maybe even a KO for Floyd... i really dont think highley of riddick at ALL...he won a trilogy against holyfield, but that doesnt make him a better fight, i.e tarver jones. Riddick didnt beat ANYONE noteworthy in his career aside from holyfield...i just dont understand all the hype about this guy i think hes not top 50 of all time

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 19 Oct 2005, 18:41

Yeah but he can swat flies.

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 19 Oct 2005, 19:05

With Bowe's power and 10 inch reach advantage versus Patterson's lack of size and less than solid chin, I say Riddick ices him in the first round.

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 19 Oct 2005, 19:11

oh get real...floyd is too good to be KO in the first round by..Ridick Bowe, a pretend champion

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 19 Oct 2005, 21:31

Rory

You're totally blinded by nostalgia when it comes to the heavyweight division. You think because you're so enamored with these little heavyweights (who'd be cruiserweights today) of the 30's to 60's and because you idolize Braddock, that these guys would dominate today's heavyweight division. Well I offer as incontrovertible evidence that they wouldn't stand a chance, the fact that there is NOT a single heavyweight in the top 50 today under 200 lbs. And if you think these sub 200 lb hw's would simply bulk up. It's not that easy. Bob Foster is one of the greatest LHW's of all time, and even with his 6-3 frame he got clobbered in the HW division. And still you think that little Floyd Patterson might actually knockout Riddick Bowe, a guy who was never knocked out in his career, yet who Ko'd Holyfield when he was an excellent fighter, and who's only pro loss was by majority decision.

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 19 Oct 2005, 21:52

size doesnt make up for talent.. i have seen big guys lose to much smaller sized men, its happened throughout history... willard losing to dempsey and primo carnera losing to braddock, and ivan drago losing to rocky balboa...

a fighter like dempsey could easily bulk up to 210 and keep it muscle..with the advanced training facilities today most of them would, i know i love braddock but i dont think my love for him has much of anything to do with my beleif that a fighter in the 190's like dempsey or rocky would be able to take on these big guys such as vitali or riddick...

i doubt there is a person in here that would say louis or rocky didnt have as much power as vitali or bowe. granted floyd doesnt fall into this category, i think he is still much more talented. these heavyweights today are often big lumbering oaf's who ignore everything but their muscle mass and bench press ability.

for this certain fight i could see your size arguement, but when you are talking abotu guys like dempsey rock louis, i think they would walk through heavyweights of today. they were MUCH more talented, and as i said, with the advanced training facilities and dieting, i could see all the great fighters of the psat getting around 215 easy, being able to keep it muscle as well..

basically this fight, IMO, boils down to size vs. talent. i think talent and the brainpower to fight a smart fight, is infinitly more important than being bigger then the other guy in the ring.

meade95 · Post by **meade95** » 19 Oct 2005, 22:04

Rory - I can appreciate some of your thoughts -

But Bowe was definitely talented (and especially for his size) he fought incredibly well inside for a big man -

His size, jab and right hand would have been too much for Floyd (talented and all) - Bowe TKO's him -

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 19 Oct 2005, 22:19

So where are these talented fighters of today who can beat the much bigger men ? I'm sure you've heard Chris Byrd referred to as a little heavyweight, and this is a guy who tips the scales at around 215. In 2002 Davarryl Williams at 211 got off the canvas to stop 313 lb Corey Sanders in the 5th. Such happenings are rare however, and besides, Sanders hasen't ever been near a title shot. To assume that the sub 200 lb HW's of the past would simply bulk up and dominate the HW division is like my saying that Salvador Sanchez (one of my favorite fighters) had he not tragically died at 23 would have been a lock to win the JLW-LW-JWW and possibly even the welterweight titles if he bulked up. All we have to rate any fighter on is what they've actually done.

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 19 Oct 2005, 22:21

Rory McCloskey wrote:floyd patterson is by far the better boxer, although his chin is a little suspect, i think he had enough speed and power to bring it too bowwe... i see floyd winning a UD by a large margin...even more of a margin if its a 15 rounder... maybe even a KO for Floyd... i really dont think highley of riddick at ALL...he won a trilogy against holyfield, but that doesnt make him a better fight, i.e tarver jones. Riddick didnt beat ANYONE noteworthy in his career aside from holyfield...i just dont understand all the hype about this guy i think hes not top 50 of all time

Sorry mate can't agree with you on this one. Bowe, in his prime, was a big big heavyweight, with a big punch, good jab and very good inside fighting ability. He also took a good punch.

Paterson, as good a fighter as he was, had a highly debatable chin. I seem to remember he was decked something like 17 times in his career. He also only had a 71" reach and I think he would find it hard to nail Bowe.

I think Bowe would be to big and strong for Paterson and would stop him in the early rounds. Just think, the first big decent puncher Paterson fought was Liston and what happened then ???

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 19 Oct 2005, 22:46

if all we have to rate any fighter on is what theyve actually done, then what makes salvador sanchez so good

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 19 Oct 2005, 23:09

....what he actually did.

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 19 Oct 2005, 23:30

Rory you've got to be joking ? Before reaching the age of 24 Sanchez knocked out Wilfredo Gomez, Azumah Nelson (hadn't peaked yet but still very good) Danny Lopez twice, Roberto Castanon (43-1 at the time) and tough Hector Cortez, he also took clearcut decisions from Ruben Castillo (48-1 at the time) Juan LaPorte, and Nicky Perez (50-3 at the time).

This thread is about Bowe v Patterson though, so I'll add that an in shape and mentally focused, Riddick Bowe had the speed, skill, power to give a good account of himself against any hw who ever lived. Floyd Patterson never faced an ooponent with Bowe's size or power in his life, he would be severely outgunned and this one would be over very quickly.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 19 Oct 2005, 23:39

Liston just might have been an equal to Bowe in Power maybe a skosh beyond, and those werent good nights for Floyd.

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:07

Actually BoxBuzz I have to disagree. Sonny Liston's knockout percentage was 72.2, Riddick Bowe's is 75.0. Liston's avg rounds per win was 4.92, Bowe's is 4.09, Liston had 8 1st round KO's in 54 fights, Bowe had 11 in just 44 fights. And best of all, 17 of Liston's 39 KO's came against fighters who weighed less than 200 lbs while Riddick Bowe has 20 out of 33 KO's against guys 220 and over. Despite the Liston mystique I think Bowe is clearly the deadlier puncher.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 20 Oct 2005, 03:18

Bowe wins big & I don't mean his stomach!!!

Bowe KO 3.

walshb · Post by **walshb** » 20 Oct 2005, 03:55

Rory, I have to agree with Seamus. Floyd was a weak champ in my opinion who got whacked twice against the bigger Liston, who is still small in comparison to Bowe. I think you are forgetting that Riddick was also very talented for such a big guy. Good speed, hard punch and stamina when he wanted. Patterson was way too fragile and small to be a threat to Bowe. Inside 3 rds, If Liston could do it, then Bowe could certainly do it....size damn well matters in this particular match

heartandsoulofboxing · Post by **heartandsoulofboxing** » 20 Oct 2005, 06:01

bowe is too big. he destroys patterson.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 20 Oct 2005, 07:21

It took Riddick Bowe 6 rounds to KO Herbie Hide...

It's not about how weak your chin is. It's about styles.

Herbie gave Riddick Bowe a tough time in the early rounds.

Patterson is much better than Herbie Hide.

Assuming you're talking prime for prime, this fight could really go any way. Both fighters could get knocked out, both fighters could win/lose a decision.

I don't lean towards either.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 20 Oct 2005, 07:41

Tantum wrote:It took Riddick Bowe 6 rounds to KO Herbie Hide...

It's not about how weak your chin is. It's about styles.

Herbie gave Riddick Bowe a tough time in the early rounds.

Patterson is much better than Herbie Hide.

Assuming you're talking prime for prime, this fight could really go any way. Both fighters could get knocked out, both fighters could win/lose a decision.

I don't lean towards either.

But Herbie is one of the most fearsome punchers in HW history. He may be small, but he punches like hell. Patterson had underrated power, but he was nowhere near as powerful as Hide.

Bowe would have walked through him.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 20 Oct 2005, 07:47

Good Points you've made Seamus in the Liston vs Bowe discussion, the only counterbalancing arguement is that Liston faced (in my estimation) tougher competition even factoring in weight.......which I think trumps your other arguements.

However there is no debate that either takes care of Floyd in roughly the same manner.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 20 Oct 2005, 08:16

Syntax Error wrote:But Herbie is one of the most fearsome punchers in HW history. He may be small, but he punches like hell. Patterson had underrated power, but he was nowhere near as powerful as Hide.

Knocking out a fat, 40 year old Tony Tucker does not a great puncher make.

Every time Floyd downed someone, it looked devastating and impressive.

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 20 Oct 2005, 19:11

i dont think riddick bowe is anywhere near as good as sonny liston...this is kind of like the comparison that i saw a bit back, the arguement was that vitali klitscho would own joe frazier because big george did the same ting, and both vitali and goerge were bigger. Sonny liston was different that bowe because he was way more talented. granted bowe experienced success on the inside, but i dont think floyd would let bowe get close and bowe would probly get caught hasing floyd around. ill stick by my choice. floyd patterson late round KO or UD. give me ur best shots im sticking with this choice i dont care how big bowe is