Dangerous statement from AIBA?

[Tarquin Tarpaulin V]

According to the wall Street Journal AIBA have banned headgear to reduce concussions.

Statements made by Dr Charles Butler on AIBA's behalf would surely be torn apart by any decent lawyer?

To suggest that a 19 year old senior male boxer who, according to AIBA's latest rules would still have to wear a headguard, is incapable of producing a concussive punch is ludicrous. (Chronological and Biological age are two completely separate things)

To suggest that removal of headguards for elite boxers is a decision taken on health and safety grounds would only hold water if AIBA compound their belief and insist that headguards are not worn in sparring.

Such statements, without solid medical and scientific evidence stand to make amateur boxing administrators a laughing stock.




From the WSJ Online

There has been limited research to support this change, but fresh data, still unpublished, suggests the removal of headgear in elite, male amateur boxing reduces the incidence of concussion, according to the chairman of the AIBA medical commission, Charles Butler, a retired cardiac surgeon and ringside doctor, who spearheaded the study that served as part of the basis for the recommendation.

Concussion isn't much of an issue in women and younger fighters who often lack the strength to bring on concussions in competitors, and they should continue to wear headgear to protect themselves from cuts, according to Dr. Butler.

[scallum]

No headgear is gonna lead to more punch drunk fighters imo. Would u rather be hit in head with baseball bat with or without headgear?

[Adamj1987]

No headgear is gonna lead to more punch drunk fighters imo. Would u rather be hit in head with baseball bat with or without headgear?

no medical proof it stops concussions, in fact there has been more evidence to the contrary that it allows you to take more punches to the head getting greater amount of head chots over your lifetime increasing your chance of long term side effects like pugilistic dementia and punch related parkinsons. (i cant remember what journal it was from it was in the ring in the physisians column and it stated the journal there)

[Tarquin Tarpaulin IV]

The argument here is not whether or not headguards are a safety feature but that somebody who is 18 years and 11 months old is considered to be in a different risk group to a 19 year old.

[scallum]

No headgear is gonna lead to more punch drunk fighters imo. Would u rather be hit in head with baseball bat with or without headgear?

no medical proof it stops concussions, in fact there has been more evidence to the contrary that it allows you to take more punches to the head getting greater amount of head chots over your lifetime increasing your chance of long term side effects like pugilistic dementia and punch related parkinsons. (i cant remember what journal it was from it was in the ring in the physisians column and it stated the journal there)

I guess from that angle it does have a point, still I'm not going to allow my kid to fights Elite boxers at major Tournaments with no headgear, some kids will have to fight best of the best 3-5 times during one week. Imo this is just not a good idea. Be better turning pro at 18 and fight 3 - 5 times per year. How many fights yearly you think Elite Amateurs have on Avg 20-30?

[Adamj1987]

i agree with you, pro at 18 and less fights is the safer route overall i would think. the big shots arnt as well protected but theres less punches being landed overall so its probably 6 of 1 and half a dozen of the other. i think you're going to have people supporting and against the decision now matter what

[T Duquette]

Is it not clear that the headgears are being removed for marketing reasons? Anybody who is fooled by all of this bogus rhetoric probably should have worn their headgear more often when they were growing up.

To say that a 19 year old can't throw a punch with concussive force is clearly bogus.

[scallum]

Is it not clear that the headgears are being removed for marketing reasons? Anybody who is fooled by all of this bogus rhetoric probably should have worn their headgear more often when they were growing up.

To say that a 19 year old can't throw a punch with concussive force is clearly bogus.

I'm in debate in cs about this now, it is very clear why they want to remove headgear and it has nothing to do with safety lol

[T Duquette]

Is it not clear that the headgears are being removed for marketing reasons? Anybody who is fooled by all of this bogus rhetoric probably should have worn their headgear more often when they were growing up.

To say that a 19 year old can't throw a punch with concussive force is clearly bogus.

I'm in debate in cs about this now, it is very clear why they want to remove headgear and it has nothing to do with safety lol

Hey Scallum,

What do you mean by cs?

[scallum]

Is it not clear that the headgears are being removed for marketing reasons? Anybody who is fooled by all of this bogus rhetoric probably should have worn their headgear more often when they were growing up.

To say that a 19 year old can't throw a punch with concussive force is clearly bogus.

I'm in debate in cs about this now, it is very clear why they want to remove headgear and it has nothing to do with safety lol

Hey Scallum,

What do you mean by cs?

Current section on boxrec

[Boxerrealdeal]

New to the forum. I'm very concerned about AIBA's decision to remove headgear. Studies show headgear is an important part of personal safety equipment. I'll post some medical studies I found online.

[Boxerrealdeal]

Bianco M, Loosemore M, Daniel G, Palmieri V, Faina M, Zeppilli P. Amateur boxing in the last 59 years. Impact of rules changes on the type of verdicts recorded and implications on boxers’ health. Br J Sports Med doi:10.1136/bjsports-2012-091771

"In the last 59 years, improvements in health challenging verdicts recorded have been achieved by changes in the rules of boxing. It is of concern that the recent rule changes will be a backward step in athletes’ health safety."

"Several changes have occurred in the rules of amateur boxing in the last 59 years and modern Olympic boxing is a quite different sport from that observed in the early 1950s. Looking at the rate of results of medical interest, a clear and significant reduction of health challenging results can be observed. There is no doubt that modern amateur boxing is a safer discipline than observed some decades ago."

[Boxerrealdeal]

Another medical study, found off a Google search:

Bartsch AJ, Benzel EC, Miele VJ, et al. Boxing and mixed martial arts: preliminary traumatic neuromechanical injury risk analyses from laboratory impact dosage data. J Neurosurg 116:1070–1080, 2012.

"In our study, which replicated hook punches to the side of the head, results indicated that all padding conditions reduced linear impact dosage, including linear acceleration, GSI, neck force, and impact force. Our results suggest that head and neck impact dosages accumulate fastest in MMA and boxing conditions absent protective headgear."

"Of the 3 real-world conditions (MMA glove–bare head, boxing glove–bare head, and boxing glove–boxing headgear) studied, the boxing glove–boxing headgear condition had the most meaningful reduction in most of the parameters quantified and should provide the best overall head and neck injury protection for competitors."

[Boxerrealdeal]

Daneshvar DH, Baugh CM, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA, Cantu RC. Helmets and Mouth Guards: The Role of Personal Equipment in Preventing Sport-Related Concussions. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 30 (1), 145-163, January 2011.

"Protective headgear and helmets decrease the potential for severe TBI after a collision by reducing the acceleration of the head on impact, thereby decreasing the brain-skull collision and the sudden deceleration-induced axonal injury. The energy-absorbing material within a helmet accomplishes this by compressing to absorb force during the collision and slowly restoring to its original shape. This compression and restoration prolongs the duration of the collision and reduces the total momentum transferred to the head."

"In general, helmets work best when properly used. This means that the helmets must be sized appropriately and worn with all straps correctly fastened and all padding in the proper positioning."

"Neck strength may be important in minimizing the risk of concussion in response to an impact. Therefore, rule changes mandating neck strength training, education about proper tackling form including prohibiting spearing, and monitoring player fatigue is warranted."

"Although mouth guards have been shown to be effective in preventing dental and orofacial injury, there is currently no evidence that standard or fitted mouth guards decrease the rate or severity of concussions in athletes."

"The preponderance of evidence seems to indicate that helmets and mouth guards provide a significant benefit in protecting against many catastrophic head, neck, and orofacial injuries."

"Although newer equipment remains a promising potential tool in minimizing concussion severity and incidence, other methods such as rule changes, improved concussion education, and proper coaching and training may prove more effective in the immediate future."

[Boxerrealdeal]

Dau N., Chein H., et al., 2006. Effectiveness of Boxing Headgear for Limiting Injury. American Society of Biomechanics.

"The utilization of boxing headgear significantly reduces the peak punch force delivered to an opponent. In addition, both angular and linear acceleration values are decreased when the headgear is in place. Thus, the resulting HIC is also diminished for the hook punch. Based on the current effort, the currently designed headgear and gloves are effective in reducing the risk of injury."

[Boxerrealdeal]

The 5th medical study. There are others, but this shows that there are plenty of published studies supporting the use of headgear for boxers. Couldn't find any studies arguing to remove headgear.

McCrory P, Falvey, E, Turner M. Returning to the golden age of boxing Br. J. Sports. Med. 2012;46:7 459-460

"Why fight without headgear?
Amateur boxers in these new competitions will fight without headgear. The categories that will have to continue to use headgear will be women, youth and juniors. No rationale is provided for this distinction as to why some groups will wear helmets and some not. It is inevitable that the removal of headgear goes with the more aggressive style of boxing as seen in professional fighting. This in turn will mean more injuries to participants that seem to go against the Olympic ideal of amateurs striving for athletic greatness rather than the rewards of the prize ring."

"As discussed above, what little published evidence exists actually supports helmets as a means of reducing impact to the brain and presumably brain injury resulting from boxing. Rather than fundamentally changing the amateur rules and possibly increasing injury risk by discarding helmets, it would seem more appropriate to encourage and publish independent research into the protective effects of helmets, gloves, mouth guards and rule changes in line with the developments in other sports before a change is made. Furthermore, it is a great pity that AIBA has not demonstrated ongoing engagement with the mainstream international sports concussion groups (eg, the CISG group)10 developing guidelines and recommendations for sport to protect athletes."

"Although the overall aim of the new focus by AIBA to amalgamate the various types of boxing under a single jurisdiction is praiseworthy; why AIBA sanctioned boxing would want to move towards a professional model of boxing with the likely higher acute injury rates (eg, concussion) seems intuitively counterproductive. At the very time that increased media and medical scrutiny of high-risk sports (with the potential for brain injury) exists and the increasing litigation and regulation for injured athletes, this move makes little sense. "

[T Duquette]

The 5th medical study. There are others, but this shows that there are plenty of published studies supporting the use of headgear for boxers. Couldn't find any studies arguing to remove headgear.

McCrory P, Falvey, E, Turner M. Returning to the golden age of boxing Br. J. Sports. Med. 2012;46:7 459-460

"Why fight without headgear?
Amateur boxers in these new competitions will fight without headgear. The categories that will have to continue to use headgear will be women, youth and juniors. No rationale is provided for this distinction as to why some groups will wear helmets and some not. It is inevitable that the removal of headgear goes with the more aggressive style of boxing as seen in professional fighting. This in turn will mean more injuries to participants that seem to go against the Olympic ideal of amateurs striving for athletic greatness rather than the rewards of the prize ring."

"As discussed above, what little published evidence exists actually supports helmets as a means of reducing impact to the brain and presumably brain injury resulting from boxing. Rather than fundamentally changing the amateur rules and possibly increasing injury risk by discarding helmets, it would seem more appropriate to encourage and publish independent research into the protective effects of helmets, gloves, mouth guards and rule changes in line with the developments in other sports before a change is made. Furthermore, it is a great pity that AIBA has not demonstrated ongoing engagement with the mainstream international sports concussion groups (eg, the CISG group)10 developing guidelines and recommendations for sport to protect athletes."

"Although the overall aim of the new focus by AIBA to amalgamate the various types of boxing under a single jurisdiction is praiseworthy; why AIBA sanctioned boxing would want to move towards a professional model of boxing with the likely higher acute injury rates (eg, concussion) seems intuitively counterproductive. At the very time that increased media and medical scrutiny of high-risk sports (with the potential for brain injury) exists and the increasing litigation and regulation for injured athletes, this move makes little sense. "

Good stuff. Anybody who believes their nonsense is a moron.

[T Duquette]

AIBA, I mean

[boxmel]

I'm very concerned that the instances of cuts will jump from practically nothing to too many. Guess the boxers will be allowed to have cuts treated with any substance that allows them to not get RSC'd from tournaments but are able to box the next day. I don't like most of the new rules at all. It is my belief that most boxers will turn pro at 18 and box without headgear for money. Why should an elite athlete stick around and subject himself to possible concussions, cuts, cauliflower ears for nothing?

[scallum]

Exactly my thinking Boxmel

[T Duquette]

Spot on Mel!

[ABC BOXING]

DON'T WORRY AQBOUT CUTS AND HEAD CLASHES FOR YOUR YOUNG AMATEURS THEY WILL NEVER MAKE OLYMPICS. JUST LIKE ALL THE YOUNG BASKETBALL PLAYERS FROM COLLEGE NEVER CAN DREAM OLYMPICS. SAD BUT THE FUTURE IS CLOSE THANKS TO YOU FAVORITE AIBA
http://www.fightnews.com/Boxing/klitsch ... ore-187817

[boxmel]

Such BS! IF AIBA makes an exception for Klitscho, amateur boxing as we know it is doomed. And it's well on its way now. :(

[Tarquin Tarpaulin IV]

http://boxingaction.com/index.php/profe ... -a-iba-wsb

[yu265545]

Mel, it seems you were dead on. Here is the quote re Diego De La Hoya from Fightnews:

"Diego narrowly missed the opportunity to fight in the 2012 Olympics in London, losing a close fight to now professional standout Oscar Valdez. Diego’s subsequent plan, which included a bid for the 2016 games in Rio, was scrapped when changes were made to the AIBA rules, disallowing head gear. “If I’m going to fight without head gear, I might as well get paid for it,” said Diego on going pro."

I don't like most of the new rules at all. It is my belief that most boxers will turn pro at 18 and box without headgear for money. Why should an elite athlete stick around and subject himself to possible concussions, cuts, cauliflower ears for nothing?