The problem for young prospect - John Thain

[dalcumly]

I feel that Edinburgh's John Thain along with John Slowey and Ronnie Clarke are Scotland's future after Ricky Burns hangs up his gloves. Slowey and Clarke are controlled by Scottish based management and promoters and those people have a close interest in ensuring that their fighters are maneouvered into positions to allow challenges to be made for a British title somewhere down the line.
However, John Thain is in a different position. I think I'm correct in saying that his management and promotional control lies in England under him who cannot be mentioned in this forum. Thain has had 2 fights since September, his last in London on the Nathan Cleverley bill. He is not progressing. He's not having enough fights and I can't see him being able to fight in Scotland because 'you know who' is unlikely to work with any of the major promoters here. This means that he can't build up a fanbase, or any momentum in terms of his prospects in the future.
Thain's next logical step is a 'fight off' with fellow Scot Kris Carslaw. A fight which would top the bill and prove an eliminator of sorts for a British title challenge. It's simply not going to happen, and that's a wasted opportunity for both boxers to earn good money, and the boxing public in Scotland to see a really good contest.
I don't know how Thain can sort out this mess, but at 25 he needs to make a move now. I do rate him highly.

[iamasadlittleboy]

Am I the only one who can't understand Thain? He's like a less talented Bradley Skeete, both are given a big vocal build up, lack power and have VERY over rated skills. His problem is that he isn't as good as he's being made out to be.

[expe]

I feel that Edinburgh's John Thain along with John Slowey and Ronnie Clarke are Scotland's future after Ricky Burns hangs up his gloves. Slowey and Clarke are controlled by Scottish based management and promoters and those people have a close interest in ensuring that their fighters are maneouvered into positions to allow challenges to be made for a British title somewhere down the line.
However, John Thain is in a different position. I think I'm correct in saying that his management and promotional control lies in England under him who cannot be mentioned in this forum. Thain has had 2 fights since September, his last in London on the Nathan Cleverley bill. He is not progressing. He's not having enough fights and I can't see him being able to fight in Scotland because 'you know who' is unlikely to work with any of the major promoters here. This means that he can't build up a fanbase, or any momentum in terms of his prospects in the future.
Thain's next logical step is a 'fight off' with fellow Scot Kris Carslaw. A fight which would top the bill and prove an eliminator of sorts for a British title challenge. It's simply not going to happen, and that's a wasted opportunity for both boxers to earn good money, and the boxing public in Scotland to see a really good contest.
I don't know how Thain can sort out this mess, but at 25 he needs to make a move now. I do rate him highly.

If those three are Scotland's future then Scottish boxing is fucked.

[dalcumly]

Very intelligent and well thought out comment from expe.
One of the reasons I joined this Forum was to have discussions and views on boxing from like minded fans but to be honest I'm thinking about avoiding the whole thing due to comments like this. I don't mind if reasons are given and they conflict with mine because none of us have all the answers but the language is totally unneccessary.

[expe]

Very intelligent and well thought out comment from expe.
One of the reasons I joined this Forum was to have discussions and views on boxing from like minded fans but to be honest I'm thinking about avoiding the whole thing due to comments like this. I don't mind if reasons are given and they conflict with mine because none of us have all the answers but the language is totally unneccessary.

Fair enough, maybe was a bit harsh, but if that's all Scottish boxing has then it doesn't look good, Thain and Slowey have no power, 1 KO in 23 fights between them and journeymen have been able to take rounds off them. Ronnie Clark has only had 4 fights over 3 minute rounds and has only won 2 and his only notable win is over Tommy Edwards who had struggled past journey men in his 3 other fights.
There are some decent fighters in Scotland like Kenny Anderson, John Simpson, Stephen Simmons, Gary Cornish, Paul Appleby, Iain Butcher and Craig McEwan, if we're talking about the future of Scottish boxing, surely these would be better names to consider.

[Emmseegee]

Kenny Anderson - good fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
John Simpson - great fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
Stephen Simmons - looks decent, not had a proper test yet
Gary Cornish - seriously?
Paul Appleby - not got much left i dont think
Iain Butcher - early days
Craig McEwan - probably got as long left as burns

Kris Carslaw would do well if he dropped a weight in my opinion and would probably beat Thain if they were too meet just now.

Ronnie Clark deserves credit for his "fight the world" attitude but again aint had proper tests yet.

Michael Roberts still looking good aswell so scotland hasnt exactly got a shortage of fighters!

[expe]

Kenny Anderson - good fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
John Simpson - great fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
Stephen Simmons - looks decent, not had a proper test yet
Gary Cornish - seriously?
Paul Appleby - not got much left i dont think
Iain Butcher - early days
Craig McEwan - probably got as long left as burns

Kris Carslaw would do well if he dropped a weight in my opinion and would probably beat Thain if they were too meet just now.

Ronnie Clark deserves credit for his "fight the world" attitude but again aint had proper tests yet.

Michael Roberts still looking good aswell so scotland hasnt exactly got a shortage of fighters!

Anderson and Simpson are too old, Simmons is fighting Michael Sweeney next week, so that's his first test, Cornish has beaten everyone in front of him and 6'7 Heavyweights should do ok, he's not going to be a world champion, but could maybe win a British title. Appleby might have a couple of fights left in him, but he has been in a few tough fights and Butcher is fighting for the British title in July. Just checked and McEwan is about 5 years older than I thought he was, I think he'll be finished by the end of next year.

Like Thain and Slowey, Roberts lacks power and while Clark seems up for fighting anyone he doesn't seem to understand that he can't just walk straight to title level and has to win a few fights first to get there.

[geoffburt07]

Kenny Anderson - good fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
John Simpson - great fighter but already too old to be the future of scottish boxing
Stephen Simmons - looks decent, not had a proper test yet
Gary Cornish - seriously?
Paul Appleby - not got much left i dont think
Iain Butcher - early days
Craig McEwan - probably got as long left as burns

Kris Carslaw would do well if he dropped a weight in my opinion and would probably beat Thain if they were too meet just now.

Ronnie Clark deserves credit for his "fight the world" attitude but again aint had proper tests yet.

Michael Roberts still looking good aswell so scotland hasnt exactly got a shortage of fighters!

Anderson and Simpson are too old, Simmons is fighting Michael Sweeney next week, so that's his first test, Cornish has beaten everyone in front of him and 6'7 Heavyweights should do ok, he's not going to be a world champion, but could maybe win a British title. Appleby might have a couple of fights left in him, but he has been in a few tough fights and Butcher is fighting for the British title in July. Just checked and McEwan is about 5 years older than I thought he was, I think he'll be finished by the end of next year.

Like Thain and Slowey, Roberts lacks power and while Clark seems up for fighting anyone he doesn't seem to understand that he can't just walk straight to title level and has to win a few fights first to get there.

For a start the reason Cornish has beaten everyone he's boxed is that he's boxing cruiserweights

[turbostar]

Cornish has beaten everyone in front of him and 6'7 Heavyweights should do ok, he's not going to be a world champion, but could maybe win a British title.

Oh come on. Seriously? Cornish is so badly schooled, he makes basic errors that guys who have only been boxing a few months don't make. He has size and power, that's it. He's an area level fighter who won't win an area belt until another Scottish HW pops up. The likes of Sprott, Sexton, McDermott would all destroy him. Hughie Fury, who is only 18 and of a similar build to Cornish, is already so much more well schooled and relaxed in the ring than him. No way does he get to British title level. He's on a similar level to someone like Dallas.

As for the fighters listed: only Butcher, Anderson and Simmons are/will be British title level. Anderson could be a Euro level fighter, that's as far as he'll go.

[magnus]

To be fair to Ronnie Clark, I would certainly call travelling to Norwich to fight Ryan Walsh, with only a few contests under his belt, a "test".

[daviddee]

To be fair to Ronnie Clark, I would certainly call travelling to Norwich to fight Ryan Walsh, with only a few contests under his belt, a "test".

He also fought Maxi Hughes in Doncaster!! He has fought 3 undefeated fighters and could easily be 9-0 and would have been if those fights were in Scotland.. He took fights on few days notice against good kids. Behind Burns he is the next big thing up here and he is still improving all the time.. He has the power that unfortunately a lot of our prospects may not have.. I hope he can get the tests he need to get him to show what level he is at. Jon Slowey is a talented kid seen him a couple if times and works so hard excellent boxer depends what weight he ends up at to see how fair he will go and John Thain is a hard one he is very talented but that lack of power is already causing problems!! In my opinion these 3 are the best behind Burns at the minute we should get behind them all

[billy nelson]

I feel that Edinburgh's John Thain along with John Slowey and Ronnie Clarke are Scotland's future after Ricky Burns hangs up his gloves. Slowey and Clarke are controlled by Scottish based management and promoters and those people have a close interest in ensuring that their fighters are maneouvered into positions to allow challenges to be made for a British title somewhere down the line.
However, John Thain is in a different position. I think I'm correct in saying that his management and promotional control lies in England under him who cannot be mentioned in this forum. Thain has had 2 fights since September, his last in London on the Nathan Cleverley bill. He is not progressing. He's not having enough fights and I can't see him being able to fight in Scotland because 'you know who' is unlikely to work with any of the major promoters here. This means that he can't build up a fanbase, or any momentum in terms of his prospects in the future.
Thain's next logical step is a 'fight off' with fellow Scot Kris Carslaw. A fight which would top the bill and prove an eliminator of sorts for a British title challenge. It's simply not going to happen, and that's a wasted opportunity for both boxers to earn good money, and the boxing public in Scotland to see a really good contest.
I don't know how Thain can sort out this mess, but at 25 he needs to make a move now. I do rate him highly.

The person with the best chance in Scotland is Steve Simmons by a mile mate

[billy nelson]

To be fair to Ronnie Clark, I would certainly call travelling to Norwich to fight Ryan Walsh, with only a few contests under his belt, a "test".

He also fought Maxi Hughes in Doncaster!! He has fought 3 undefeated fighters and could easily be 9-0 and would have been if those fights were in Scotland.. He took fights on few days notice against good kids. Behind Burns he is the next big thing up here and he is still improving all the time.. He has the power that unfortunately a lot of our prospects may not have.. I hope he can get the tests he need to get him to show what level he is at. Jon Slowey is a talented kid seen him a couple if times and works so hard excellent boxer depends what weight he ends up at to see how fair he will go and John Thain is a hard one he is very talented but that lack of power is already causing problems!! In my opinion these 3 are the best behind Burns at the minute we should get behind them all

and to be fair ronnie beat maxi IMO but maxi just got beat at area level albeit at light weight, I think ronnies a good fighter but to say he's the 2nd best boxer in Scotland would be wrong.
Your forgetting David Brophy who's on Ricky's show in a real good test against Gary Boulden credit to him for taking a good test so early in his career

[billy nelson]

John Thani is a excellent boxer,power isn't everything just look at Ricky up to 18 months ago he won most of his fight by using his skill set something John will need to ,so all the best to him for the future.
And one of the nicest guys you will ever meet!

[daviddee]

That's my opinion same as your opinion about Steve Simmons I don't agree with that!! Ricky was able to keep people off him if John can do that he will go very far.. At the minute there may be boxers in Scotland a little ahead but he has everything needed fast hands.. Big puncher and a good chin if he keeps improving the way he is he will get above British level

[iamasadlittleboy]

John Thani is a excellent boxer,power isn't everything just look at Ricky up to 18 months ago he won most of his fight by using his skill set something John will need to ,so all the best to him for the future.
And one of the nicest guys you will ever meet!

Why doesn't he show this "excellent" boxing in the ring? If he was so good he'd have shown something in his televised bouts to suggest it though at the moment he's really not blowing people watching away with his skill

Sure he "could" replicate Ricky but lets be honest when Ricky was winning his early bouts he was still very young, John is what, 25 now? Ricky at the same age was at a much more advanced stage in his career.

Of course you could counter and Say John has only had 10 bouts but it was around that mark that Burns beat Earl.

He may well be a lovely guy but there is something about nice guys finishing last.

[billy nelson]

John Thani is a excellent boxer,power isn't everything just look at Ricky up to 18 months ago he won most of his fight by using his skill set something John will need to ,so all the best to him for the future.
And one of the nicest guys you will ever meet!

Why doesn't he show this "excellent" boxing in the ring? If he was so good he'd have shown something in his televised bouts to suggest it though at the moment he's really not blowing people watching away with his skill

Sure he "could" replicate Ricky but lets be honest when Ricky was winning his early bouts he was still very young, John is what, 25 now? Ricky at the same age was at a much more advanced stage in his career.

Of course you could counter and Say John has only had 10 bouts but it was around that mark that Burns beat Earl.

He may well be a lovely guy but there is something about nice guys finishing last.

Mate like any sports person you can have the odd bad night at work, the thing is knowing John he will learn big time from mistakes and keep progressing