will staying in the amateurs too long ruin you as a pro?

[n1ebf]

looked at the thread on "when will Joshua fight Audley" and it got me thinking...

Why is it that you can be on the amateur scene for years (be a "someone") but then when you turn pro people start talking about you like a complete novice likely to put your gloves on back to front if you're not watched. I've seen good standard ABA contestants just fall off the map after a few pro-fights. Tell me what I'm missing?

Good/ Brilliant amateur becomes good/ brilliant pro (De La Hoya, Wayne McCulloch....I'm being lazy here, there's thousands)

Good amateurs who turn over and then have nightmares and/ or disappear very quickly or turn into journeymen (I'm sure you can think of plenty)

then you have a third category, average or very short amateur career - goes on to be better than everybody expected. These types sometimes end up boxing for domestic or even World titles, with hardly any amateur experience (like a Johnny Nelson or a Matthew Hatton - again, there's hundreds of 'em).

[keithmoonhangover]

looked at the thread on "when will Joshua fight Audley" and it got me thinking...

Why is it that you can be on the amateur scene for years (be a "someone") but then when you turn pro people start talking about you like a complete novice likely to put your gloves on back to front if you're not watched. I've seen good standard ABA contestants just fall off the map after a few pro-fights. Tell me what I'm missing?

Good/ Brilliant amateur becomes good/ brilliant pro (De La Hoya, Wayne McCulloch....I'm being lazy here, there's thousands)

Good amateurs who turn over and then have nightmares and/ or disappear very quickly or turn into journeymen (I'm sure you can think of plenty)

then you have a third category, average or very short amateur career - goes on to be better than everybody expected. These types sometimes end up boxing for domestic or even World titles, with hardly any amateur experience (like a Johnny Nelson or a Matthew Hatton - again, there's hundreds of 'em).

Some fighters leave their best in the Ams. Like Mark Breland, IMO

[Newport Daz]

From what I've read, a lot of pro coaches in the US especially agree that staying an amateur too long can really stunt your growth as a pro. I 've read them say it has taken top amateurs a good couple of years to unlearn the bad habits they picked up from the ams.

I think as a general rule, the best pro's tend to have had a good amateur background. It'll be interesting to see how Lomochenko gets on tonight in 10 rounder for his debut against a tough opponent. His 396-1 record is incredible, but everyone says the ams and pro's are like night and day. Hopefully Lomochenko will be another RJJ/Delahoya rather than Errol Christie!

[n1ebf]

absolutely Keith. And some fighters pick up bad habits there - habits that do not serve them well later on. David the Beheader spending 15 minutes trying to spark Carl the Cat, as an old, but relevant example.

[n1ebf]

From what I've read, a lot of pro coaches in the US especially agree that staying an amateur too long can really stunt your growth as a pro. I 've read them say it has taken top amateurs a good couple of years to unlearn the bad habits they picked up from the ams.

I think as a general rule, the best pro's tend to have had a good amateur background. It'll be interesting to see how Lomochenko gets on tonight in 10 rounder for his debut against a tough opponent. His 396-1 record is incredible, but everyone says the ams and pro's are like night and day. Hopefully Lomochenko will be another RJJ/Delahoya rather than Errol Christie!

Agree Daz.......I'm embarrassed to say I only heard of this Lomochenko(?) guy quite recently on here, so I know nothing about him. That is an amazing record. It's easy to see how complacency could creep in.
The counter argument of course is a guy called Guillermo Rigondeaux. Loads of Am fights, now a world champ??

[Newport Daz]

From what I've read, a lot of pro coaches in the US especially agree that staying an amateur too long can really stunt your growth as a pro. I 've read them say it has taken top amateurs a good couple of years to unlearn the bad habits they picked up from the ams.

I think as a general rule, the best pro's tend to have had a good amateur background. It'll be interesting to see how Lomochenko gets on tonight in 10 rounder for his debut against a tough opponent. His 396-1 record is incredible, but everyone says the ams and pro's are like night and day. Hopefully Lomochenko will be another RJJ/Delahoya rather than Errol Christie!

Agree Daz.......I'm embarrassed to say I only heard of this Lomochenko(?) guy quite recently on here, so I know nothing about him. That is an amazing record. It's easy to see how complacency could creep in.
The counter argument of course is a guy called Guillermo Rigondeaux. Loads of Am fights, now a world champ??

Yeah, Rigo had an awesome record too, not quite as good as Lomochenko's but not far off. Bob arum is talking of matching Rigo and Lomochenko next year

http://www.BS.com/lomachenko-r ... 014--70513

Something like 700 am fights between them and a handful of losses, incredible. Will probably end up being a really boring technical fight though

[JC]

Some fighters leave their best in the Ams. Like Mark Breland, IMO

I think with Breland it was more a case that he was perfectly suited to the ams and maybe not strong and rugged enough to do the same in the pros.

In terms of leaving the best in the ams, I think the fact that guys like Solis and Gonzalez had had a lifetime's worth of fights by the time they turned over made it harder to stay motivated.

[lefty]

Some fighters leave their best in the Ams. Like Mark Breland, IMO

I think with Breland it was more a case that he was perfectly suited to the ams and maybe not strong and rugged enough to do the same in the pros.

In terms of leaving the best in the ams, I think the fact that guys like Solis and Gonzalez had had a lifetime's worth of fights by the time they turned over made it harder to stay motivated.

Breland has a crap chin, that was his problem. He had all the skill in the world but with that flaw it makes it tough.

[JC]

Some fighters leave their best in the Ams. Like Mark Breland, IMO

I think with Breland it was more a case that he was perfectly suited to the ams and maybe not strong and rugged enough to do the same in the pros.

In terms of leaving the best in the ams, I think the fact that guys like Solis and Gonzalez had had a lifetime's worth of fights by the time they turned over made it harder to stay motivated.

Breland has a crap chin, that was his problem. He had all the skill in the world but with that flaw it makes it tough.

Well that's pretty much what I meant when I said he wasn't rugged enough. But there are lots of factors that go into how well you take a shot. Breland never really filled out that long frame of his.