Some context to Groves' knockout of Smith

[lefty]

One thing I've noticed is how Groves naturally holds his head a little forward. I can see Carl landing the uppercut.[/quote]

You mean that right uppercut he throws from way back?

(Who had Ward beaten when he made the move up? Who had Dirrell beaten before he moved up?)

What do you mean?

[keithmoonhangover]

One thing I've noticed is how Groves naturally holds his head a little forward. I can see Carl landing the uppercut.[/quote]

You mean that right uppercut he throws from way back?

(Who had Ward beaten when he made the move up? Who had Dirrell beaten before he moved up?)

What do you mean?

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?

[palooka]

To me, the most important thing is this. Froch has proved (in sparring) that he can knock Groves over. That was just sparring and I'm pretty sure of two things. 1. Carl didn't hit George as hard as he can. 2. Groves will have been given time to recover.

If Carl lands on Saturday night with a harder shot than he did in sparring, then surely Groves is in big trouble.

And that's the thing that both McCracken and Fitzpatrick have said has very little bearing on the bout; you have to remember that some boxers spar for technique and some go to take liberties; Hatton used to get bashed about regularly in sparring and he wasn't so bothered as long as he continued to improve the technique he was working on. Some fighters are awful in the gym and shine on fight night, others fantastic in the gym and fold in the lights.

[lefty]

To me, the most important thing is this. Froch has proved (in sparring) that he can knock Groves over. That was just sparring and I'm pretty sure of two things. 1. Carl didn't hit George as hard as he can. 2. Groves will have been given time to recover.

If Carl lands on Saturday night with a harder shot than he did in sparring, then surely Groves is in big trouble.

And that's the thing that both McCracken and Fitzpatrick have said has very little bearing on the bout; you have to remember that some boxers spar for technique and some go to take liberties; Hatton used to get bashed about regularly in sparring and he wasn't so bothered as long as he continued to improve the technique he was working on. Some fighters are awful in the gym and shine on fight night, others fantastic in the gym and fold in the lights.

I remembering him saying how he was getting his backside handed to him in sparring prior to the Pacquaio fight......

[palooka]

You mean that right uppercut he throws from way back?

(Who had Ward beaten when he made the move up? Who had Dirrell beaten before he moved up?)[/quote][/quote]
What do you mean?[/quote]

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?[/quote]

It's not that much of a handicap; I've got small hands.

Many people are saying that Froch has 'infinintly more experience' than Groves; I was trying to make the point that some boxers are at a level below their ability and when the chance comes they fit right in - Ward in particular - and didn't he get dropped heavily v Boone? Is Ward chinny?

[palooka]

To me, the most important thing is this. Froch has proved (in sparring) that he can knock Groves over. That was just sparring and I'm pretty sure of two things. 1. Carl didn't hit George as hard as he can. 2. Groves will have been given time to recover.

If Carl lands on Saturday night with a harder shot than he did in sparring, then surely Groves is in big trouble.

And that's the thing that both McCracken and Fitzpatrick have said has very little bearing on the bout; you have to remember that some boxers spar for technique and some go to take liberties; Hatton used to get bashed about regularly in sparring and he wasn't so bothered as long as he continued to improve the technique he was working on. Some fighters are awful in the gym and shine on fight night, others fantastic in the gym and fold in the lights.

I remembering him saying how he was getting his backside handed to him in sparring prior to the Pacquaio fight......[/quote]

Hatton never went out of his way to win spars, he was there to practice set moves and technique - he put a lot of the Manny defeat down to peaking early and overtraining. Lets not confuse Froch with Pacquaio good as he is.

[keithmoonhangover]

You mean that right uppercut he throws from way back?

(Who had Ward beaten when he made the move up? Who had Dirrell beaten before he moved up?)

[/quote]
What do you mean?[/quote]

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?[/quote]

It's not that much of a handicap; I've got small hands.

Many people are saying that Froch has 'infinintly more experience' than Groves; I was trying to make the point that some boxers are at a level below their ability and when the chance comes they fit right in - Ward in particular - and didn't he get dropped heavily v Boone? Is Ward chinny?[/quote]

I don't know if he's chinny, buy I know he's the best supermiddle weight on the planet. Froch has fought much better opponents than Groves has. He's also fought better than Groves.

I've heard, through a friend of a friend etc. That Froch was holding back when he sparred Groves. One thing about sparring (and I've done my fair share of it) is that the chin doesn't lie. If you're down in sparring, you can go down in a real fight.

[lefty]

You mean that right uppercut he throws from way back?

(Who had Ward beaten when he made the move up? Who had Dirrell beaten before he moved up?)

What do you mean?[/quote]

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?[/quote]

It's not that much of a handicap; I've got small hands.

Many people are saying that Froch has 'infinintly more experience' than Groves; I was trying to make the point that some boxers are at a level below their ability and when the chance comes they fit right in - Ward in particular - and didn't he get dropped heavily v Boone? Is Ward chinny?[/quote]

I don't know if he's chinny, buy I know he's the best supermiddle weight on the planet. Froch has fought much better opponents than Groves has. He's also fought better than Groves.

I've heard, through a friend of a friend etc. That Froch was holding back when he sparred Groves. One thing about sparring (and I've done my fair share of it) is that the chin doesn't lie. If you're down in sparring, you can go down in a real fight.[/quote]
Same goes for people who tend to of suffered a stoppage losses in the amateurs aswell.

[Monte Fisto]

Groves does hit like a mule. But in context, Groves hits 10-20% harder than Froch. Froch's chin is 100% better than Groves'

That means it's twice as 'granite'; Groves will have to hit it twice then.

He's going to. In the first round. With right hands.

great shout. cracking up
that was the potentially the most painful piece of his pre-fight antics

[palooka]

Anthony Farnell v Takaloo

Takaloo v Wayne Alexander

[lefty]

We'll find out tommorow either way! To be honest, im just not sure that Groves would beat some of the people Froch has already beaten. Im definietly not convinced he'd beat Dirrell, Kessler im not sure about and even Bute. I think Groves is talented for sure but I think some are over selling how good he is.

[SamWise72]

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?

It's not that much of a handicap; I've got small hands.

Many people are saying that Froch has 'infinintly more experience' than Groves; I was trying to make the point that some boxers are at a level below their ability and when the chance comes they fit right in - Ward in particular - and didn't he get dropped heavily v Boone? Is Ward chinny?[/quote]

Cracking comeback, I'm keeping that one

You're right about the experience, of course; Groves could well step up. I just don't think he will; the styles, for me, don't gel very well, and the only thing you can really do is weigh up the actual evidence of the fights the fighters have had. For that reason, Froch for me. I will be more than surprised if I'm wrong, but I'll also be much more of a Groves believer. What a coming out party that would be! He wins this, and I'll believe he can beat anyone but Ward.

[lefty]

Yeah Palooka, you small penised man, what do you mean?

It's not that much of a handicap; I've got small hands.

Many people are saying that Froch has 'infinintly more experience' than Groves; I was trying to make the point that some boxers are at a level below their ability and when the chance comes they fit right in - Ward in particular - and didn't he get dropped heavily v Boone? Is Ward chinny?

Cracking comeback, I'm keeping that one

You're right about the experience, of course; Groves could well step up. I just don't think he will; the styles, for me, don't gel very well, and the only thing you can really do is weigh up the actual evidence of the fights the fighters have had. For that reason, Froch for me. I will be more than surprised if I'm wrong, but I'll also be much more of a Groves believer. What a coming out party that would be! He wins this, and I'll believe he can beat anyone but Ward.[/quote]
You think Groves would beat Andre Dirrell?

[SamWise72]

No. I meant IF he wins this, then I'd pick him over the rest.

[keithmoonhangover]

I think Groves is talented for sure but I think some are over selling how good he is.

I agree mate. Styles make fights and as the Smith fight proved, Groves can be hit with the right hand and hurt. Unless Froch ages overnight, I can't see any chance of Groves winning.

[handsofstone]

Does anyone know Carl,s KO% after 19 fights :?? :?? :?? ,im sure it would have been very simalar to Groves,Froch knockouts have came down significantly since he,s been at world level so i dont really believe George to be the bigger puncher,its just that he,s been stopping most people at a lower level,as did Froch

[keithmoonhangover]

Does anyone know Carl,s KO% after 19 fights :?? :?? :?? ,im sure it would have been very simalar to Groves,Froch knockouts have came down significantly since he,s been at world level so i dont really believe George to be the bigger puncher,its just that he,s been stopping most people at a lower level,as did Froch

78.94%.

[expe]

Here's Froch, at a similar stage of his career, executing another otherwise durable domestic operator. Three one punch knockdowns. Lest we forget, he was considered a very concussive hitter at that point - I think this demonstrates that he hits just as hard as Groves at that level. Now, who do you think has the better chin?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gu5t41hr83w

That's a shocking stoppage, the round was over, let him go back to the corner and see how he is at the start of the next round.

[expe]

Smith is better than Hague. Groves would have stopped Hague in 2.

Ok, but Froch stopped him in 1. People are talking as though Groves is the second coming of Julian Jackson, and Froch is a featherfisted china chin. Froch was just as dangerous as Groves, when he was fighting that level of fighter, but he's also taken the bombs of some far better fighters with nary a wobble, where as Groves was on queer street against Smith (I reckon Smith would have put him down and maybe stopped him given another 30 seconds of round 1), and down against Anderson. This may not indicate the limit of his ability; plenty of fighters have little wobbles like that, but there's a lot more reason to doubt that Groves chin will hold up against Froch than the other way round.

Groves legs were steady against Smith, he walked onto, then covered up, blocked two punches, then calmly walked to the corner, waited for the stool and sat down.

[lefty]

Smith is better than Hague. Groves would have stopped Hague in 2.

Ok, but Froch stopped him in 1. People are talking as though Groves is the second coming of Julian Jackson, and Froch is a featherfisted china chin. Froch was just as dangerous as Groves, when he was fighting that level of fighter, but he's also taken the bombs of some far better fighters with nary a wobble, where as Groves was on queer street against Smith (I reckon Smith would have put him down and maybe stopped him given another 30 seconds of round 1), and down against Anderson. This may not indicate the limit of his ability; plenty of fighters have little wobbles like that, but there's a lot more reason to doubt that Groves chin will hold up against Froch than the other way round.

Groves legs were steady against Smith, he walked onto, then covered up, blocked two punches, then calmly walked to the corner, waited for the stool and sat down.

I slightly disagree. If that wasnt right at the end of the round, it would of been interesting.

[expe]

To be fair, what happened to Bute against Andrade was rather more than a gut check. Benn got stopped by a jab not because he was chinny, but because he gassed, believing he could knock anyone out without really boxing.

Groves recovery against Anderson is a good sign; it's hard to make much out of the Smith situation because the round ended straight away. Bute essentially got stretched, and got a very long count. So yes, ok, I'm happy Groves has had a gut check, but I still think that when you're assessing who might knock who out, I'll bet on the guy who faced Kessler, Abraham, Pascal and Taylor and won, rather than the guy who was wobbling against Paul Smith.

I think Bute was more exhausted than hurt myself. I watched it back the other day for the first time. He was hurt but he was absolutely knackered! I'm not sure how many 12 rounders he'd done going into that fight. Not just that but against a guy who doesnt stop coming.

He'd been 12 rounds 4 times and into the 10th, 11th and 12th round and it was his 13th scheduled 12 rounder in a row.

[handsofstone]

Does anyone know Carl,s KO% after 19 fights :?? :?? :?? ,im sure it would have been very simalar to Groves,Froch knockouts have came down significantly since he,s been at world level so i dont really believe George to be the bigger puncher,its just that he,s been stopping most people at a lower level,as did Froch

78.94%.

i know, i meant to ask how many KO,s he had,GG has 15 at this stage,im sure Carl will be near identical at that point