Joe Louis, his legacy?

[NYDominican]

The great "Brown Bomber" (Joe Louis). What do you think Joes legacy in professional boxing is?


How do you think Joe ranks all time in the heavyweight division?


Do you see Joe ranking somewhere in the top 15?


Top 10?


Or, top 5?



The respective numerical rank which you see Joe being at. ------- Why do you think Joe should be at that position?

[Giancarlo]

#1 at heavyweight

[drunkenpiper36]

I have him at #2 right behind Muhammad Ali, but have no problem with anyone who have them reversed. His legacy is his 26 title fight victories and the claim to have beaten at least six past, present, or current champions at heavyweight. I believe he also defeated around two or three light heavyweight champs as well. His combination punching ability is still to this day matched by none. A truly great tribute to the sport of boxing.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

#1 at heavyweight

Top 15 All time

[gilgamesh]

I have him #2, but similar to drunkenpiper if you reverse him or Ali I have no problem with it. He's definitely one of the very best heavyweights of all time and he's one of the all around best fighters of all time as well.

[Ambling Alp II]

The #2 heavyweight of All-Time. He is arguably in the top 10 of all fighters.

[BoxBuzz]

Everybody's top five? Aren't there a few of us who have that one guy....... UNOWHO on that list as well?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Everybody's top five? Aren't there a few of us who have that one guy....... UNOWHO on that list as well?

Dempsey & Jeffries aren't in my top 10. Marciano barely makes that. The only real definitive All time Heavyweight stuff is Ali & Louis at 1 & 2. I don't see a case for anyone else to crack that.

[Giancarlo]

[BoxBuzz]

Everybody's top five? Aren't there a few of us who have that one guy....... UNOWHO on that list as well?

My view of reality....


#1.... Jack Dempsey
#2.... Joe Louis
#3.... Larry Holmes
#4.... Rocky Marciano
#5.... James J. Jeffries

(The following is Buzz's assisted communication contribution to better clarify a reality other than my own)

* Jack Dempsey the most celebrated fighter in history, and arguably the most popular in his time.
* Joe Louis, was beaten, but nevertheless proved to be clearly one of the most technically adept with power, a complete fighter.
* Larry Holmes, A Very good fighter, beaten twice by his LHW contemporary.
* Rocky Marciano, He beat everyone. He has the big "0". Most folks with IQ that exceeds room temp will accept that he fought in a weak era. Others obsess on that very attractive "0".
* James J. Jeffries, a great physical specimen, and initially retired 'undefeated'. The 'one' comeback bout was his choice. And he got his clock cleaned
*UnoWho......I don't care for him much cuz of politics, and personal preferences and the like....so I don't give him respect, but I often speak to the fact that I don't terribly dislike him personally, it's just that in my opinion, he should never be praised, because he has had too much of that in his lifetime. It is my hope that I can balance the scale.

I had to do a little work Il Duce...but I think you're on track with this!

[BoxBuzz]

No....I clearly state that I am assisting. Not intending to practice medicine here.

Now....I think my assistance helped by increasing the factual content. Would you agree?

[BoxBuzz]

Yes, it was a solid Assist that you will be credited for.......

But........ 'U-NO-WHO' is no longer a Top 10 Heavyweight.

Too many controversial wins, and many poor performances.

Ah...so it's official? He's out of the top 10 listings...for the reasons you have shared?

Does this mean your work here is done?

[Crease]

Joe Louis has left behind him an exceptionally strong legacy. To my mind, I cannot see how anyone could fail to have him in their top three Heavyweight of all time.

So for me, he's a top 3 at minimum.

[Crease]

#1.... Jack Dempsey
#2.... Joe Louis
#3.... Larry Holmes
#4.... Rocky Marciano
#5.... James J. Jeffries

* Jack Dempsey the most awesome Heavyweight Champion 'fighter' ever.
* Joe Louis, technically retired as 'undefeated' in Championship bouts.
* Larry Holmes, only lost at the end of his career, several years past his prime.
* Rocky Marciano, should not be punished for a lack of quality Challengers. He beat everyone.
* James J. Jeffries, the physically strongest Champion ever, and retired 'undefeated'. The 'one' comeback bout was not his choice.

That's a bold statement to make. Can't see how that is accurate.

[elmersalsa]

The great Brown Bomber Joe Louis. One of the greatest boxing champions of any weight class. To me, he ranks second at heavyweight all time, behind the great Muhammad Ali
His 25 title defenses are still a world record. Too bad that after 1942, he did not had enough fights due to WWII. I ranked him at #9 all time pound per pound.

His defining fight was the anticipated rematch with Max Schmeling. The world stopped in that June 22, 1938 night at Yankee Stadium

[man]

Joe Louis has left behind him an exceptionally strong legacy. To my mind, I cannot see how anyone could fail to have him in their top three Heavyweight of all time.

So for me, he's a top 3 at minimum.

[Ambling Alp II]

He was fundamentally sound and had great power. Something that is impressive was that he such great composure. Even when things were going bad, he pulled out the victory. One overlooked fights of his was the the first one against Buddy Baer. He was knocked through the ropes. He calmly got back into the rings as if he didn't have a care in the world. He then went on to win.

[NYDominican]

Giancarlo and SaadOffTheDeck. --------


Regarding Joe Louis. Several of his statements regarding Rocky Marciano.


1. "Marciano was tough enough to beat anyone. He doesn't fight by the book, but he hit me with a whole library of bone crushers. This kid punches hard. I can still feel the body punches he hit me with. I had a bad weakness. I hated to be crowded. That was Marcianos thing".



2. "He had a hidden secret in his career. That he didn't like being crowded. That he felt that even in his prime, that he couldn't have won against Rocky Marciano".



3. "That all of the fighters which he was matched against, that Rocky would have won".




What Louis stated about Rocky, do you think that this carried a lot of validity?


Or, do you think that Joe was just being nice & respectful towards Rocky? That, deep down, Joe Louis did feel that he could have beaten Rocky Marciano?

[Crease]

What Louis stated about Rocky, do you think that this carried a lot of validity?

Absolutely, Joe had retired at that point and he had no reason to lie. I have read those statements before and they make sense to me, I think it was Al Weill who said that a younger Joe Louis would have got KO'd quicker because he would have come toward Rocky. I'm not sure if I agree with that part, Louis had excellent powers of recovery - but I just don't see him beating The Rock. And it's not just because of Rock'y power, it's his awkward style which gave Joe trouble.

[fanman]

joe louis, a credit to his race, the black race.

[evrenb]

To this day I have never seen a finisher like Louis. Deadly short , fast, accurate combinations. Awesom kayo power. He beat big and small. His average opponent weight was 203lbs which was high in that time. He beat tall, short, big, small. He could go 15 rounds. His title reign is unmatched at 25-0-22 ko's in title defenses.
The only reason I would put him below Ali is that he lost in his prime and Ali's quality of opposition was higher in my opinion.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Giancarlo and SaadOffTheDeck. --------


Regarding Joe Louis. Several of his statements regarding Rocky Marciano.


1. "Marciano was tough enough to beat anyone. He doesn't fight by the book, but he hit me with a whole library of bone crushers. This kid punches hard. I can still feel the body punches he hit me with. I had a bad weakness. I hated to be crowded. That was Marcianos thing".



2. "He had a hidden secret in his career. That he didn't like being crowded. That he felt that even in his prime, that he couldn't have won against Rocky Marciano".



3. "That all of the fighters which he was matched against, that Rocky would have won".




What Louis stated about Rocky, do you think that this carried a lot of validity?


Or, do you think that Joe was just being nice & respectful towards Rocky? That, deep down, Joe Louis did feel that he could have beaten Rocky Marciano?

Rocky was obviously a very strong man, but I absolutely think Louis was being respectful. There is also the feeling that an older fighter has that they still have their arsenal. I think Joe's jab alone would have ripped apart Marciano's face and I'd also take the Charles that Joe faced to beat him.

[NYDominican]

What Louis stated about Rocky, do you think that this carried a lot of validity?

Absolutely, Joe had retired at that point and he had no reason to lie. I have read those statements before and they make sense to me.

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Crease, your 5 points above. --------------- I see your angles.

[NYDominican]

I think it was Al Weill who said that a younger Joe Louis would have got KO'd quicker because he would have come toward Rocky.

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Rocky Marcianos trainer Charlie Goldman said "That a prime Joe Louis would have gotten knocked out much sooner".




That "Marciano did not want to hurt Louis and did not fight full force during those early rounds either".

[NYDominican]

I'm not sure if I agree with that part, Louis had excellent powers of recovery - but I just don't see him beating The Rock. And it's not just because of Rock'y power, it's his awkward style which gave Joe trouble.

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Okay.



So, you could see Rocky stopping Joe after the 8th round?



Or, Marciano beating Louis by a decision?