Welterweights: Thomas Hearns vs Jose "Mantequilla"

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 22 Nov 2005, 11:37

Who wins this match and why???

Gordon · Post by **Gordon** » 22 Nov 2005, 12:51

Thomas Hearns.

At 147lbs Hearns was a machine. How the hell SRL beat him is beyond belief. The man was just unreachable, He had this long reach that cut his opposition down from 6ft away.

I have watched Hearns most of his career and still believe he was at his best fighting at Welterweight.

enrique · Post by **enrique** » 22 Nov 2005, 13:18

Hearns by TKO or KO. Napoles could not cope with Monzon's long arms and Tommy was even bigger.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 22 Nov 2005, 13:25

I wouldn't count Napoles out... Monzon was far stronger than Hearns and a natural Middle.... at his best Jose was as good a boxer if not better than Leonard... he was also a great body puncher... I can see Napoles wearing Tommy down for late round ko win as long as he doesn't get cut up early...

zuru · Post by **zuru** » 22 Nov 2005, 16:17

enrique wrote:Hearns by TKO or KO. Napoles could not cope with Monzon's long arms and Tommy was even bigger.

I made this post awhile back.I think as long as Napoles avoids being cut(which may be hard)he easily wins.If Hearns thought Benitez was slick,he would have fits with the ultra-slick Napoles,who was also a good puncher,with good power,was strong,and had a very good chin.His only real flaw was the tender skin,which again against a sharp puncher like Hearns could be hazardous,
zuru

Steve M · Post by **Steve M** » 22 Nov 2005, 17:40

Hearns totally dominated Benitez.I had a hard time giving Wilfred more than a round or two.

Rory McCloskey · Post by **Rory McCloskey** » 22 Nov 2005, 17:59

i dont think it would be a massacre but ill take Hearns by mid round KO.. something like the 6 or 7 round

theone · Post by **theone** » 22 Nov 2005, 18:24

i dont think it would be a massacre but ill take Hearns by mid round KO.. something like the 6 or 7 round

Ditto. I think Napoles is too slick to get caught in the first few rounds.

enrique · Post by **enrique** » 22 Nov 2005, 20:34

Napoles was slick but he was more of a junior welter than welter. Even when he was the welter champ he could make 140. Being a Cuban as he even though I'm a hardcore nationalist, I don't think Napoles would beat Hearns who was dehydrating to the bone to struggle for 147 when he fought Leonard.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 23 Nov 2005, 07:05

enrique wrote:Napoles was slick but he was more of a junior welter than welter. Even when he was the welter champ he could make 140. Being a Cuban as he even though I'm a hardcore nationalist, I don't think Napoles would beat Hearns who was dehydrating to the bone to struggle for 147 when he fought Leonard.

Yeah but doesn't that make a case for Napoles wearing Hearns down for a late round ko. Napoles was very strong at 147 and I think Hearns stamina was stretched at 147 especially... Napoles has the skills to avoid most of Hearns bombs, ride out the early rounds and break Hearns down with his body shots imo.

tiredoldngrey · Post by **tiredoldngrey** » 24 Nov 2005, 18:52

Napoles beats him by ko around 7-9 or by wide decision though a late tko isn't unlikely. Napoles was not an easy man to hit and when in shape- in dream matches I assume everybody trained well for the fight- was brilliant and damn near unbeatable at 147. Hearns would box him like he did Leonard- Napoles punched as well as,if not better than Leonard I've read from many observers more astute than I, so Hearns would box. And he'd get cut off and banged to the body and eat the stiff jab of Napoles.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 24 Nov 2005, 19:14

tiredoldngrey wrote:Napoles beats him by ko around 7-9 or by wide decision though a late tko isn't unlikely. Napoles was not an easy man to hit and when in shape- in dream matches I assume everybody trained well for the fight- was brilliant and damn near unbeatable at 147. Hearns would box him like he did Leonard- Napoles punched as well as,if not better than Leonard I've read from many observers more astute than I, so Hearns would box. And he'd get cut off and banged to the body and eat the stiff jab of Napoles.

Glad we are in agreement!. I'm of the opinion that Napoles is generally very underrated, he was avoided for years and was a great fighter even before he won the title.... was probably at his peak when he won the title, he outclassed Emile Griffith in their fight and that say a lot about him. I'd give a peak Napoles a good chance against Leonard.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 24 Nov 2005, 23:59

I"m inclined to agree with Enrique, however if they were more evenly matched naturalyl size wise I could imagine the scenarios that Silkov and TiredGrey have articulated.

However I think the natural size difference works too much to Hearns Favor as it does in many peoples eyes with Duran as well. Good theoretical though and I agree he was underated by many.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 25 Nov 2005, 07:41

These are 2 of the greatest welters ever. I find it ahrd to call. On one hand the physical disparitys are so obvious. Napoles looks tiny in his bout woth Monzon and at WW always looks the smaller man. At the same time Napoles has the style to beat Hearns.

Napoles v Leonard would have been a great fight too.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 25 Nov 2005, 08:16

Napoles was 5 feet 7.... which isn't tiny for a Welter, but on the stocky side, but I don't think height means strength particularly... Hearns was a impressive welterweight I don't deny but I think if Napoles could get throught the first 10 rounds ok without getting badly cut then I feel his stamina and body punching would wear Tommy down for a ko in about 12 or 13 rounds. At his best Napoles was hard to his and threw tremendous combinations... a great box-fighter...... I see hims being too strong and slick for Hearns with his infighting being crucial.....

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 25 Nov 2005, 09:31

All the Napoles fights I've seen have him coming forward and stalking. He's got a good defense and, like you say, isn't easy to hit but Tommy's jab at this weight was exceptional.

I can see your scenario coming off but I can also see Hearns winning a decision. I accept I am biased a little towards Tommy but I still think he'd have wona rematch aganst Ray had they fougth again in their primes.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 25 Nov 2005, 09:42

Ezzard wrote:All the Napoles fights I've seen have him coming forward and stalking. He's got a good defense and, like you say, isn't easy to hit but Tommy's jab at this weight was exceptional.

I can see your scenario coming off but I can also see Hearns winning a decision. I accept I am biased a little towards Tommy but I still think he'd have wona rematch aganst Ray had they fougth again in their primes.

Could go either way perhaps, but my feeling is that Napoles stamina and body attack would be the edge for him. Napoles was at his best very busy, would bob his way in and throw combinations to body, had great jab too. I'd actually rate Napoles ahead of Leonard and think he'd put Hearns under more pressure than Leonard did.