Clint Magnum wrote:IMO Holyfield would always have had Tyson's number. Tyson just couldn't get into Holyfield's psyche & intimidate him. They'd known each other since their teens and sparred together quite a lot before reaching fame and by all accounts Evander always knew how to deal with Tyson's bully like persona from the start.
He wouldn't have been able to bully him.absolutely. he would've self destructed and the wheels already had come off vs douglas. could've suffered burn out after 2 scrappy but very physical fights with "razor" Ruddock.bripez wrote:By then the bubble had already burst and he had lost to Buster Douglas.
The myth / legend had gone, not only for opponents but also for Tyson himself.
I also believe that something was always going to happen, his lifestyle up to that point would indicate that something would go badly wrong sooner or later.
Yes, people often don't realise that Cus was far from Angelic, in his own way he used Mike just as much as the other people in his life. He was a paranoic, controlling and manipulative old man, who saw in Mike his ticket to everlasting fame. He'd been looking for a small, fast heavyweight since he handled Floyd Patterson.stevieb_8006 wrote:Idealists always spout "if cus had of lived......" cos they like the fairy tale. But mike would have broken the old mans heart at some point. also, cus wasn't the saint hes made out to be, he mind fucked mike quite a bit
jamesmcdonnell wrote:Yes, people often don't realise that Cus was far from Angelic, in his own way he used Mike just as much as the other people in his life. He was a paranoic, controlling and manipulative old man, who saw in Mike his ticket to everlasting fame. He'd been looking for a small, fast heavyweight since he handled Floyd Patterson.stevieb_8006 wrote:Idealists always spout "if cus had of lived......" cos they like the fairy tale. But mike would have broken the old mans heart at some point. also, cus wasn't the saint hes made out to be, he mind fucked mike quite a bit
Patterson had grown tired of fighting using Cus' 'system' because it took away the intuitive nature of the bout, and relied on countless hours of practising set routines - with numbers called out to represent chains of combinations.
Ultimately Patterson had enough, and Tyson would have done also - Cus dominated his fighters, and forced them into a highly effective but ultimately robotic and unfulfilling style of fighting.
good point. mike wasn't able to use his imagination. if he'd kept on doing the same thing, with rooney, it would've eventually gone wrong. his mind or his body would've rebelled. it looked great for a couple of years in Tyson's physical prime but all things change. sadly it wasn't until freddy roach got hold of Tyson, that Tyson was showing imaginative & fluid combinations...and then it was too late because his leg "went" vs danny Williams.jamesmcdonnell wrote:Yes, people often don't realise that Cus was far from Angelic, in his own way he used Mike just as much as the other people in his life. He was a paranoic, controlling and manipulative old man, who saw in Mike his ticket to everlasting fame. He'd been looking for a small, fast heavyweight since he handled Floyd Patterson.stevieb_8006 wrote:Idealists always spout "if cus had of lived......" cos they like the fairy tale. But mike would have broken the old mans heart at some point. also, cus wasn't the saint hes made out to be, he mind fucked mike quite a bit
Patterson had grown tired of fighting using Cus' 'system' because it took away the intuitive nature of the bout, and relied on countless hours of practising set routines - with numbers called out to represent chains of combinations.
Ultimately Patterson had enough, and Tyson would have done also - Cus dominated his fighters, and forced them into a highly effective but ultimately robotic and unfulfilling style of fighting.
In defence of Tyson, he encountered one of these top class super heavyweights in Tony Tucker. And TNT had a much, much better chin than either Lewis or Bowe. Tyson I thought was sensational in using timing to outjab a 6'5'' beast who was himself very durable and very fast.Autobarn wrote:- he'd've encountered top class "super heavyweights" earlier on, and something likely would've gone wrong vs a lewis or bowe.