Sparring tales and gym legends

[Controversial]

Most gym sessions can be taken with a pinch of salt but out of interest what stories have you heard? World class fighters knocked out by their sparring partner or just beaten up, any tales?

[dempseyfire]

I think all of the Heavyweight examples below have fair corroboration:

-Liston knocked down hard by Mac Foster

-Norton KO'd by Quarry

-Lennox KO'd by Brewster

-W. Klitschko KD'd by several journeyman level guys (Anuhanya is one)

-I remember either Kevin Johnson or Travis Walker knocked down Vitali prior to the aborted Rahman fight in sparring, although who knows how much his other physical issues affected that.

Of an older bent, with less corroboration:

-Jack Johnson getting knocked down by a young Gunboat Smith

-George Godfrey knocking down Jack Dempsey

-Elmer Ray knocking down Joe Louis

[Controversial]

Liston doesn't sound too great does he. Trouble with many of these is they get blown out of all proportion, like a fisherman's tale. Someone lands one decent punch and before you know it word is the other fighter was stretchered off, when it reality nothing really happened. Also if someone isn't in shape and training for a fight they are more than likely going to struggle for a bit if they are sparring with someone in good condition.

Any more?

[dr_devious]

Most gym sessions can be taken with a pinch of salt but out of interest what stories have you heard? World class fighters knocked out by their sparring partner or just beaten up, any tales?

Sonny Liston

* Young Jack Johnson 'manhandling' Sonny in Denver {July 1960}.

* Jimmy McCarter throwing Sonny out of the Ring. The Pines Training Camp, New York {July 1962}.
* Thad Spencer beating the tar out of Sonny in Las Vegas {July 1963}.

* Leotis Martin {Light Heavyweight at the time} doing a number on Sonny in Miami Beach {February 1964}.
* Amos 'Big Train' Lincoln stunning Sonny with right-hands several times in Maine {May 1965}.

* Ray Patterson 'dropping' Sonny in a session in Sweden {June 1966}.

* Mel Turnbow staggering and beating up Sonny in a session in Los Angeles {May 1968}
* Mac Foster dropping Sonny and having him 'out-on-his-feet' in an Oakland session in {July 1968}

* Gary Bates dropping Sonny in Las Vegas {December 1969}.

All of whom would have been totally smashed up by a peak Sonny, if indeed they are any more than rumours

[Nile4000]

Tony Ayala kicking Pipino Cuevas' butt.

Mitch Green beating Larry Holmes

Tony Tubbs beating Larry Holmes

Marlon Starling holding his own against Thomas Hearns, minimum, before losing the battle with a broken jaw.

Greg Page dropping Mike Tyson

Greg Page beating up Michael Spinks in 1985.

[muray]

I may be old (90), but my friend, journeyman heavyweight, Henry Cooper from Brownsville, Brooklyn, was fired from sparring with Max Schmeling while preparing for the 1936 fight with Joe Louis. The reporters could not tell who was who in the ring. Cooper gave Schmeling a real going over.

[Controversial]

I may be old (90), but my friend, journeyman heavyweight, Henry Cooper from Brownsville, Brooklyn, was fired from sparring with Max Schmeling while preparing for the 1936 fight with Joe Louis. The reporters could not tell who was who in the ring. Cooper gave Schmeling a real going over.

Nice. Good story, for a gent of your age have you seen many of the old time greats fighting in the flesh?

[Controversial]

Jimmy Ellis decked Ali twice in one round whilst sparring in 1977 in preparation for Ali to fight Earnie Shavers. Apparently the knockdowns were so severe Ali couldn't remember them and it was said he would've been counted out in a real fight and it resulted in an injury to Ali's neck. Ellis had been retired for 2 years.

"I didn't know where I was" Ali said afterwards.

"I'm sorry man you alright?" said Ellis

When Shavers was told his reply was "he must be practicing for the 29th"


Apparently Ellis separated some of Ali's ribs whilst preparing to fight Liston and Ali had to stop training a week early. He fought Liston with the injury but kept it quiet.

[Controversial]

Holyfield said he own sparring partners were beating him up a week before fighting Tyson for the first time.

[Controversial]

Earnie Shavers was rumoured to have been booted out of camp for decking Ali in sparring in 1973 preparing for the Frazier rematch. Shavers manager Don King said they weren't asked to leave but left because the atmosphere had changed from warm to cool.

Ali said "Yeah he dropped me with a lucky shot. It was a left hook and right hand I went down for a count of 2. He got lucky and knocked me down. That was just a training session, it don't mean nothing"

It was meant to be light sparring as Ali was 10lbs overweight and his serious training hadn't yet started. He said Shavers must make a public apology before he is allowed back.

[Controversial]

Marciano was reportedly dropped to one knee by light heavyweight Jimmy Cerello 28(9)-2-2 in the 2nd round of sparring by an overhand right. He was training for Harry Matthews, Marciano claimed he slipped but he was the only one who thought that was true. It was said to be the first time Marciano had ever been floored in his life.

Al Weill said "Cerello never knocked Rocky down, if he did I'd tell you"

Cerello said "I think I caught him off balance but he made me box him another round afterwards"

[palooka]

Didn't Lloyd Honeyghan bash Darren Dyer about in sparring and Darren came back with a hammer to do him in?

I think Lloyd was a bit full on when sparring because I remember that when he and Mickey Hughes boxed, Mickey had an issue with Lloyd taking liberties with him in sparring.

The 14 year old Tony Ayala got the best of Cuevas apparently though if Pipino knew Ayalas age he'd not have been going full out.

Quincey Taylor bashed Ray Leonard about before the Hagler bout.

[BoxBuzz]

I think all of the Heavyweight examples below have fair corroboration:



-Norton KO'd by Quarry

Could this be the source of the bad blood between these two guys? When they actually fought, Norton was on the rise, and Quarry heading downhill. But the vitriol between them was ugly as it could get. Mostly from what I read from Norton toward Quarry. Maybe I now understand this better.

[Controversial]

Marvin Hagler was dropped by Bobby Patterson in 1986 whilst training to fight Mugabi. Haglar claimed to be off balance but said it was "a good shot". He got straight back up saying "good boy" to Patterson.

Patterson an American middleweight had retired in 1983, 3 years earlier, with a final record of -

18 wins (9 KOs)
23 losses (14 by stoppage)
2 draws

[Controversial]

Sugar Ray Robinson was dropped by Cocoa Kid in sparring in 1949 whilst training to fight Steve Belloise

[Bodyshot3]

Glenn McCrory hanging tough against Tyson whilst other sparring partners headed for home has always interested me. Apparently, he did a more than respectable amount of rounds against Iron Mike and seems to have earned the respect of the camp and probably a very decent pay cheque as well.

[Controversial]

Rocky Marciano floored for a 3-4 count from a left hook to the jaw whilst training to fight Don Cockell in 1955.

British journalist Peter Wilson said he was "properly nailed" and "it was a knockdown, no question about it"

Al Weill was said to looked surprised to see him dropped with 16oz gloves on but he quickly got up to continue.

Sparring partner was Chicago based 200lb heavyweight Toxie Hall whose record at the time was -

10 wins (6 KOS)
12 losses (3 by stoppage)
3 draws

[Controversial]

Floyd Patterson dropped by light heavyweight Harold Carter in 1971 whilst preparing to fight Terry Daniels.

"I go down all the time in workouts, it was a good right hand, I felt it" said Patterson

Carter's record at the time

7 wins (4 KOS)
8 losses (3 by stoppage)
2 draws

[Controversial]

Joe Louis dropped by sparring parter Eddie Malcolm by a right hand in 1937, training for the Bob Pastor fight.

Eddie Malcolm's record at the time was

2 wins (1 KO)
14 losses (7 by stoppage)

[Controversial]

Floyd Patterson dropped twice in 3 rounds by Mel Turnbow in 1965 training to fight Ali. Patterson dropped to his knee in the first and knocked onto his back in the third. "The first was a slip and the second he caught me off balance" said Patterson.

Mel Turnbow's record at this time

6 wins (1 KO)
2 losses (1 by stoppage)

[Controversial]

Joey Maxim dropped by a left hook from middleweight sparring partner Joe Blackwood in 1952 whilst training to fight SRR in their light-heavyweight title fight. They wore 14oz gloves and head guards. Maxim said he was off balance and looked embarrassed as he jumped straight back up.

[Controversial]

Floyd Patterson dropped by middleweight sparring partner Jose Torres in 1958 whilst training for his HW title fight against Roy Harris. Torres hit him with a hard right to the jaw, Patterson's legs wobbled and he dropped to the floor. Patterson's handlers claimed he slipped but ringsiders said it was a legitimate knockdown.

Maxin was undefeated as a pro at the time in 4 fights (2 KOs)

[Controversial]

Philadelphia Jack O'Brien was knocked out by sparring partner Fred Cooley in 1906 with a right hand. O'Brien had beaten Bob Fitzsimmons in his previous fight.

O'Brien didn't get up for some time. "I give credit to Cooley for the knockdown but its not true I lost my head, the bump when I went down hurt my back and leg and for a while I could not get up" said O'Brien. The crowd went wild at the knockdown.

[Giancarlo]

Charlie 'Magri' {flyweight} always KO'd 'Frank' Bruno {'Heavyweight'} whenever they sparred.

Frank 'Bruno',,,,,,,,,,, This lad can really 'hit'.

http://www.chumleywarners.com.au/map.htm

[Controversial]

Joe Bugner and Leroy Caldwell "swatted Gerry Cooney insolently around the ring" in 1982 whilst Cooney was in training for the Holmes fight. Cooney was quoted as saying "I'll be glad to get the Vegas!"

Bugner used his speed to land numerous combinations to Cooney's head and stuck his jab into Cooney's face at will, as did Caldwell. Cooney's handlers were unconcerned and said people shouldn't read too much into training sessions plus Cooney's vision was hampered by problematic headgear.