Tony Ayala Jr - How well would he have done?

[Controversial]

"El Torito" Tony Ayala Jr

33 fights
----------
31 wins (27 KOS)
2 losses (stopped twice)

Turned pro at 17 and from 1980-82 he went 22-0 (19 KOS) before his rape conviction saw him jailed for 16 years. He was on the verge of challenging WBA champ Davey Moore. He made a comeback aged 36 in 1999 but obviously not the fighter he once was and went 9 wins (8 KOS) with 2 losses.

Some bold claims from the boxing fraternity, boxing writer Michael Katz claimed he was the best young fighter he had ever seen. Angelo Dundee said he thought Ayala could have been one of boxing's greatest fighters.

So had he not gone to jail how would you have seen his career go?

[Nile4000]

Both Davey Moore and Wilfred Benitez would've beaten Tony, and prematurely ended his promising career.If he moved up to middleweight, both Alex Ramos and Bobby Czyz would've beaten him.

[Nile4000]

Tony was looking at a ass-whooping from Moore, that's for sure.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He would have beaten the breaks off of Ramos or Czyz at that time. Agreed on the rest.

[Nile4000]

He would have beaten the breaks off of Ramos or Czyz at that time. Agreed on the rest.

Don't know.Ramos and Czyz both could hit, and Czyz gave him hell in sparring sessions to the point that Ayala's own father was even telling Bobby's father that they shouldn't spar with each other due to the intensity.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He would have beaten the breaks off of Ramos or Czyz at that time. Agreed on the rest.

Don't know.Ramos and Czyz both could hit, and Czyz gave him hell in sparring sessions to the point that Ayala's own father was even telling Bobby's father that they shouldn't spar with each other due to the intensity.

He could hit too and Alex had a tender chin(he's top 5 on my most wrong about prospects) and Bobby wasn't that good at Middleweight. I don't think prison stopped him from a tremendous career, Duran would have butchered him, but his efforts well over a decade later showed he could fight.

[Lenny Cravats]

He's due for release next month, by the way. Peculiar, given all the bad stuff he's done.

[Nile4000]

February 1, 1982

WBA Light-Middleweight Rankings

*** Tadashi Mihara
#1.. Ayub Kalule
#2.. Carlos Herrera
#3.. Tony Ayala Jr. > {Age; 19 years, 0 months}
#4..
#5..
#6.. Charlie Weir
#7..
#8..
#9.. Davey Moore
#10.

Fighters who would be lined up to take on Tony Ayala Jr.
* Thomas Hearns
* Wilfred Benitez
* Roberto Duran
* Mike McCallum
* Clint Jackson
* John Mugabi
* Fred Hutchings
* David Braxton
* Tony Braxton
* Herol Graham
* James Green
* Gary Guiden
* Earl Hargrove
* Bruce Johnson

Clint Jackson and David Braxton would've been good tests for Tony.Ironic how Davey Moore was ranked lower than Tony, and still got the title shot.

[Nile4000]

Don't know, maybe Tony would've taken that version of Pipino.

[Nile4000]

Roger Leonard would've been another good tuneup, or a potential loss, for Tony.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He would have knocked him out in 1 or 2 rounds. Earl Hargrove or Mark Medel would have been good fights.

[Nile4000]

Maybe Hargrove, don't know about Medal.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Maybe Hargrove, don't know about Medal.

Medel was better than Hargrove(he stopped him) and they were both better than Roger Leonard.

[palooka]

He was very fierce and hard hitting but he didn't have the patience to be a well rounded fighter. If he'd have not gone to jail he'd have been dead through drugs most likely.

(I wonder how Mike Ayala is doing? He was a fine boxer).

[orbtastic]

His brother, one thing about him always got me. On the day/morning of his fight with Lopez he shot up heroin. I just never really got my head round that.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

That fight was incredible, I don't recall another fight being stopped and restarted like that.

[palooka]

I've never seen anyone counter off the ropes as well as Ayala did; he must have had some fantastic ability and reactions to box like that when smashed on smack.

[orbtastic]

On the DVD I have, there's a pre-fight interview with him in a gondola, of all things. He looks pretty stoned right there.

[palooka]

Buster Drayton v Tony Ayala would have been a good bout; McCallum would have scalped him.

(It's surprising that he's due out next month - I thought he'd been lifed off).

[Nile4000]

Seems like Tony was a true punani.

[Dancin' Dan]

Lets see Robby Epps was a top ten middleweight who beat some solid guys. Hunter Clay was a journeyman at best. Love everyone's opinion but these stories by Il whatever are ridiculous. Tony Ayala was a tremendous prospect but his own worst enemy. As a young amateur I sparred Alex Ramos a good deal. Slick fighter till he got hit on the chin. Went down way too much in the gym. One of life's unfair tricks as he had everything else. Davey Moore would have most likely been run over my Ayala. However Ayala's lifestyle of drugs and booze would have ended him soon anyways.

[Controversial]

What was Hunter Clays best win up to 1982?

[giacomino]

What was Hunter Clays best win up to 1982?

* October 8, 1979...... TKO 10........Fighting Romanus
* December 1, 1979.....KO 5..........Kevin Odus
* December 28, 1979...W Dec 10....Obletey Commey
* October 3, 1980........KO 3..........Kevin Odus
* May 12, 1981...........W Dec 15....Dan Patterson
* May 28, 1982...........KO 2...........Owo Blow
* June 27, 1982..........KO 8...........Tony Blackson

* All excellent Nigerian fighters.

Really? Did you see any of these guys fight, because there is no record indicating any of them were "excellent" fighters. None of them ever beat anyone worth a shite

[giacomino]

Lets see Robby Epps was a top ten middleweight who beat some solid guys. Hunter Clay was a journeyman at best. Love everyone's opinion but these stories by Il whatever are ridiculous. Tony Ayala was a tremendous prospect but his own worst enemy. As a young amateur I sparred Alex Ramos a good deal. Slick fighter till he got hit on the chin. Went down way too much in the gym. One of life's unfair tricks as he had everything else. Davey Moore would have most likely been run over my Ayala. However Ayala's lifestyle of drugs and booze would have ended him soon anyways.

Dancin' Dan Has 'Two' Left Feet

Hunter 'Tad Oje' Clay
* In mid-1982 > Hunter 'Tad Oje' Clay was a very good Light-Middleweight. And he was only {Age; 20 1/2}.
* Let's not forget the '3-Time' Rapist pulled out 'twice' in fighting Hunter Clay in 1982.
* Who's to say that Hunter Clay wouldn't have out-boxed the 'Rapist'.

Robbie Epps vs. Tony Ayala Jr.
* 24 year-old - 6' 2" - 158 lb. lanky string-bean.
* Decent boxer with absolutely no strength or punch.
* Had only '1-Bout' in 14-Months prior to fighting Tony Ayala Jr.
* In his last bout {March 1982} he lost and was nearly KO'd by club-fighter - Ted Mann

Beat some solid guys. I think not. He had 'one' lucky win over sleep-walking Dwight Davidson in June 1981.

Re: Epps. Wasn't champion material but out-worked Davidson and not sure it was "lucky." Epps was a decent fringe contender and Davidson had a tendency to be lazy. I remember watching Mann beat Epps and thinking it said a whole lot about Davidson, who was considered an up-and-coming contender to Hagler. Hagler would have KO'd Epps within a few rounds and Davidson within six to eight

[Dancin' Dan]

Great description of Robby Epps. Who used to be trained by Tony Sr. Hence the fight and bad blood. Hunter Clay....please avoid by no one. Journeyman. Il you should post under the fantasy section for all the stories you make up. Club fighters who Ali feared....OK. So who was truly great in your book? No fake a@@ stories just your opinion. That is what a forum is for.