unlicensed group plan legal action against brit board

[jonp]

One thing im not quite understanding is this.People are saying that it will be cheaper and easier to run shows without the board hovering over if this is true .Why are the GBA and malta shows that have been promoted costing more than a normal show? surely if not being with the board if making life cheaper why would they be charging more wouldnt they be charging less?

I would assume that it would be that theres a lack of home ticket selling boxers available due to it not being a bbboc show and also that the opponents generally (and some of the boxers on left hand side) are coming in from overseas.

To be fair Damion the shows iv seen the home side are all ticket selling home guys in fact the deal is they have to sell a certain amount before they even get paid so its simeler to normal shows.The opponents are forieng but its not that much more to have a foriegn guy in than a normal guy even more so seeing as the board cost for a foriegn boxer isnt an issue here.

[expe]

When you are part of the body that regulates/controls a sport, not all decisions are accepted by everybody because sometimes they effect the 'loser' financially. But somebody must have control. The Boards decisions are made for the benefit of the sport. Sometimes they get it wrong, but I think they make honest decisions and have done for over 80 years. You can't beat experience and continuity.

+1

There's no doubt changes need to be made to the board, but the Malta and Luxembourg lot aren't the answer. Should lads like Suz Member really be getting licenses? The board do need to smarten up and use common sense at times though. Just today they've turned down Bob Ajisafe-Leon Senior for the British title, as part of the Maxinutrition tournament on Channel 5, throwing the whole thing into chaos, surely common sense should prevail, put the title on the line so nothing gets messed up.

[Callowland]

Changes will be forced on the Board if they lose the forthcoming case and their monopoly on the business in the UK.

[spudder56]

Changes will be forced on the Board if they lose the forthcoming case and their monopoly on the business in the UK.

Don't quite understand what you mean by monopoly mate there is the ebf and various other white collar organisations as I see it boxers could always hand their licences in and get licenced by any body that they wish at any time it's just that the board have far higher medical standards than any other body in the world and IMO long may it continue anybody who is not happy in abiding by board regulations can always hand their licence in I just don't understand what the problem is to be honest with you

[Callowland]

Changes will be forced on the Board if they lose the forthcoming case and their monopoly on the business in the UK.

Don't quite understand what you mean by monopoly mate there is the ebf and various other white collar organisations as I see it boxers could always hand their licences in and get licenced by any body that they wish at any time it's just that the board have far higher medical standards than any other body in the world and IMO long may it continue anybody who is not happy in abiding by board regulations can always hand their licence in I just don't understand what the problem is to be honest with you

As you know, it is the restrictive practices exercised by your organisation Spudder in severely punishing individuals who want to ply their trade outside of the Board. There is a rule that you can probably quote off the top of your head that explains this.

You're entitled to your opinion but that is what is being tested, and this rule may well be ok in terms of UK and European Competition law. We shall see

[expe]

Changes will be forced on the Board if they lose the forthcoming case and their monopoly on the business in the UK.

Don't quite understand what you mean by monopoly mate there is the ebf and various other white collar organisations as I see it boxers could always hand their licences in and get licenced by any body that they wish at any time it's just that the board have far higher medical standards than any other body in the world and IMO long may it continue anybody who is not happy in abiding by board regulations can always hand their licence in I just don't understand what the problem is to be honest with you

As you know, it is the restrictive practices exercised by your organisation Spudder in severely punishing individuals who want to ply their trade outside of the Board. There is a rule that you can probably quote off the top of your head that explains this.

You're entitled to your opinion but that is what is being tested, and this rule may well be ok in terms of UK and European Competition law. We shall see

I can't see the issue with the rule, if you ask permission you will be allowed to be involved in shows abroad. The board won't allow anyone to take part in GBA, Malta and Luxembourg shows on British soil, but they don't have any rule stopping anyone from taking part in those shows, if you don't like it, leave and get a foreign license, but don't expect to break the board's rules, then be welcomed back with open arms, they can't have it both ways. The other thing I still don't understand is why another organisation is needed to put on shows, like Jon said, the shows have been costing more to put on, so what other reason is there?

[Callowland]

I can't see the issue with the rule, if you ask permission you will be allowed to be involved in shows abroad. The board won't allow anyone to take part in GBA, Malta and Luxembourg shows on British soil, but they don't have any rule stopping anyone from taking part in those shows, if you don't like it, leave and get a foreign license, but don't expect to break the board's rules, then be welcomed back with open arms, they can't have it both ways. The other thing I still don't understand is why another organisation is needed to put on shows, like Jon said, the shows have been costing more to put on, so what other reason is there?[/quote]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum

[spudder56]

I can't see the issue with the rule, if you ask permission you will be allowed to be involved in shows abroad. The board won't allow anyone to take part in GBA, Malta and Luxembourg shows on British soil, but they don't have any rule stopping anyone from taking part in those shows, if you don't like it, leave and get a foreign license, but don't expect to break the board's rules, then be welcomed back with open arms, they can't have it both ways. The other thing I still don't understand is why another organisation is needed to put on shows, like Jon said, the shows have been costing more to put on, so what other reason is there?

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum[/quo


as you said earlier you are entitled to your opinion but imo all you want is Bruce to run boxing in the uk a man who continually breeches his own eligibility rules for the masters titles in his pursuit of sanctioning fees can never be good for the game if you sign up for any organisation surely you agree to abide by the rules of that organisation if not why join in the first place ?

[palooka]

I can't see the issue with the rule, if you ask permission you will be allowed to be involved in shows abroad. The board won't allow anyone to take part in GBA, Malta and Luxembourg shows on British soil, but they don't have any rule stopping anyone from taking part in those shows, if you don't like it, leave and get a foreign license, but don't expect to break the board's rules, then be welcomed back with open arms, they can't have it both ways. The other thing I still don't understand is why another organisation is needed to put on shows, like Jon said, the shows have been costing more to put on, so what other reason is there?

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum[/quote]


expe is a fan, I don't think he is part of the BBBoC.

[Callowland]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum[/quo


as you said earlier you are entitled to your opinion but imo all you want is Bruce to run boxing in the uk a man who continually breeches his own eligibility rules for the masters titles in his pursuit of sanctioning fees can never be good for the game if you sign up for any organisation surely you agree to abide by the rules of that organisation if not why join in the first place ?[/quote]

It's about the concept of free trade in conjunction with the Board's rules. I don't give a fig about Bruce Baker. The court will decide.

[palooka]

I can't see the issue with the rule, if you ask permission you will be allowed to be involved in shows abroad. The board won't allow anyone to take part in GBA, Malta and Luxembourg shows on British soil, but they don't have any rule stopping anyone from taking part in those shows, if you don't like it, leave and get a foreign license, but don't expect to break the board's rules, then be welcomed back with open arms, they can't have it both ways. The other thing I still don't understand is why another organisation is needed to put on shows, like Jon said, the shows have been costing more to put on, so what other reason is there?

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum[/quo


as you said earlier you are entitled to your opinion but imo all you want is Bruce to run boxing in the uk a man who continually breeches his own eligibility rules for the masters titles in his pursuit of sanctioning fees can never be good for the game if you sign up for any organisation surely you agree to abide by the rules of that organisation if not why join in the first place ?

That's a question for Tony Blair.

[expe]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum

Professional boxing is also a sport, might be worth remembering that since I don't remember you ever posting about anything other than this sort of thing.

I doubt the board would sanction any of it's members to take part in those shows abroad, but even if it did, there's nothing stopping anyone from walking away and taking out a license elsewhere, when you take out a license with the board, the rules are very clear, permission is needed to take part on another organisation's show, you can't then complain when the board enforce their own rules, after knowing full well beforehand what they were.

[spudder56]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum

Professional boxing is also a sport, might be worth remembering that since I don't remember you ever posting about anything other than this sort of thing.

I doubt the board would sanction any of it's members to take part in those shows abroad, but even if it did, there's nothing stopping anyone from walking away and taking out a license elsewhere, when you take out a license with the board, the rules are very clear, permission is needed to take part on another organisation's show, you can't then complain when the board enforce their own rules, after knowing full well beforehand what they were.

Exactly mate everybody knows the rules before they choose to take out a licence if there is anything you are not happy with why join ffs

[palooka]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum

Professional boxing is also a sport, might be worth remembering that since I don't remember you ever posting about anything other than this sort of thing.

I doubt the board would sanction any of it's members to take part in those shows abroad, but even if it did, there's nothing stopping anyone from walking away and taking out a license elsewhere, when you take out a license with the board, the rules are very clear, permission is needed to take part on another organisation's show, you can't then complain when the board enforce their own rules, after knowing full well beforehand what they were.

Exactly mate everybody knows the rules before they choose to take out a licence if there is anything you are not happy with why join ffs

Maybe the rules don't change quickly enough (or at all) to reflect the changing nature of the sport?

[expe]

So, you can potentially box or officiate abroad on a GBA, Malta or Luxembourg show, but the moment they put a show on in the UK you are in hot water.
That is protectionism pure and simple and against the principle of free trade as professional boxing is a business.
To say you don't have a problem with it means you are a Board member trying to maintain a monopoly.
Should you and Spudder be on this forum

expe is a fan, I don't think he is part of the BBBoC.

In Callowland's eyes, anyone who supports the board is automatically a member of the board, simply because they disagree with him. Even if I was a member of the board, what's wrong with a member of a boxing board, posting on a boxing forum. I get the feeling Callowland has something to do with the other side, possibly as a lawyer, so by his rules, he shouldn't be posting on here either. There's dozens of board members that post on here, from fighters to managers, referees and inspectors, the forum would be a lesser place without them.

[Anzi]

Rubbish ! Board officials should not be on forums, I know the board are looking into this, they are supposed to remain unbiased, to do their job correctly, mixing with fighters, trainers, managers and promoters on the forums, can be a problem, because people fall out with each other on here and some develop friendships, imagine someone you hate against someone you like in a close fight, it could make all the difference, Groves blamed outside interference for the premature stoppage of his fight against Froch, now they may bring a referee from outside, not influenced by reputation on these shores, fighters get reputations on forums, no chin, can't take a punch, some branded warriors, some quitters, some hold a lot, some spoil in close, some showboat, all these things come into the mind of the official, when making quick decisions.

[palooka]

Though the referees and judges etc do not live in a bubble even if they stay away from forums. You are a trainer and are involved in the sport, it seems a big part of your life. I think you ought 'to be allowed' on a forum and though I think the Froch v Groves bout was stopped too soon I like to see Howard Foster post as well. I think when officials post we need to remember they are doing so as a private person and do not necessarily represent the views of the organisation.

[Anzi]

Though the referees and judges etc do not live in a bubble even if they stay away from forums. You are a trainer and are involved in the sport, it seems a big part of your life. I think you ought 'to be allowed' on a forum and though I think the Froch v Groves bout was stopped too soon I like to see Howard Foster post as well. I think when officials post we need to remember they are doing so as a private person and do not necessarily represent the views of the organisation.

The difference here is that if a fighter, trainer, manager or even promoter make a mistake, they can go on here and explain what happened, what caused it, they can even say sorry, if they wish, referees and judges can't do that, they are not allowed to, certainly, not straight after the event, officials affect others as well as themselves, when they make a bad call, lots of money is at stake sometimes, big future purses, in Prizefight for instance, it can mean losing about £8,000 by not reaching the next round, I know the Board are concerned about officials going on forums and I know fans of the sport like to interact with people in the industry and read their stories, not to mention the inside information they can pick themselves, but we need to remove any reasonable doubt when it comes to officials, too many bad decisions lately, premature stoppages, dodgy scoring, inconsistency on cuts and injuries.

[palooka]

There were dodgy decisions and shady goings on in boxing long before the internet. Wasn't Spud a whip and part of Hayemaker? - he seemed to seperate the aspects and he posted for his own enjoyment - he didn't seem to have an agenda (other than to piss some people off )

[Callowland]

expe is a fan, I don't think he is part of the BBBoC.[/quote]
In Callowland's eyes, anyone who supports the board is automatically a member of the board, simply because they disagree with him. Even if I was a member of the board, what's wrong with a member of a boxing board, posting on a boxing forum. I get the feeling Callowland has something to do with the other side, possibly as a lawyer, so by his rules, he shouldn't be posting on here either. There's dozens of board members that post on here, from fighters to managers, referees and inspectors, the forum would be a lesser place without them.[/quote]

Firstly, I am a lone wolf. Not a part of the 'other' side. It is just that expe's and Spudder's knowledge is very detailed which leadss me to think they are more than fans.

As I keep saying, it will be the court that will decide whether the Board's rules are 21st century compliant.

[Anzi]

There were dodgy decisions and shady goings on in boxing long before the internet. Wasn't Spud a whip and part of Hayemaker? - he seemed to seperate the aspects and he posted for his own enjoyment - he didn't seem to have an agenda (other than to piss some people off )

Palooka, I think he was with Dave Coldwell at Coldwell promotions as well, I think they fell out, he does seem very pro the BBB of C, I personally think the board need a good shake up in certain area's, whilst in other area's they have done really good work, their medical protocol is second to none, but they need to stop all the being wined and dined by Promoters and involve members more in decisions relating to the Industry, what I have to say though, is that the German and Malta Federations are not the answer to the problem.

[palooka]

expe is a fan, I don't think he is part of the BBBoC.

In Callowland's eyes, anyone who supports the board is automatically a member of the board, simply because they disagree with him. Even if I was a member of the board, what's wrong with a member of a boxing board, posting on a boxing forum. I get the feeling Callowland has something to do with the other side, possibly as a lawyer, so by his rules, he shouldn't be posting on here either. There's dozens of board members that post on here, from fighters to managers, referees and inspectors, the forum would be a lesser place without them.[/quote]

Firstly, I am a lone wolf. Not a part of the 'other' side. It is just that expe's and Spudder's knowledge is very detailed which leadss me to think they are more than fans.

As I keep saying, it will be the court that will decide whether the Board's rules are 21st century compliant.[/quote]

I think expe is a student and he has an excellent knowledge of the sport - he puts many more experienced posters (myself included) to shame.

[expe]

There were dodgy decisions and shady goings on in boxing long before the internet. Wasn't Spud a whip and part of Hayemaker? - he seemed to seperate the aspects and he posted for his own enjoyment - he didn't seem to have an agenda (other than to piss some people off )

Palooka, I think he was with Dave Coldwell at Coldwell promotions as well, I think they fell out, he does seem very pro the BBB of C, I personally think the board need a good shake up in certain area's, whilst in other area's they have done really good work, their medical protocol is second to none, but they need to stop all the being wined and dined by Promoters and involve members more in decisions relating to the Industry, what I have to say though, is that the German and Malta Federations are not the answer to the problem.

Absolutely spot on. The board is by no means perfect and change is needed, but the medical provision is top notch and all these foreign bodies are not the solution.

[Callowland]

Absolutely spot on. The board is by no means perfect and change is needed, but the medical provision is top notch and all these foreign bodies are not the solution.[/quote]

Touche, the Board is not perfect and is probably beyond reform.

[The Insider]

Take Luxembourg, GBA, Malta and all the rest of the organisations out of the equation. What it boils down to is are the Board acting within EU directives put in place to ensure a fair and level playing field and they are abiding with EU trade laws that aren't restricting people's trade in their chosen profession or field of expertise. Are the Board threatening their licence holders with bans and fines to uphold their monopoly on the sport in this country when they aren't a statutory body. I have no idea which way the cards will fall but the board must be confident (or incredibly stupid) to take this case on which has the potential to bankrupt them. It would also be nice to be asked if we backed the Board in going ahead with the court battle.