Froch/Groves II: How you see the fight panning out

[n1ebf]

Though there has been much made of Carls' mind set and lack of preparation before the first bout I really think Groves had the worst of it; he will have had a much improved and settled camp this time and I don't think people are taking notice of the age difference between the 2. I can imagine Froch training very hard - he is a firece competitor - it is different a 36 year old body getting into fighting shape and a 26 year old body.

I'm borderline on the age thing. Of course it's a very individual aspect but (and not that George or his team will be) it's a bloody dangerous thing to start writing someone off, even a little bit, based on age. Carl might not have dimished one single jot since the last fight - he may even come in better. But obviously as a general rule of thumb the 26yr old will be able to do the same mental stuff, but recover much better, that the 36yr old - but it is only a general rule.

[palooka]

I don't imagine that anyone is banking on age being a factor; Froch is reportedly very single minded and dedicated - which makes it more inexplicable that he cut corners before the first bout. I imagine this will be a very hard physical contest and I think Groves is closer to his prime than Froch.

[rapid2]

This is Groves fight to lose. He comfortably outboxed Froch in their first fight, i cannot see that changing. As long as Groves plays the long game and conserves enough energy not to gas out in the final few rounds, he really should win this.

Stamina is the major concern for Groves. I think Froch is pinning all his hopes on a late surge so Groves must play the long game and leave enough in the tank for the final 3 rounds.

I agree with this, but I don't expect Groves to box conservatively or within himself either. He can pretty much hit Froch when he wants to. I'm surprised Carl wanted this fight, but with Froch - that probably made it the more attractive.
Also - as much as people probably expect to see Groves gunning for Froch, I think if Froch gets a sniff at any time he'll go for the stoppage himself.
On balance however I can see Groves pacing himself and winning the fight somewhere around the 8th or 9th.

Least likely prediction. Win or lose, froch will go the full distance.

[DIRT SUGAR]

Groves has done 12 ok a few times. He would have again if Foster hadn't grabbed him...

Oh yeah because he was looking so comfortable around the point of the stoppage

To be fair he looked in far worse shape against Kenny Anderson and came back to win so who knows. Speculation isn't it but I can see Froch coming out and really taking it to Groves and in the process getting chinned. Just got a funny feeling.

[coneye]

Well after all the bullshit and mind games are finished , the flag drops and the bullshit stops , Froch has took this one a lot more serious , and we know he will put a lot of pressure on Groves to work hard early hoping he gasses out ,

George knows this and will be working hard to get his fitness level up so he does'nt gas , whilst at the same time hoping to catch Carl early with a counter and put him down again .

They will both be defensive , Carl because he don't want to get caught early again , and George cos he'll want to save energy for the latter rnds .

But in rnd 6 , it will change , George has been making a big deal of rnd 6 , and there is a reason it will change , After both fighters being very tentative for the first 5 rnds , Froch will get fed up , He'll say i've had enough of this bollocks , i'm gonna knock him out , after being in a clinch Carl will back off , and leave these words in Groves ear

15% ,, 15% , yep 15% George ya silly cant .. Groves will rise to the taunt , and get careless , cos he'll get mad and complain to the ref , Heh ref he's taunting me , I thought i was the only one allowed to do it .

Lee Froch will be at the sidelines , shouting 15% , Frochs missis will be screaching above everyone else , 15% , he bought me some knew tits with your other 10 % , Froch will be smiling , and pointing to the new shiny gold mouthguard , and mouthing 15% ya daft bastard .

Groves will say its not fair , and while looking at the ref to complain , he'll get hit and game over ,

He'll wake up in cuckoo land and say how much did i earn , and Fitzpatrick will say 10% less than you should off, now give me my 10 % cos i'm off to majorca . Groves willl then think about it and Bunce will tell him, look George you got paid 10% less , and you only paid 10 % to your trainer , now i know thats saving 5% of Booths bill , but when Both would of negotiated for you he would of probaly got you 35-40% split , now do you relize why your a daft bastard .

George will then go on to petition , anyone who will listen for a 3rd fight , claiming it was'nt fair cos Lee froch and carls missis teased him during the fight .

[Bodyshot3]

My suspicion is that Groves will have improved his stamina and be even more confident; so I do see him being fast out of the blocks again and if he gets Carl wobbling he will absolutely go for the finish. If that does not happen then he'll sit back and box within himself and go for the points victory. I have massive respect for Froch but I think it is George's time.

[lefty]

My suspicion is that Groves will have improved his stamina and be even more confident; so I do see him being fast out of the blocks again and if he gets Carl wobbling he will absolutely go for the finish. If that does not happen then he'll sit back and box within himself and go for the points victory. I have massive respect for Froch but I think it is George's time.

I think there's a genetic element to somebodies stamina just as much as somebodies or some other tangible. Some fighters will always just gas quicker than others, it's part of their makeup.

[Final round]

I want George to jump on Carl from the off, play a tune on that chin again and force Carl to slip into mad man mode. Cue excitement, explosions and blood curdling thrills.
I suspect it will be a cagey affair for the first half of the fight though.

[Happy Slapper]

I don't believe all Froch's talk of "I took him lightly", "I wasn't mentally prepared" and "He didn't have my respect". Absolute tosh.

Boxers always look for excuses when things don't go to plan. The sport is littered with it - Toegate with Haye and Klitschko, Hatton's training camp against Pac, Khan saying Roach was concentrating on Pac for the Garcia loss etc etc, the list goes on and on. Froch was prepared last time, mentally and physically.

I think the truth of the matter is that Froch has gone slightly over the hill after a very hard career and Groves is starting to enter his peak years. I'm predicting a KO for Groves, and it wouldn't surprise me if it's early.

I don't believe the first 6 rounds of the first fight were a freak or because Carl wasn't at the races, and I think that it will be shown to be the case next Saturday.

Groves KO4.

Although I could be wrong!

[187]

Groves has got his number

[Ian1973]

I seriously think this fight is all about Groves. If Groves uses his head and uses his speed and his skills Froch cannot beat him unless Groves runs on empty in the later rounds.

I think in terms of one punch power Groves has a definite edge so if Froch comes out like he did against Bute he'd be an idiot. If he wants to trade then he needs to do it in the later rounds because his endurance levels don't fall like other fighters' do. If Froch tries to outbox Groves he's going to look laboured and old.

Groves can beat himself for sure. I think it's all about him. Groves needs to keep his composure and stick to his plan. If Froch comes in close tie him up. You don't get Mayweather / Ward taking silly risks, Groves has to learn the same self discipline. If he hasn't learned from the first fight he'll most probably get beat, if he has I don't see any way Froch can beat him.

[keithmoonhangover]

I think this one can genuinely go either way.

Groves wins if...

He keeps discipline and Froch walks in.

If Froch's punch resistance has diminished badly.

Froch wins if....

He keeps his composure, waits for George to throw and then attacks, which is what he started doing towards the stoppage in the first fight.

If Groves takes him for granted.


I think Froch fights more like he did against Bute. He keeps his composure for the most part and wins a clear decision after putting Groves on the floor more than once. Groves will get even more respect.

[macaca]

I think this one can genuinely go either way.

Groves wins if...

He keeps discipline and Froch walks in.

If Froch's punch resistance has diminished badly.

Froch wins if....

He keeps his composure, waits for George to throw and then attacks, which is what he started doing towards the stoppage in the first fight.

If Groves takes him for granted.


I think Froch fights more like he did against Bute. He keeps his composure for the most part and wins a clear decision after putting Groves on the floor more than once. Groves will get even more respect.

Froch will need to fight differently in the first round becasue for me he fought pretty much exactly the same against Bute. The difference is that Bute threw 2 weak body jabs in the first minute whist George threw many connecting head jabs, Bute looked to be shitting his pants and to be honest I think Groves would tear Bute apart.
Discipline, box move, counter, use jab, land some big shots, keep out of mischief Groves win.
Slugfest, close quaters, dirty tactics, Froch win.

I also think a weakness is George if he thinks he has Carl in trouble he will abandon some discipline and think that he can loosen up and get swinging and mix it, he will get tagged in the mix

[MightyWarrior]

The fact that Groves manager says it will be a Hagler/Hearns war for the first three rounds, make it fairly obvious that George will be playing it safe early, conserving that stamina.
I think the fight will break out around six - both getting hurt, but George hanging on & getting the points win eventually

[Final round]

Taken from the Daily Star

Carl Froch said: "Since losing to Andre Ward two years ago, I have considered retiring if my career didn't go win, win, win.

"The next loss, I'm retiring because I can't lose. I am not in this sport to lose. I lost to Ward and it broke my heart."
He said: "Beating Groves will set that up for a massive fight in Vegas, potentially my last fight. We'll see how it goes and I'm taking it all one fight at a time.

"Beating Groves is not if but when. I am prepared to win this fight by whatever means necessary.

"Part of me says that if I do the business against Groves, I can tick the box of that other dream fight.

"That would, of course, be Las Vegas, the fight capital. To have my name up in lights in there, headlining the bill, and to be able to tell my little boy and girl, 'That's Vegas where I headlined the bill' would be the pinnacle.

"There would then be nothing else for me to do. The one thing I have not done is fight in Las Vegas.

"I am not interested in fighting Ward again. But it's a massive fight, and potentially one that could happen in Vegas.

"I would seriously consider it. That would be the ultimate, beating Ward and going out at the top in Vegas."

[Old Jack J]

Im watching some of groves' last few fights and the thing I like best about groves is how his ears flap when he gets hit.

[palooka]

Im watching some of groves' last few fights and the thing I like best about groves is how his ears flap when he gets hit.

They do waggle a bit don't they and he goes a bit red I can't think who Froch looked like when he got dropped by Groves though I think it's Quagmire

[Old Jack J]

They don't just waggle a bit, if he gets hit a few times in succession he could take off.

The groves vs degale fight was on earlier. Not sure he won that. The other thing that occurred to me whilst watching it was that degale probably beats froch easily on points.

I'm coming round to the idea of froch getting retired next week and groves v degale title fight later this year. 18 months time, callum smith probably beats both of them.

[Sklar]

Degale is quality but he sometimes lacks devil and killer instinct.

[palooka]

They don't just waggle a bit, if he gets hit a few times in succession he could take off.

The groves vs degale fight was on earlier. Not sure he won that. The other thing that occurred to me whilst watching it was that degale probably beats froch easily on points.

I'm coming round to the idea of froch getting retired next week and groves v degale title fight later this year. 18 months time, callum smith probably beats both of them.

You're old enough to have seen boxers who are predators at British level who fold when they get get hit back, Callum spars better men than he has fought - the jump from British level to world is very big.

[n1ebf]

I was thinking about this fight last night. In this thread I said Groves in 8 (maybe 9) I think....however, I think it's coming sooner.
Groves can hit Froch at will almost. I don't think he should try to change his approach too much, he wasn't far off the first time (it was a completely reasonable stoppage I thought).....I also think having that huge fight will have given him something extra.
At 80,000 of course, this one threatens to dwarf it. Does anyone know what the atmosphere is like at new Wembley? Are the fans closer? I read (in Keane's book) that at old Wembley the crowd were a bit far away and it lacked atmosphere.
Anyway, I think the ref might stop in in Groves favour about round 4. Based on a hunch :>

[SMALL AXE1]

Groves needs to use feints and not throw so many punches.

Pick Carl off and win the 1st 6 rounds and up the punches when Froch panics and chases after him in the 2nd half of the fight.

People have to realise that Froch is an not a one punch ko artist, whereas Groves has real power.

Groves UD 12.

[SMALL AXE1]

Or Groves stops him early. The last fight was very punishing for Froch.

[Ricky_]

Fair play to Froch for taking the rematch after the beating he got in the first fight, but if anything, it's likely to be an even bigger mismatch this time. Groves inside 5, if not, wide decision.

[TJ77]

I think Groves will win either on points or by stoppage in the championship rounds.
He was lacking in stamina following losing his head a bit and wasting energy he took far too much hammer than was needed.
I agree a cagey first few rounds then Groves finding the target while Froch finds his target moving too quickly.
Carl may have been forced into the rematch financially or to win back the public but I feel it will wish he hadn't agreed to it as its a great catapult for Groves to the big fights.
The money will appease him but he will know he has given Groves the baton and that's gonna grate on his ego.
It's fight week and im buzzing for this one roll on saturday