Any news on Michael Nunn?

[The 1bangkid]

Im sorry to disagree guys but a long time ago i read the ins and outs of the case and i have no doubt the sentencing was excessive. It was one of those 3 strikes and your out and eff u if the first two strikes were for a parking violation and the second for DUI. Nunn had the world at his feet but in this dirty game of boxing the schysters, trainers and lawyers who werent taking the punches screwed him as well as his own lavish , immature tastes and spending habits. Sure he deserved to do a long time , perhaps ten years but this 24 year bullshit!! sorry lads but we will just have to agree to disagree on this one.

I have to agree, 24 years is extremely harsh

[hhaehre]

Can't do the time, don't do the crime.

Are you saying any punishment, no matter how stern, is fair?

I have no problem with any constitutional punishment. Mandatory minima are perfectly fine with me. We don't like drug dealers here.

IMO you should have a serious concern with the US penal system. When more than 3% of the population is either in jail or on probation I'd say you have a major problem on your hands. No other country has more people imprisoned and I don't think it's because Americans are more prone to crime than any one else.

[Rover]

I have no problem with that at all. They're in prison for a reason.

[JLP]

The way the "war on drugs" is fought is almost wholly ineffectual and, all things considered, costs an absolute fortuned to wage. Why bother?

Legalize drugs and tax them, or kill addicts and dealers on sight. Anywhere between those two extremes doesn't come close to adequately tackling the problem.

[dberry]

Hmmm, sending some one up the river for twenty four years for doing what every publican, Batista and tobacconist do is lunacy when murderers, rapists and pedophiles get a lot less.

[scallum]

The way the system is set you have guys who deal crumbs and get severe sentencing , while guys who get busted with major weight getting light sentencing. Many times if you are dealing it while its soft you get slap.on. wrist but guys in the hood dealing hard get crazy sentences. Got a cousin ,same age as I who already has done 20 plus years for dealing crumbs .

[misterpunch]

rover has a point here - but i still feel the sentence with no parole on the menu is excessive, even for an ass like nunn

[Jasontickets]

85% of these comments are pure HATE he did not cross state lines he was set up at a hotel 24yrs for attempting to purchase a kilo of cocaine???? That is F@&KED up a guy in Texas just got 45 days in jail followed by 5 yrs probation for RAPE everyone here that has commented with HATE should fall victim to the MASS INCARCERATION IN THE US

[Bricks]

Rover, where do I say that quote "just because slimy lawyers/advisors screwed him" that justifies what he did? I dont.
What I do say is that he deserved a long sentence. Perhaps ten or twelve years. Not 24!! That is insane and 24 is just when he comes up for parole. He may not get parole!!!

The "he should've hired better people" line is pretty churlish. He had Surkein and the Goosens with him. As good as they were or werent the industry standard at that time was for a manager to take a 33% cut so the fighter was screwed cos that was just the way it was done back than. very very few fighters understood contracts back than. A SRL back than was an exception to the rule. But I do agree with you in that ultimately Nunns lavish spending, immaturity and the money will never run out mentality as well as his dabbling in drugs is what screwed him as well as his losing to Liles and Small at crucial times and not taking fights with Duran, SRL,Hearns back when they could have been made and fighting Starling and Curry instead. The Toney loss i excuse.

Why bring up the bad lawyers if it's not relevant to his sentence?
Nunn will not come up for "parole." The federal system doesn't have parole anymore; it got abolished in the 80s. He must serve 85% of his term (credit for good behavior). If he's a good boy, he'll get out on 1/3/24.
Your clarification of what happened to him makes me even less sympathetic. I thought he'd gotten money stolen from him by crooked lawyers/advisors. If he just signed the standard industry contract, that's his problem; no sympathy from me. Obviously, as SRL shows, fighters can be savvy. I have no sympathy for those who aren't. Regardless, he made quite a bit of money (whether you think he should've made more is another story, but that's totally on Nunn). He made enough for any normal person to live comfortably for life. He squandered it, dealt drugs and threw his life down the toilet. Someone who does that merits not a shred of sympathy.
When you said "Liles and Small," did you mean Steve Little?

Quite the judge jury and executioner aren't you shylock? I'm guessing someone spent their adolescence watching judge Judy. I just hope one day u don't end up in the penal system

[Broomhall]

We are all human and most of us screw up. I dont know about the USA but a couple of years ago the vast majority of our MPs (our senate) were caught on the take in an expenses scandal-even if marginally legal basically fleecing the taxpayer for as much as they could get their hands on while they were meant to be serving joe public.

They where making £1000s by buying and selling second homes, "employing" family members and even claiming expenses for things like garden furniture and pictures. They have now changed the system to make it legal to do the same things they were doing before.

How many bankers are doing time for the economic collapse?

You get a guy like Nunn, whom I am guessing may have exactly grew up with many advantages who screws up and the system just loves to punish them. I dont like drugs and dealing them is wrong, but the whole drugs war system is wrong as it will always end up punishing the wrong people.

[palooka]

There was an article in The Metro the other day saying there was to be legislation brought in so that accountants and lawyers who helped criminal gangs would be brought to book. It also said that delivery drivers and the like who picked up and dropped off boxed and wrapped items would also be charged. I wonder if there are more delivery drivers put in jail than accountants and lawyers?

[gilgamesh]

Rover, where do I say that quote "just because slimy lawyers/advisors screwed him" that justifies what he did? I dont.
What I do say is that he deserved a long sentence. Perhaps ten or twelve years. Not 24!! That is insane and 24 is just when he comes up for parole. He may not get parole!!!

The "he should've hired better people" line is pretty churlish. He had Surkein and the Goosens with him. As good as they were or werent the industry standard at that time was for a manager to take a 33% cut so the fighter was screwed cos that was just the way it was done back than. very very few fighters understood contracts back than. A SRL back than was an exception to the rule. But I do agree with you in that ultimately Nunns lavish spending, immaturity and the money will never run out mentality as well as his dabbling in drugs is what screwed him as well as his losing to Liles and Small at crucial times and not taking fights with Duran, SRL,Hearns back when they could have been made and fighting Starling and Curry instead. The Toney loss i excuse.

Why bring up the bad lawyers if it's not relevant to his sentence?
Nunn will not come up for "parole." The federal system doesn't have parole anymore; it got abolished in the 80s. He must serve 85% of his term (credit for good behavior). If he's a good boy, he'll get out on 1/3/24.
Your clarification of what happened to him makes me even less sympathetic. I thought he'd gotten money stolen from him by crooked lawyers/advisors. If he just signed the standard industry contract, that's his problem; no sympathy from me. Obviously, as SRL shows, fighters can be savvy. I have no sympathy for those who aren't. Regardless, he made quite a bit of money (whether you think he should've made more is another story, but that's totally on Nunn). He made enough for any normal person to live comfortably for life. He squandered it, dealt drugs and threw his life down the toilet. Someone who does that merits not a shred of sympathy.
When you said "Liles and Small," did you mean Steve Little?

Quite the judge jury and executioner aren't you shylock? I'm guessing someone spent their adolescence watching judge Judy. I just hope one day u don't end up in the penal system

Rover was not human, he was a Symbiotic organism that attached itself to a screenname. He didn't seem to relate to anything Human. Overall he's one of the most bizarre and hardest to understand people I've ever encountered online. Something in his brain just never activated. He seemed smart in a lot of ways, but in other ways he was just completely clueless, and couldn't even comprehend a normal, rational point of view.

[Broomhall]

There was an article in The Metro the other day saying there was to be legislation brought in so that accountants and lawyers who helped criminal gangs would be brought to book. It also said that delivery drivers and the like who picked up and dropped off boxed and wrapped items would also be charged. I wonder if there are more delivery drivers put in jail than accountants and lawyers?

I have worked in Prisons and with offenders. About 5%of them are people who are genuinly bad. The rest are people with mental heath problems, illiterate and innumerate, addiction problems, and sometimes just made stupid decisions.

When Nunn had all his money he would have been like a kid in a candy store, and probably surrounded by leeches and hangers on. Sports stars can earn huge amounts, but sadly because of bad education, bad advice many often end up broke. The same happens with lottery and pools winners. I didnt agree with what Nunn did, I have seen many lives ruined by drugs, but I can try and understand the temptations.

I tend to reserve my more hostile feelings for those who have all the advantages in life and yet still either legally or illegally want more, and who continue to get away with it, and like you I bet the poor sod from the delivery company is the guy who will end up carrying the can.

This is the man charged with reforming welfare

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ia ... st-1810086

[evrenb]

There was an article in The Metro the other day saying there was to be legislation brought in so that accountants and lawyers who helped criminal gangs would be brought to book. It also said that delivery drivers and the like who picked up and dropped off boxed and wrapped items would also be charged. I wonder if there are more delivery drivers put in jail than accountants and lawyers?

I have worked in Prisons and with offenders. About 5%of them are people who are genuinly bad. The rest are people with mental heath problems, illiterate and innumerate, addiction problems, and sometimes just made stupid decisions.

When Nunn had all his money he would have been like a kid in a candy store, and probably surrounded by leeches and hangers on. Sports stars can earn huge amounts, but sadly because of bad education, bad advice many often end up broke. The same happens with lottery and pools winners. I didnt agree with what Nunn did, I have seen many lives ruined by drugs, but I can try and understand the temptations.

I tend to reserve my more hostile feelings for those who have all the advantages in life and yet still either legally or illegally want more, and who continue to get away with it, and like you I bet the poor sod from the delivery company is the guy who will end up carrying the can.

This is the man charged with reforming welfare

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ia ... st-1810086

This is an argument that will 'rage' until the end of time. I have known good people in prison. If you are committing a crime, you are aware of what you are doing then you must face the possibility of doing time. Many of my friends who have been career criminals accept that they must take the rough with the smooth. It is simple as this in my view. If you do a crime you must do time if you are caught.
If someone sold drugs to my daughter (or pushed it upon her etc) then I would not want that person on the street anymore. Simple as.
I want more money, most people do but I would not do illegal activities to do so. I would rather live in a dignified 'poverty' like I grew up with, than do something illegal.

I do agree with an earlier poster who said there must be some legalisation for drugs as the fight on narcotics is not being won. It's a tough one...

[palooka]

I understand your point evrenb and there are 2 people in a drug trade, if your daughter sought out someone and drove to meet them, took the money to buy the drugs and was aware of what she was buying and the risks involved why should only one of the parties involved be punished? If the person selling is so dangerous what about the buyer who is likely to tell friends about the drugs and their experience thereby promoting it, what if your daughter was buying a bit more to pass to a friend? Should the streets be cleansed of her?

(this is not an attack or a snide post )

[evrenb]

I understand your point evrenb and there are 2 people in a drug trade, if your daughter sought out someone and drove to meet them, took the money to buy the drugs and was aware of what she was buying and the risks involved why should only one of the parties involved be punished? If the person selling is so dangerous what about the buyer who is likely to tell friends about the drugs and their experience thereby promoting it, what if your daughter was buying a bit more to pass to a friend? Should the streets be cleansed of her?

(this is not an attack or a snide post )

Hi Palooka

I take your point 100% and I agree. If my daughter did that and new the risks/law then she should be punished as such. None of my family have ever been involved (me certainly not). In regards to the law I would think dealing it would carry a higher sentence than taking (buying it for personal use). I would think that each case is individual also. Did the pusher pressurise my daughter??

As said - difficult one..

[palooka]

I understand your point evrenb and there are 2 people in a drug trade, if your daughter sought out someone and drove to meet them, took the money to buy the drugs and was aware of what she was buying and the risks involved why should only one of the parties involved be punished? If the person selling is so dangerous what about the buyer who is likely to tell friends about the drugs and their experience thereby promoting it, what if your daughter was buying a bit more to pass to a friend? Should the streets be cleansed of her?

(this is not an attack or a snide post )

Hi Palooka

I take your point 100% and I agree. If my daughter did that and new the risks/law then she should be punished as such. None of my family have ever been involved (me certainly not). In regards to the law I would think dealing it would carry a higher sentence than taking (buying it for personal use). I would think that each case is individual also. Did the pusher pressurise my daughter??

As said - difficult one..

Thanks for your answer evrenb,

I was involved a long time ago and can say that it's generally the user chasing the dealer around, even if someone is a recreational user and not habitual it is seen that it is the dealer of the drug who is doing the user a favour by selling to them. Hope it's always a hypothetical for you and yours

[evrenb]

I understand your point evrenb and there are 2 people in a drug trade, if your daughter sought out someone and drove to meet them, took the money to buy the drugs and was aware of what she was buying and the risks involved why should only one of the parties involved be punished? If the person selling is so dangerous what about the buyer who is likely to tell friends about the drugs and their experience thereby promoting it, what if your daughter was buying a bit more to pass to a friend? Should the streets be cleansed of her?

(this is not an attack or a snide post )

Hi Palooka

I take your point 100% and I agree. If my daughter did that and new the risks/law then she should be punished as such. None of my family have ever been involved (me certainly not). In regards to the law I would think dealing it would carry a higher sentence than taking (buying it for personal use). I would think that each case is individual also. Did the pusher pressurise my daughter??

As said - difficult one..

Thanks for your answer evrenb,

I was involved a long time ago and can say that it's generally the user chasing the dealer around, even if someone is a recreational user and not habitual it is seen that it is the dealer of the drug who is doing the user a favour by selling to them. Hope it's always a hypothetical for you and yours

I hope so...and yes, sadly I bet that is true...it is so rife that it is scary! I would hope that the criminal justice system would be more sympathetic with someone who bought a joint than a 'dealer' who was caught buying a kilo!

[palooka]

I hope so...and yes, sadly I bet that is true...it is so rife that it is scary! I would hope that the criminal justice system would be more sympathetic with someone who bought a joint than a 'dealer' who was caught buying a kilo![/quote]

The justice system is more sympathetic to someone who buys a joint and without 1,000 people who want to buy a joint or a bit of weed the dealer wouldn't buy a kilo. The drug problem is demand led, where there is a demand the drugs will flow and the money flows the other way - the flow of drugs may slow when the people who aid and abet the flow of money are held to account.

[evrenb]

I hope so...and yes, sadly I bet that is true...it is so rife that it is scary! I would hope that the criminal justice system would be more sympathetic with someone who bought a joint than a 'dealer' who was caught buying a kilo!

The justice system is more sympathetic to someone who buys a joint and without 1,000 people who want to buy a joint or a bit of weed the dealer wouldn't buy a kilo. The drug problem is demand led, where there is a demand the drugs will flow and the money flows the other way - the flow of drugs may slow when the people who aid and abet the flow of money are held to account.[/quote]

A scary chain of events..what is happening in Mexico is very scary!!
Where does the buck lay? With the user?

[palooka]

I hope so...and yes, sadly I bet that is true...it is so rife that it is scary! I would hope that the criminal justice system would be more sympathetic with someone who bought a joint than a 'dealer' who was caught buying a kilo!

The justice system is more sympathetic to someone who buys a joint and without 1,000 people who want to buy a joint or a bit of weed the dealer wouldn't buy a kilo. The drug problem is demand led, where there is a demand the drugs will flow and the money flows the other way - the flow of drugs may slow when the people who aid and abet the flow of money are held to account.

A scary chain of events..what is happening in Mexico is very scary!!
Where does the buck lay? With the user?[/quote]


I'd say that many people are complicit, if you choose to use drugs then you're involved in a larger degree than just a commercial interaction; you mention Mexico and the lawless and chaotic mess that many cities are in. The politicians and army are in the cartels neck deep.

There is a really detailed and interesting book called 'The Politics Of Heroin' that details the US intelligence agencies involvement in massive heroin distribution and importation. The money is used for 'off the book' and clandestine operations.

The demand is so high that it is a huge industry and the money does not get sent to the moon, it is spent and invested in the wider economy. There are millions of people involved in the trade at different levels, there are very dangerous drugs and less dangerous and there are 10's of millions or 100's of millions of regular users.

The hysteria is massive - people have used dangerous drugs for a long time and have been punished for it; those profitting the most and pulling the strings and directing the show are very rarely brought to book.

[TheWigwam]

I'm all for tougher sentencing in general but I think his was a bit harsh