What next for Froch and Groves

[Bard of Boxrec]

Golovkin punches through walls...Froch blocks everything with his chin. Whilst most people are blown away by GGG, I worry Froch is so tough he takes to omuch.

I like GGG but noone he faced has really got his respect yet. Froch hits hard enough to slow him down. I could see it go either way though. Too bad the fight won't happen.

[expe]

Froch has a few different options, the best of which are probably DeGale here or Chavez Jr in Vegas. Golovkin would simply be a prolonged beating, a Ward fight would mean another defeat and they'd struggle to get it on in Vegas, Ward isn't enough of a draw for that. A third Kessler fight is an option, as is fighting Hopkins in the US. It will obviously come down to money, but he also wants to fight in Vegas and I doubt he wants to go out on a defeat. There's also the physical impacts to consider, fighting Golovkin, Chavez and Kessler would inevitably mean another hard fight, can his body stand up to that sort of punishment anymore and does he want to go through that again?

For Groves the picture is a bit unclear, he could jump straight into a fight with Abraham or Bika, but a third defeat in a row could be curtains for him. For me the best and most likely option for him is to return on the undercard of Abraham-Smith, which seems nailed on to happen at this stage, then fight the winner, in what would be a very winnable fight for him, then potentially leading to a return fight with DeGale if the two continue to win.

[freddydoesdallas]

Froch - retirement when the offer in vegas is relatively small

Groves - 2 ibuprofen, an ice pack and some humble pie

[Boxerbeetle]

Froch vs GGG in Vegas would be absolutely superb. Although I think GGG would destroy Froch & send him into retirement, so part of me doesn't want it to happen, would be a shame to see Froch brutally knocked out in his final fight.

[SteveDow]

Fair play to Froch last night. I fancied Groves but he never adopted the right tactics last night and was never really in range until round 7.

I'd love to see Froch v GGG but they won't take that fight and I can't blame them. Realistically Degale or Chavez Jnr would be the next I'd have thought. Have no interest in Kessler 3 which would be very one-sided in favour of Carl. I don't think he could beat Ward and so no real interest in that either.

Groves, I think he needs a confidence builder and then Abraham which I'd fancy him in.

[Cyclops]

Froch should do his fight with Chavez jnr in Vegas and then retire. I'd love to see a GGG fight but at the end of the day, I think Carl's had a great career and Golovkin is a very very hard man and Froch doesn't need to be taking punches like that anymore: he should have one more fight- and I'm very confident he'd beat Chavez- and then call it a day on a brilliant career.

I think Carl knows that Ward is just a better fighter and he won't beat him. Ward's silly anyway. After the Kessler rematch he was there at the fight, with this massive crowd and this huge atmosphere, saying "If Froch wants to fight me he has to come and fight me in Oakland etc..." which is alright, you know he's the best and the champ and all that, but look at what happened. Froch is doing 80,000 and making millions doing his own thing and what's Ward doing? If he'd have said "sure I'll come to the UK and beat him in front of his own fans" then he'd be a lot richer and a lot more people would know him but he "doesn't have to do that" so that rematch won't happen. What's in it for Carl? Why go and fight in a hostile atmosphere in front of a relatively tiny crowd in a fight you're almost certain to lose at a time when your fanbase will be asleep in bed for a relatively crappy payday? Would you do it? Why should he? It's not like he ducked him or anything. He fought Ward already, came up short and doesn't need to do it again.

Groves, in his loss, still has so many options. He's so well known now and he's a very good fighter. There's Abraham and Bika. There's Degale. I mean, he could probably get a Ward fight still. Who's really out there for Ward at SMW? He's beaten everyone. I don't think people would look down on Groves as an opponent for Ward. Groves is a really good fighter. He can really box. He did more of a number on Froch in the first fight that Ward did even in the loss so I think it's a good fight. I was all Froch last night but I'd support George against anybody else. Well... I do have a lot of love for Bika. I'd like to see that fight really.

[lefty]

I wonder how Groves will get up for his next fight. 80,000 at Wembley to a re-building mission is gonna be a hell of a comedown.

I think Groves could have a psychological meltdown generally to be honest. He talked a lot of crap in the build up about how terrible Froch is and how he'd beat any version of Froch on any day of the week, etc. I think he could be damaged by this defeat.

[lefty]

GGG and another fight with Kessler are also options for Froch ... both of which he is unlikely to accept.

Ward will beat Froch 10 times out of 10, so why take that fight for less money than fighting Chavez Jr or Degale? ....

He's never really struck me as a guy to not accept fights or challenges though. The chavez jnr fight is the best one for him though.

[lefty]

Any number of options for Carl Froch. I'd be excited for any of these in the following order.

1. GGG
2. Julio Cesar Chavez Jr.
3. James Degale
4. Andre Ward
5. Mikkel Kessler III

for George Groves there are plenty of interesting options too.

1. Arthur Abraham (someone mentioned this as an option for him, I like it)
2. Degale

....hell what about George Groves vs Brian Vera? I think that could be interesting.

Robert Stieglitz likely wouldn't leave Germany to fight Groves, and I doubt Groves would go there, but Brian Vera would go to England to fight Groves I'd be willing to bet. He's a credible opponent most definitely I'd say.

So is someone like a Marco Antonio Periban.

Groves would destroy Vera.

[Ian1973]

I wonder how Groves will get up for his next fight. 80,000 at Wembley to a re-building mission is gonna be a hell of a comedown.

I think Groves could have a psychological meltdown generally to be honest. He talked a lot of crap in the build up about how terrible Froch is and how he'd beat any version of Froch on any day of the week, etc. I think he could be damaged by this defeat.

I do as well sadly.

Groves is a fighter and a man that has huge belief and self confidence, that must be shot now though.

Groves is a skilled boxer, no doubt and he can bang a bit but there is always going to be a huge doubt now (even more than before) that he can compete at the highest level in the Championship rounds. Even Groves must now doubt that.

He'll give anyone in the world a fight for four or five rounds but that's not enough when you get into the elite league.

[Taansend]

Will be interesting to see who - and where - Groves fights next.

Will Kalle have him rebuild in Europe? And at what level?

[Old Jack J]

Am I right in thinking that because froch has fought 2 mandatory then he doesn't have to fight degale or relinquish his ibf belt?

If thats the case, Chavez jr will be in vegas this winter?

Groves will have to fight a bum before the sauerland clash with abraham.

Would be nice if paul smith got lucky. Sauerland would be pissed then.

[expe]

Am I right in thinking that because froch has fought 2 mandatory then he doesn't have to fight degale or relinquish his ibf belt?

If thats the case, Chavez jr will be in vegas this winter?

Groves will have to fight a bum before the sauerland clash with abraham.

Would be nice if paul smith got lucky. Sauerland would be pissed then.

I think that is possible, although the IBF are strict on mandatories and I doubt he would be allowed more than 9 months, which doesn't fit in with his usual schedule of a fight every 6 months, but if he only intends to fight one more time that won't matter to him. Even if Smith gets lucky and beats Abraham, Sauerland will have options in the contract, as is standard for a voluntary defence and would simply feed him to Groves for his first defence, although they would prefer Abraham to come out victorious.

[TheCobra]

Froch - definitely an easy-ish fight in Vegas and then retire, he's got nothing to prove now, we know what he is, what he can do and what he can't do. I'm sure from his point of view he might want Andre Ward again but there seems little point really and there's a good chance he'd end his career in defeat if it is to be his last fight, which no-one wants.

Groves - Not sure really, that was a hard KO, Groves was so bullish, so cocksure, everything he did previously has been smashed open now - who knows he could do a Bute. It may take him a long time to mentally recover from this so he needs a couple of confidence builders - he really did seem to believe in himself so much and used his talking to really build a believeable story for himself of how good he was. I'd take him to do Abraham though so if he can be manoevered into that one then he could still get a world title, it just all depends how much this has damaged his confidence.

[dragons]

Froch - definitely an easy-ish fight in Vegas and then retire, he's got nothing to prove now, we know what he is, what he can do and what he can't do. I'm sure from his point of view he might want Andre Ward again but there seems little point really and there's a good chance he'd end his career in defeat if it is to be his last fight, which no-one wants.

Groves - Not sure really, that was a hard KO, Groves was so bullish, so cocksure, everything he did previously has been smashed open now - who knows he could do a Bute. It may take him a long time to mentally recover from this so he needs a couple of confidence builders - he really did seem to believe in himself so much and used his talking to really build a believeable story for himself of how good he was. I'd take him to do Abraham though so if he can be manoevered into that one then he could still get a world title, it just all depends how much this has damaged his confidence.

Chavez JR would be easy fight IMO
Would much rather see Froch fight a big name in Vegas GGG or Ward then retire.

[brian13]

For Groves a fight Stieglitz makes sense. Going with Sauerland is smart move given stable Sauerland have.

Froch will probably go Vegas but Chavez is in a dispute with Top Rank. So time will tell.

[n1ebf]

stumbled across Froch on a London-based sports radio show last night. They had Degale on there too, but separately.
Degale said something about a fight and when Froch realised who it was on the line he started laughing. Very, very dismissive of him. They then interviewed Froch for 5 minutes which was quite interesting.
He said a Degale fight isn't big enough (then started chuckling again when he mentioned his name).
When asked about Ward he said that whilst he lost, Ward holds too much and accused the American of being a "bit boring" and saying that the reason he doesn't fight much is because HBO won't let him, something along them lines...He said he's a prizefighter and wants to fight for the most cash - he said a fight with Golovkin, or with Chavez would be a no brainer over Ward or James Degale.

Personally I think that whilst James seems to have become mandatory contender (in which case doesn't that mean Froch will have to fight him, or give up his belt?)...and it wouldn't be as one-sided as Froch makes out, the risk is that Degale would be too soft around the edges for him. Too young? Not enough hard, championship rounds in the bag? Sound familiar?

[stujones]

Froch - Can see JCC, would like Degale, would love Stevenson at Super Middle.

Groves - Can see Markussen as a warm up (or Magee if not retired) then onto Bika.

Bika is about 100 years old and whilst dirty is not that good really.

I would say Bika next for Groves if somehow Saurland can persuade the WBC to give a fighter who has had 2 successive defeats a shot.

[ILikeBeer]

GGG and another fight with Kessler are also options for Froch ... both of which he is unlikely to accept.

Ward will beat Froch 10 times out of 10, so why take that fight for less money than fighting Chavez Jr or Degale? ....

Pretty much.

Froch has never ducked anybody, but everybody knows that. There's nothing to prove on that score. I'd expect a rematch from Froch if he was in his mid-twenties, but at Carl's age he only has one fight, maybe two left.

He's fought Ward once and was well beaten. If they fought again, it's very likely to be the same result. There's no real reason for Carl to fight Ward, given that he won't win and he'll make a lot less money. Unless he's absolutely hell bent on trying to avenge his loss, there's not a lot of point in this fight in terms of Carl's legacy or financial reward. It's just a rehash of something that happened earlier in his career.

Chavez Jr or DeGale may not be in Ward's leage, but if he can fight Chavez in Vegas or DeGale in the UK each for more money than he'd make for Ward, they'd be more attractive options.

[stujones]

n1ebf

Re - your comment on Degale being too young... I know your point your making, so not a go at you. However, this highlights the issues with ultra cautious promoting at the start of their career. He is a 6 year pro, in his mid 20's. Floyd was already P4P number 1 status and a multiple world champion at this stage.

It was like Kalle Saurland insisting at 26 George is a baby.... No, George is at the peak of his powers physically now or within the next year.

I just don't like the boat being missed on talent, some people (and I think with good reason) believe Hatton was already slightly on the slide when he faced Tszyu - he certainly could have gained more stateside appeal had he been left off the leash sooner and fought the likes of Vivian Harries etc at 23/24.

[Sklar]

Froch is at his best in the days and weeks following a fight. He's much more relaxed than when he's in training and talks absolute sense. In the interviews I've seen/heard since Saturday I've not disagreed with him on anything.

[n1ebf]

n1ebf

Re - your comment on Degale being too young... I know your point your making, so not a go at you. However, this highlights the issues with ultra cautious promoting at the start of their career. He is a 6 year pro, in his mid 20's. Floyd was already P4P number 1 status and a multiple world champion at this stage.

It was like Kalle Saurland insisting at 26 George is a baby.... No, George is at the peak of his powers physically now or within the next year.

I just don't like the boat being missed on talent, some people (and I think with good reason) believe Hatton was already slightly on the slide when he faced Tszyu - he certainly could have gained more stateside appeal had he been left off the leash sooner and fought the likes of Vivian Harries etc at 23/24.

I see your POV also mate but in my opinion how can you say Groves is at or, very soon to be at, his physical peak. Maybe 50 years ago he might have been mate but these days that's just false. By that logic Froch should not have stood a chance. I read Froch in the paper on Monday saying that "Groves lacks that toughness at the top, top level".....and that he himself was "born with it". I agree with it to a small extent but it ain't conclusive....you can be frightened 12 year old in a school-playground and go on to become an absolute lion. Boxing is known for scared kids learning how to fight. The decisive factor in the fight was only indirectly age-related if you ask me - and that's because one has been boxing at the top level for 10 years longer than the other.

Some fighters seem to turn pro and within a year or two they're battering the top men - Hagler/ Chavez/ Tyson come to mind. Others need more experience. Generally speaking I agree with you tho that stagnating is not good. It's quite an individual thing at the end of the day.

[danconnollyeire]

Golovkin punches through walls...Froch blocks everything with his chin. Whilst most people are blown away by GGG, I worry Froch is so tough he takes to omuch.

I like GGG but noone he faced has really got his respect yet. Froch hits hard enough to slow him down. I could see it go either way though. Too bad the fight won't happen.

I worry that Froch's persistent face blocking will lead to complications a few years down the line

[palooka]

I hope Froch gets his big bout in Vegas or San Antonio v Chavez Jnr - it'd be a pretty good scrap and would draw a big big crowd if they were clever with the dates (which they are).

There's not a lot of point in fighting Kessler again - it's just going over old ground, the first 2 fights were very good but there's just no need.

I hope Groves has a break and comes back against a top 15 boxer, I don't think he needs to change trainer etc, he did well v Froch first bout and OK 2nd and got sparked - it happens.

[brian13]

I hope Froch gets his big bout in Vegas or San Antonio v Chavez Jnr - it'd be a pretty good scrap and would draw a big big crowd if they were clever with the dates (which they are).

Why on earth would Froch go to Texas, it is just as bad as Germany.