Tszyu-Phillips II

Sweet P · Post by **Sweet P** » 26 Dec 2005, 08:27

I have just heard that Kostya Tszyu is going to face Vince Phillips in a rematch in 2006. They said he wanted Judah but he is fighting Mayweather. It will be good to see were Tszyu is at after the loss, Also will make the 2 of them plenty of cash.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 26 Dec 2005, 09:45

Frigging hell, 2006 is fast turning into a pantomime. Tszyu-Phillips II now?!?! Groan...

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 26 Dec 2005, 15:16

Just heard Duran-Laing II has been signed, no venue as of yet though.

glahn · Post by **glahn** » 26 Dec 2005, 17:45

Our prayers have been answered...

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 26 Dec 2005, 19:14

Tszyu would win this time.

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 26 Dec 2005, 19:39

I'm not so sure. Phillips has just beaten Kelson Pinto

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 26 Dec 2005, 20:35

Well Tszyu has been such an inactive fighter even before the inuries when he was already starting to fight only once a year.

jeej · Post by **jeej** » 26 Dec 2005, 21:08

I think Tszyu's a great bloke, but I actually think there is no honour in going for these "revenge" fights so much later in your career.

Obviously it's a bit diff for Tszyu cos he is on the decline too, but Judah going after Tszyu is just low in my book. What honour is there in saying "I avenged my loss to a guy who is now only a shell of what he was when he first beat me"???

Ok, so it might look good on your record to have avenged a loss, but I just dont personally think it's anything to be particularly proud of to beat a guy who is now a lot worse at boxing as when he beat you before.

Just my thoughts anyway.

coneye · Post by **coneye** » 26 Dec 2005, 21:51

Thing is though if Zoo was a shot fighter going into the ring it don't make Hatton 's win the great fight everyone things , because it simply was not a walkover it was a good fight, fair enough Hatton won , but you cannott proclaim Hatton a great boxer based on one win over what most are now percieving to be a over the hill ZOO, Especially when he's now looking towards Gatti,
Said it before maybee now Ricky's looking after his own carreer , if thew big fights don't come when we know the yanks want them , well maybee all along it was Hatton and his father pickin and choosi9ng and we owe allegedly an aplology

jeej · Post by **jeej** » 27 Dec 2005, 04:05

coneye wrote:Thing is though if Zoo was a shot fighter going into the ring it don't make Hatton 's win the great fight everyone things , because it simply was not a walkover it was a good fight, fair enough Hatton won , but you cannott proclaim Hatton a great boxer based on one win over what most are now percieving to be a over the hill ZOO, Especially when he's now looking towards Gatti,
Said it before maybee now Ricky's looking after his own carreer , if thew big fights don't come when we know the yanks want them , well maybee all along it was Hatton and his father pickin and choosi9ng and we owe allegedly an aplology

Everyone knows this. But it was Tszyu's first sighting of being on the downward spiral, like a passing of the torch if you like. But to now chase after the man now he has been exposed as being on a downward spiral is just low.

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 27 Dec 2005, 09:41

jeej wrote:I think Tszyu's a great bloke, but I actually think there is no honour in going for these "revenge" fights so much later in your career.

Obviously it's a bit diff for Tszyu cos he is on the decline too, but Judah going after Tszyu is just low in my book. What honour is there in saying "I avenged my loss to a guy who is now only a shell of what he was when he first beat me"???

Ok, so it might look good on your record to have avenged a loss, but I just dont personally think it's anything to be particularly proud of to beat a guy who is now a lot worse at boxing as when he beat you before.

Just my thoughts anyway.

Judah always wanted a rematch though (although they both agreed there wouldnt be 1). Given the circumstances the first fight ended a rematch has its merit. How far gone is Zoo? The Phillips fight should tell us allot. Saying Judahs only chasing after Zoo because hes past his best simply isn't true.

jeej · Post by **jeej** » 27 Dec 2005, 09:49

Phenomenal-Nutrition wrote:
jeej wrote:I think Tszyu's a great bloke, but I actually think there is no honour in going for these "revenge" fights so much later in your career.

Obviously it's a bit diff for Tszyu cos he is on the decline too, but Judah going after Tszyu is just low in my book. What honour is there in saying "I avenged my loss to a guy who is now only a shell of what he was when he first beat me"???

Ok, so it might look good on your record to have avenged a loss, but I just dont personally think it's anything to be particularly proud of to beat a guy who is now a lot worse at boxing as when he beat you before.

Just my thoughts anyway.
Judah always wanted a rematch though (although they both agreed there wouldnt be 1). Given the circumstances the first fight ended a rematch has its merit. How far gone is Zoo? The Phillips fight should tell us allot. Saying Judahs only chasing after Zoo because hes past his best simply isn't true.

But surely now he should just think that given how far Tszyu is past his best that it is no longer worth any merit in chasing him?

It wasn't a question of Judah only chasing him cos he is past his best, it's more a case of that being an undeniable fact that Tszyu is past his best, so any other factors are now irrelevant. It is what it is. If Judah fights him and beats him, I wont see Judah as some valiant warrior that avenged a loss.

Anyway, like you said, the Phillips fight will show us for sure what Tszyu has left in the tank.

probox · Post by **probox** » 27 Dec 2005, 11:22

lets get it on and see what kostya has left.

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 27 Dec 2005, 17:34

jeej wrote:
Phenomenal-Nutrition wrote:
jeej wrote:I think Tszyu's a great bloke, but I actually think there is no honour in going for these "revenge" fights so much later in your career.

Obviously it's a bit diff for Tszyu cos he is on the decline too, but Judah going after Tszyu is just low in my book. What honour is there in saying "I avenged my loss to a guy who is now only a shell of what he was when he first beat me"???

Ok, so it might look good on your record to have avenged a loss, but I just dont personally think it's anything to be particularly proud of to beat a guy who is now a lot worse at boxing as when he beat you before.

Just my thoughts anyway.
Judah always wanted a rematch though (although they both agreed there wouldnt be 1). Given the circumstances the first fight ended a rematch has its merit. How far gone is Zoo? The Phillips fight should tell us allot. Saying Judahs only chasing after Zoo because hes past his best simply isn't true.
But surely now he should just think that given how far Tszyu is past his best that it is no longer worth any merit in chasing him?

It wasn't a question of Judah only chasing him cos he is past his best, it's more a case of that being an undeniable fact that Tszyu is past his best, so any other factors are now irrelevant. It is what it is. If Judah fights him and beats him, I wont see Judah as some valiant warrior that avenged a loss.

Anyway, like you said, the Phillips fight will show us for sure what Tszyu has left in the tank.

Phillips is a very good fight for Zoo - Phillips won't get blasted out early, he'll make Zoo work for 12 and it gets him a revenge of sorts.

Judah will want to exercise his demons - was the McCall that fought Lewis prime? Nope but avenging a loss is always better than not avenging 1 - if the fighters shot or not.

jeej · Post by **jeej** » 27 Dec 2005, 17:36

Then I view Lewis in the same light for that.

I'm not saying these boxers shouldn't do this, I'm just saying that from a personal point of view I dont see much honour in doing it.

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 27 Dec 2005, 18:38

Bare in mind Tyuzu would not be an easy style for Judah even now, but whos to say that Tyuzu is that much worse now than when he fought Judah. He said he was at his best ever form in the build upto Hatton - now that could be best ever 3 punch combo having lost his round by round workrate or it could be best ever package hes been. Maybe he'd never of been able to handle Hattons pace of fighting (bare in mind I'm a reknowned Hatton Hater round here saying this). I also personally think Judahs always been better than Tyuzu but he screwed up when they fought.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 28 Dec 2005, 08:34

We don't really know how far gone Tszyu is though...

May I remind everyone that he was knocking the shit out of Hatton in the middle rounds of that fight, in fact it looked like he was roaring away with it, certainly on my scorecards.

It was only the last third of the fight he started to wilt, and lets face it, that's no disgrace against a fighter with a phenomenal workrate like Hatton.

Tszyu may still be able to beat anyone else in the division for all we know.

Sweet P · Post by **Sweet P** » 28 Dec 2005, 10:24

jamesmcdonnell wrote:We don't really know how far gone Tszyu is though...

May I remind everyone that he was knocking the shit out of Hatton in the middle rounds of that fight, in fact it looked like he was roaring away with it, certainly on my scorecards.

It was only the last third of the fight he started to wilt, and lets face it, that's no disgrace against a fighter with a phenomenal workrate like Hatton.

Tszyu may still be able to beat anyone else in the division for all we know.

I was thinking the same thing, Maybe the low blow took the wind out of his sails.He had won the 6th -8th on my card and was looking good.

Cannibal · Post by **Cannibal** » 28 Dec 2005, 10:31

The Tszyu against Hatton would of blown away everyone else at Light Welter with the exception of Mayweather.

J · Post by J » 28 Dec 2005, 10:34

I think zoo has the best style to beat mayweather.

you need to power to put him away if you get the chance.

kostya eats slicksters for din din

its the in your face fighters he has troubles with.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 28 Dec 2005, 18:20

interesting matchup. However, Mayweather isn't just a dancer, he throws a lot of shots. The guys Tszyu eat up were stick and move merchants, who didn't have the power to keep him off, Mayweather lands combinations whilst standing right in the pocket, he's just so hard to nail with a clean shot.

Tszyu's power is pretty phenomenal, he can stop someone with 1 shot and his timing was his best weapon. Nothing fancy, and not the best defence in the world, but supreme power and strength.

Good call though Cool Vince was all up in his grill the whole fight and just wore him down. I bet team Hatton studied that fight.

Boxer-Slugger · Post by **Boxer-Slugger** » 28 Dec 2005, 20:50

Max Molyneux wrote:Tszyu would win this time.

I share that comment

J · Post by J » 29 Dec 2005, 05:18

jamesmcdonnell wrote:interesting matchup. However, Mayweather isn't just a dancer, he throws a lot of shots. The guys Tszyu eat up were stick and move merchants, who didn't have the power to keep him off, Mayweather lands combinations whilst standing right in the pocket, he's just so hard to nail with a clean shot.

Tszyu's power is pretty phenomenal, he can stop someone with 1 shot and his timing was his best weapon. Nothing fancy, and not the best defence in the world, but supreme power and strength.

Good call though Cool Vince was all up in his grill the whole fight and just wore him down. I bet team Hatton studied that fight.

agreed but .......
I wouldnt call zab a stick and move merchant. Also its interesting if Kostya won would he be the first to do a double of father and son?

Sweet P · Post by **Sweet P** » 30 Dec 2005, 01:52

J wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:interesting matchup. However, Mayweather isn't just a dancer, he throws a lot of shots. The guys Tszyu eat up were stick and move merchants, who didn't have the power to keep him off, Mayweather lands combinations whilst standing right in the pocket, he's just so hard to nail with a clean shot.

Tszyu's power is pretty phenomenal, he can stop someone with 1 shot and his timing was his best weapon. Nothing fancy, and not the best defence in the world, but supreme power and strength.

Good call though Cool Vince was all up in his grill the whole fight and just wore him down. I bet team Hatton studied that fight.

agreed but .......
I wouldnt call zab a stick and move merchant. Also its interesting if Kostya won would he be the first to do a double of father and son?

He beat his Uncle Roger if im not mistaken.

jeej · Post by **jeej** » 30 Dec 2005, 02:57

Ben Keilty wrote:
J wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:interesting matchup. However, Mayweather isn't just a dancer, he throws a lot of shots. The guys Tszyu eat up were stick and move merchants, who didn't have the power to keep him off, Mayweather lands combinations whilst standing right in the pocket, he's just so hard to nail with a clean shot.

Tszyu's power is pretty phenomenal, he can stop someone with 1 shot and his timing was his best weapon. Nothing fancy, and not the best defence in the world, but supreme power and strength.

Good call though Cool Vince was all up in his grill the whole fight and just wore him down. I bet team Hatton studied that fight.

agreed but .......
I wouldnt call zab a stick and move merchant. Also its interesting if Kostya won would he be the first to do a double of father and son?
He beat his Uncle Roger if im not mistaken.

That's what he is referring to, I think. Still, uncle/nephew combo anyway.