Do you believe that Margarito may have cheated in previous bouts prior to the Cotto fight? Did anyone notice the way Sebastian Lujan's ear was hanging off his head?
I've never seen a fighter's ear get torn off his head like that in any sport, the UFC uses far smaller gloves and most of the fighters have cauliflower ear (especially Caucasian fighters) and they get hit with those small gloves and I've never seen their ears get ripped off like that.
I remember when he totally starched Six Heads Lewis and I've never seen Margarito punch anyone else with one shot like that and put them to sleep. I know it was proven that he was a cheater when he faced SSM and quite possible the rematch vs Cotto (whose face didn't look like it did in the first fight afterwards), but what are your thoughts on this?
I was a big Margarito fan and meet him a few times when he gambled at the casino I worked at in San Diego. Very nice bloke to talk to. Chilled and down to earth.
My own feeling is that he went along with his coach and they were using loaded gloves for many fights before he got caught. But that's just speculation on my part.
I also feel that the majority of successful boxers are cheating on one way or another. It's human nature. We are scoundrels by nature.
KBB wrote:
I've never seen a fighter's ear get torn off his head like that in any sport, the UFC uses far smaller gloves and most of the fighters have cauliflower ear (especially Caucasian fighters) and they get hit with those small gloves and I've never seen their ears get ripped off like that.
Just recently it happened to Leslie Smith. A few other high profile fighters it happened to was Sakuraba, Uchiyama, and James Thompson.
It's possible that it was just a perfect combination of factors.
KBB wrote:
I've never seen a fighter's ear get torn off his head like that in any sport, the UFC uses far smaller gloves and most of the fighters have cauliflower ear (especially Caucasian fighters) and they get hit with those small gloves and I've never seen their ears get ripped off like that.
Just recently it happened to Leslie Smith. A few other high profile fighters it happened to was Sakuraba, Uchiyama, and James Thompson.
It's possible that it was just a perfect combination of factors.
Now I can accept it happening moreso in the UFC than I can in boxing, they wear smaller gloves and as I stated earlier many of them have that cauliflower ear which makes their ears easier to being cut but when in this sport of boxing have you ever seen a fighter with his/her ear(s) hanging in the way that Lujan's is??
KBB wrote:
I've never seen a fighter's ear get torn off his head like that in any sport, the UFC uses far smaller gloves and most of the fighters have cauliflower ear (especially Caucasian fighters) and they get hit with those small gloves and I've never seen their ears get ripped off like that.
Just recently it happened to Leslie Smith. A few other high profile fighters it happened to was Sakuraba, Uchiyama, and James Thompson.
It's possible that it was just a perfect combination of factors.
Now I can accept it happening moreso in the UFC than I can in boxing, they wear smaller gloves and as I stated earlier many of them have that cauliflower ear which makes their ears easier to being cut but when in this sport of boxing have you ever seen a fighter with his/her ear(s) hanging in the way that Lujan's is??
It's not so much of a cut as it is a rip. I haven't seen the Margarito Lujan fight in a few years, but I would imagine the damage came from the glove being raked across the ear during a punch rather than by a punch landing cleanly and cutting it. So as I said, it may have just been a perfect storm sort of thing. I can't think of any other boxers left with a hanging ear like that though.
Margacheato is nothing more than a cheater. Glad to see that between Pac and Cotto they turned him into a permanent Cyclops. Piece of garbage plain and simple.
I think it is safe to say Margarito cheated in quite a few of his previous bouts. I also think it is pretty sad the way Manny and Arum lobbied to help get him a boxing license so he could fight Manny. Reward a guy like that with a big payday?
All boxers, whether they make the hall or not, should have a * by their name for all their wins if they were caught doing or taking anything illegal. Taking away their wins isn't going to happen, but we can at least allow history to show their victories were tainted. I am still an advocate for a first offense lifetime ban for any positive PEDS test, or doing something like Margarito did.
In my eyes, there is no excuse for anyone trying to illegally get an unfair advantage. I would go as far as to ban all that have been caught with any type of PEDS to the HOF as well. Hell, Pete Rose is still banned for decades from the HOF in baseball for illegal betting.
The thing is, if the rule is not strict and unforgiving, everyone will continue to take chances, and our kids will follow. Have a strict ban or no rules at all. Anything in-between is an absolute fornicating joke.
Badhusker wrote:In my eyes, there is no excuse for anyone trying to illegally get an unfair advantage. I would go as far as to ban all that have been caught with any type of PEDS to the HOF as well. Hell, Pete Rose is still banned for decades from the HOF in baseball for illegal betting.
The thing is, if the rule is not strict and unforgiving, everyone will continue to take chances, and our kids will follow. Have a strict ban or no rules at all. Anything in-between is an absolute effing joke.
I agree that in-betweens are pointless. I'd like to see PEDs legalized in sport and society. Education and access would greatly reduce the amount of problems we are seeing from them today.
i am still puzzled that one could get away
frequently with loaded gloves. i mean this
is the one thing of all preparation that is
done with the other team in attendance.
i imagine if you load gloves you do all sort
of PEDs without thinking twice. truth is that
while margarito is a cheater, it is cotto's
camp to blame if they didn't find out before
their first fight. protect yourself at all times
starts in the dressing room of the other guy.
man wrote:i am still puzzled that one could get away
frequently with loaded gloves. i mean this
is the one thing of all preparation that is
done with the other team in attendance.
i imagine if you load gloves you do all sort
of PEDs without thinking twice. truth is that
while margarito is a cheater, it is cotto's
camp to blame if they didn't find out before
their first fight. protect yourself at all times
starts in the dressing room of the other guy.
I agree with this 100%, when Hopkins fought Tito his camp (Brother Nazim) went in Trinidad's dressing room and found that he had been layering gobs of tape over the outside of his wrapping which produced a hardened/almost cast-like wrap; fortunately for BHop they made him re-wrap the hands without using that extra layer of tape.
When SSM fought Margo again Bro Nazim went in to see the hands getting wrapped and that's when they discovered the loaded pads full of Plaster of Paris (the same substance they make casts out of) and instantly those were taken as evidence, I thought right then and there the fight should've been cancelled, Margo and his entire team should've been banned from the sport for life (if they did it to Resto and Lewis then the same should've happened to them).
Sklar wrote:This may seeme extreme but I advocate the death sentence for PED use and other serious cheating. You wouldn't have to kill many to educate the rest.
A bit extreme I would say. Unless another fighter is killed in the ring because of it, it is unrealistic to say the least. To me a life-time ban is realistic, and would send a message that if you cheat, your career is over.
Sklar wrote:This may seeme extreme but I advocate the death sentence for PED use and other serious cheating. You wouldn't have to kill many to educate the rest.
there are are these posts once in a while
that make you shake your head in disbelief.
KBB wrote:When SSM fought Margo again Bro Nazim went in to see the hands getting wrapped and that's when they discovered the loaded pads full of Plaster of Paris (the same substance they make casts out of) and instantly those were taken as evidence, I thought right then and there the fight should've been cancelled, Margo and his entire team should've been banned from the sport for life (if they did it to Resto and Lewis then the same should've happened to them).
I disagree about cancelling the fight. Mosley had the opportunity of a lifetime to fight a declawed tiger with an artificially inflated p4p ranking for an artificially inflated payday, and acquire artificially inflated hype for winning. Margarito acquired a p4p top 10 ranking by using plaster handwraps, and Mosley acquired a p4p top 10 ranking by beating a Margarito who didn't have plaster handwraps. It's almost like if you beat Matthew Hatton and got the same credit as if you had beaten Ricky Hatton. By going forward with the fight, Mosley picked-up a super easy victory and was gift-wrapped a multi-million dollar payday against Mayweather.
Sklar wrote:Would you risk taking PEDS or loading your gloves if you knew you'd get done by a firing sqaud if caught?
What, in your opinion, is wrong with using PEDs, aside from the current legal standing?
In addition to the plethora of reversible and irreversible adverse side-effects of using PEDs, particularly in youngsters, the focus of what sport is meant to be about would be muddied yet further if drug use became acceptable. Professional sport is a vulgar enough notion as it is without building in another level of degeneracy.
Sklar wrote:Would you risk taking PEDS or loading your gloves if you knew you'd get done by a firing sqaud if caught?
What, in your opinion, is wrong with using PEDs, aside from the current legal standing?
In addition to the plethora of reversible and irreversible adverse side-effects of using PEDs, particularly in youngsters, the focus of what sport is meant to be about would be muddied yet further if drug use became acceptable. Professional sport is a vulgar enough notion as it is without building in another level of degeneracy.
So essentially safety and fairness?
The obvious problem with that idea is that sport (especially combat sport) is not safe or fair.
I also fail to see (aside from the word "drug" which sends people into a tail spin) the "degeneracy" of using PEDs. Do you think tools should be limited in other fields as well?
I'm not discussing other fields, I'm discussing sport. I don't think sport should ever be a professional activity let alone involve hormone modifying injections, etc.
