Miguel Cotto: THE most OVERRATED Boxer EVER...

[Fatsam]

Is miguel cotto is the most overrated boxer ever ?

No

[Ricky_]

The ONLY noteworthy win on this guy's resume is Shane Mosely, a guy that is probably #2 on my Most Overrated Fighter List. Another guy revered while losing every big fight he's ever been in.

This is incorrect. Mosley beat DLH while DLH was in his prime. Get your facts straight at least.

What a clown, Mosley & Cotto are overrated. Next we'll be hearing that Barrera & Morales were average.

[sucracristo]

willy pep: overrated (had 11 losses in 241 fights)

[tiny_acres]

willy pep: overrated (had 11 losses in 241 fights)

Sugar Ray Robison was worse than that 19 losses.

I swear people are freaking retarded

[KBB]

willy pep: overrated (had 11 losses in 241 fights)

Sugar Ray Robison was worse than that 19 losses.

I swear people are freaking retarded

[koolkc107]

Cotto is a first ballot HOF.

And he was definitely cheated of being even better by an unscrupulous fighter and trainer who should have been permanently banned from the sport instead of just being out a year.

No doubt in my mind that Cotto was never the same after (still may not be) and was severely hampered his next two or three fights directly after the beating.

[NateJR]

I never bought into the whole "Martinez would have destroyed Cotto in his prime" argument. Martinez was a very good fighter, but he's no greater than Cotto. I honestly believe if Cotto would have fought the version of Martinez that fought at 147 I would have favored Cotto any day of the week, same with at 154. I just don't buy that bullshit that Martinez would have beat Cotto at any point in their careers because frankly they are very even in my book and feel Cotto always had the favoring style in that match-up. This is coming from someone who's a big fan of both Martinez and Cotto, I believe as far as greatness they are on par with each other and would have always favored Cotto to win if they'd had been campaigning in the same weight-class. I will admit I picked Martinez to beat Cotto, simply because it was Cottos first fight at 160 and didn't realize Martinez's knees were that shot, but even looking at how the fight played out I don't believe for a second that Martinez would have ever been able to beat Cotto easily.

Cotto is a very good fighter, borderline "GREAT"! He has very good skills and is a very solid and well rounded fighter that no-one beats easily. Not even Pacquiao beat Cotto easily, until Cotto got caught by a big shot in a exchange. Even then I still feel if Cotto had a full time trainer at the time, didn't have to loose the couple extra pounds, that fight could have played out much differently. Look Cotto didn't have a game plan going into the Pacquiao fight, it was one of the worst times of Cottos career based on him coming off one of the biggest losses against Margarito, having to lose 2 extra pounds in a weight-class he was out growing and not having a full time trainer, there were a lot of things in that fight working against Cotto that simply can't go unnoticed.

Cotto is a bad dude and one of the top fighters of his generation and that IMO is not even close to discrediting this era of fighters, Cotto would have been a very good fighter in any era.

[KBB]

I never bought into the whole "Martinez would have destroyed Cotto in his prime" argument. Martinez was a very good fighter, but he's no greater than Cotto. I honestly believe if Cotto would have fought the version of Martinez that fought at 147 I would have favored Cotto any day of the week, same with at 154. I just don't buy that bullshit that Martinez would have beat Cotto at any point in their careers because frankly they are very even in my book and feel Cotto always had the favoring style in that match-up. This is coming from someone who's a big fan of both Martinez and Cotto, I believe as far as greatness they are on par with each other and would have always favored Cotto to win if they'd had been campaigning in the same weight-class. I will admit I picked Martinez to beat Cotto, simply because it was Cottos first fight at 160 and didn't realize Martinez's knees were that shot, but even looking at how the fight played out I don't believe for a second that Martinez would have ever been able to beat Cotto easily.

Cotto is a very good fighter, borderline "GREAT"! He has very good skills and is a very solid and well rounded fighter that no-one beats easily. Not even Pacquiao beat Cotto easily, until Cotto got caught by a big shot in a exchange. Even then I still feel if Cotto had a full time trainer at the time, didn't have to loose the couple extra pounds, that fight could have played out much differently. Look Cotto didn't have a game plan going into the Pacquiao fight, it was one of the worst times of Cottos career based on him coming off one of the biggest losses against Margarito, having to lose 2 extra points in a weight-class he was out growing and not having a full time trainer, there were a lot of things in that fight working against Cotto that simply can't go unnoticed.

Cotto is a bad dude and one of the top fighters of his generation and IMO is not even close to a discrediting this era of fighters, Cotto would have been a very good fighting in any era.

+1

[Badhusker]

First of all you have to consider his whole career. He has had an excellent career overall. I don't hold the Pacquiao fight against him because he was basically forced to fight at the 145 catchweight or be stripped of his title. He was the champ, but we all know how money talks. He also had to take a 76-24 split, or close to it. For those that followed him, he was having trouble making 147, so it was a strategy by Roach to get Pac the advantage of weakening Cotto. Cotto fought well until he started gassing. Pac refusing to go at 150 or above for a rematch vs Cotto tells us a lot. Roach/Pacquiao did the same thing with other fights too.

The most over-rated ever? Wow, you are delusional. Cotto has basically taken on all comers for the majority of his career, but is more selective lately. Him vs Canelo not getting made I would guess was because Canelo has a bigger ego than he should at his point in his career, and wanted equal at least to what Cotto wanted.

How can you be stripped of your title for fighting at the correct weight? No way would he have been stripped if he told pacman there was no catchweight, 147 or nothing. The fight may not have happened and he would have fought someone else but you don't get stripped for that. The reason he did it was for the money, and if he struggled at the weight then its his fault he should not have signed the contract so to me you can't use that as an excuse

A little more background leading up to the fight: http://www.boxingnews24.com/2009/08/cot ... -not-news/

Cotto should have just demanded random blood testing before the fight and Pac would have fought someone else. Not only was he the champ and a draw himself, but to be threatened to lose his belt and have to take a 75-25 split was pretty sad.

[koolkc107]

I never bought into the whole "Martinez would have destroyed Cotto in his prime" argument. Martinez was a very good fighter, but he's no greater than Cotto. I honestly believe if Cotto would have fought the version of Martinez that fought at 147 I would have favored Cotto any day of the week, same with at 154. I just don't buy that bullshit that Martinez would have beat Cotto at any point in their careers because frankly they are very even in my book and feel Cotto always had the favoring style in that match-up. This is coming from someone who's a big fan of both Martinez and Cotto, I believe as far as greatness they are on par with each other and would have always favored Cotto to win if they'd had been campaigning in the same weight-class. I will admit I picked Martinez to beat Cotto, simply because it was Cottos first fight at 160 and didn't realize Martinez's knees were that shot, but even looking at how the fight played out I don't believe for a second that Martinez would have ever been able to beat Cotto easily.

Cotto is a very good fighter, borderline "GREAT"! He has very good skills and is a very solid and well rounded fighter that no-one beats easily. Not even Pacquiao beat Cotto easily, until Cotto got caught by a big shot in a exchange. Even then I still feel if Cotto had a full time trainer at the time, didn't have to loose the couple extra pounds, that fight could have played out much differently. Look Cotto didn't have a game plan going into the Pacquiao fight, it was one of the worst times of Cottos career based on him coming off one of the biggest losses against Margarito, having to lose 2 extra pounds in a weight-class he was out growing and not having a full time trainer, there were a lot of things in that fight working against Cotto that simply can't go unnoticed.

Cotto is a bad dude and one of the top fighters of his generation and that IMO is not even close to discrediting this era of fighters, Cotto would have been a very good fighter in any era.

I don't think folks have ever understood just how much the cement beating by 'Cheato affected Miguel.

All I can say is Jennings would have never lasted 5 rounds against the Cotto that fought Mosley. And that same Cotto would have no business going life and death with the likes of Joshua Clottey.

Throw in the weight restriction and you have a recipe for a loss.

And yes, it is quit telling that Pac would not fight Miguel at 154, who would have come into the ring smaller than the 165 or so that Pac faced against Margarito.

Cotto may not be the absolute best of his era, but he is damned good and will have no problem getting into the Hall, which he richly deserves.

[crusader]

Cotto isn't on the level of ATGs like Pac and Floyd but he's a very good fighter with a strong enough resume to merit induction into the HOF.

To me it seems like that's the consensus and I think it's appropriate.

[KBB]

Well it seems it's unanimous, other than Caldo everyone here basically agrees that Miguel Cotto isn't the most overrated boxer ever and is HOF worthy without any reservations whatsoever.

I like Caldo as a member of this forum, he brings intelligent debates and articulates well but on this one he showed his bias a little bit as he admitted that he was a huge fan of Sergio Martinez which is without a doubt what prompted this thread in the first place.

We all have our loyalties to certain fighters but I didn't read where anyone dissed him in any form or fashion and that is a great thing, I wish it could always be like this on this forum but hey, some people just want to express their grudges outright.

Caldo, are you willing to re-think this "most overrated" quote in light of all of the intelligent debates that refute your claim??

Just asking.

[ReggieDiggs]

I always thought that this forum was frequented by knowledgeable boxing fans, but when I read preposterous claims about “Cotto being the most overrated boxer ever” and “Carl Froch is a duck”; it makes me think that it’s only used by prepubescent teenagers lacking mental capacity to formulate a rational thought!

Those were outed as bs threads/ideas pretty quickly fwiw. Its not like they had a whole lot of forward momentum. Plus I'd say the people who think & believe that sorta thing are casual fans more than dramatic &/or dumb children. Idk that you can hate on casual fans for their silly opinions that hard. It'd be like not commenting on the Super Bowl as a person who never watches football. Its not realistic that everyone is just gonna stfu & not say something kinda dumb in those couple hours.

[koolkc107]

Well it seems it's unanimous, other than Caldo everyone here basically agrees that Miguel Cotto isn't the most overrated boxer ever and is HOF worthy without any reservations whatsoever.

I like Caldo as a member of this forum, he brings intelligent debates and articulates well but on this one he showed his bias a little bit as he admitted that he was a huge fan of Sergio Martinez which is without a doubt what prompted this thread in the first place.

We all have our loyalties to certain fighters but I didn't read where anyone dissed him in any form or fashion and that is a great thing, I wish it could always be like this on this forum but hey, some people just want to express their grudges outright.

Caldo, are you willing to re-think this "most overrated" quote in light of all of the intelligent debates that refute your claim??

Just asking.

I am a huge fan of Maravilla as well. Back when they fought the second time, I consider the rematch between him and PW as the fight which would establish the "real" P4P #1, since neither Mayweather nor Pacquiao showed the slightest bit of interest in making a mega-fight with either guy at 154

[sucracristo]

Well it seems it's unanimous, other than Caldo everyone here basically agrees that Miguel Cotto isn't the most overrated boxer ever and is HOF worthy without any reservations whatsoever.

I like Caldo as a member of this forum, he brings intelligent debates and articulates well but on this one he showed his bias a little bit as he admitted that he was a huge fan of Sergio Martinez which is without a doubt what prompted this thread in the first place.

We all have our loyalties to certain fighters but I didn't read where anyone dissed him in any form or fashion and that is a great thing, I wish it could always be like this on this forum but hey, some people just want to express their grudges outright.

Caldo, are you willing to re-think this "most overrated" quote in light of all of the intelligent debates that refute your claim??

Just asking.

I am a huge fan of Maravilla as well. Back when they fought the second time, I consider the rematch between him and PW as the fight which would establish the "real" P4P #1, since neither Mayweather nor Pacquiao showed the slightest bit of interest in making a mega-fight with either guy at 154

i don't see why cotto's loss (in a really close fight) to a roided up loaded gloves margarito is so much
worse than martinez's loss to margarito, as if cotto's loss means he was overrated and would have no
chance against a healthy sergio. i've said in this thread before that sergio not being 100% contributed
to him getting beaten like that, but it doesn't discount cotto coming in well prepared. i favored sergio
over cotto before that fight but even if sergio was the same guy who fought jccII the version of cotto
who showed up that day would have given him the fight of his life.

the owner of biogeneis in florida, tony bosch, whose records implicated yuriorkis gamboa and other
boxers, cage fighters, baseball and football players, got sentenced to prison, today.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ml ... /23548467/

[palooka]

Miguel has faced many very god fighters and has always turned up in shape and ready for a battle; in the bouts he has lost he's gone out on his shield and taken his lumps. Cotto seems to have the respect of all who have faced him and I don't see him as being at all over rated.

[BAD INTENTIONS]

Whenever boxing fans like a fighter's style, they go crazy over him and overrate his ability.

On this very forum I said that Brandon Rios is very limited and will be taken apart by better boxers. I had multiple people tell me he wasn't just a brawler and something about his foot speed keeping him competitive against boxers. People were trying to defend and overrate him him just because they like him.

... and so goes discussions with the average human. There is such bias based on personal preference that logic isn't even considered.

Cotto is a very good fighter. However, this era should not include him as one of the best. He is the top of the 2nd tier, but his career probably won't be better than Kovalev's in 3 years.

... but he sells, and he comes to fight, so the average dude hear doesn't want to hear anything negative about him until he retires. Then they will mostly come to their senses ... THAT IS BOXREC.

[KBB]

Whenever boxing fans like a fighter's style, they go crazy over him and overrate his ability.

On this very forum I said that Brandon Rios is very limited and will be taken apart by better boxers. I had multiple people tell me he wasn't just a brawler and something about his foot speed keeping him competitive against boxers. People were trying to defend and overrate him him just because they like him.

... and so goes discussions with the average human. There is such bias based on personal preference that logic isn't even considered.

Cotto is a very good fighter. However, this era should not include him as one of the best. He is the top of the 2nd tier, but his career probably won't be better than Kovalev's in 3 years.

... but he sells, and he comes to fight, so the average dude hear doesn't want to hear anything negative about him until he retires. Then they will mostly come to their senses ... THAT IS BOXREC.

I'd love to hear the negative, as long as there are facts. I don't like the nonsense guys like Ricky post up because there are hardly ever any facts to support what he states but if you have something about Miguel Cotto that should help to better formulate our opinions or at least make us check 'em then please share it with us.

This is what Boxrec is supposed to be about.

[BAD INTENTIONS]

Cotto was special to watch until about the 5th round of the first Margarito fight. He just seemed like Tyson, that unstoppable force type fighter. I think that guy is the one people remember when they think of Miguel Cotto in 2015.

The reality is that after the Margarito fight Cotto has been pretty average among top level fighters.

A gift against Clottey. Crushed by Manny. Not very impressive against Foreman. Beat a one-eyed Margarito (who should have never been allowed to fight), outclassed by Floyd, clear loss to Trout, and crushed a one-legged Sergio Martinez.

Regardless, since he's been with Roach he has looked threatening again, albeit against limited competition. He had chance to prove himself but I'm sure he was on some bitch ass "I'm the lineal champion and the A-side" bullshit.

[caldo2025]

koolkc107, if this were a fight, my corner would have thrown the towel in. I didn't train hard enough for this one apparently What can I say? There were some excellent points that were tough to argue. Palooka and Oiky put it pretty well by saying that the basis of Cotto's appeal is his fighting style and heart. Those comments really made it click upstairs for me and made me appreciate Cotto a little more because I have to admit, this guy is never in a loser. His fights are always exciting and i've honestly enjoyed every fight he's been in. I still believe that the guy is overrated but not as much as I thought. So, I think my Boxrec record would show that I got TKO'd in the 7th.

And btw KBB, thanks for the psychoanalysis but you are way off. The root reason for this post was not at all because Cotto beat "my boy" Sergio. I'm not THAT big of a Sergio fan, I just really dug his style in the ring. Want the real reason? Dan Rafael. I got so sick of his man crush articles about Cotto that I sent him an email asking him why he considered Cotto one of the greatest ever because the career just didn't match the praise IMO. His response "Because he just is, plain and simple". Not the heaping helping of evidence needed to sway me so I wanted to see what the forum thought. It was a good take by you though, man. Not faulting you for picking that out, it was a great observation.

[Dennis]

Cotto is like a modern version of Ken Norton. He lost to some great fighters from his time but beat a lot of quality guys too.

[ikorolev]

He is now free for a mandatory defence against Ggg. He could prove his greatness. Why do I think that he will pass that chance ?

[Tanzio]

He is now free for a mandatory defence against Ggg. He could prove his greatness. Why do I think that he will pass that chance ?

If there is a current boxer who started at 140 who will take that chance it is Cotto, and if Cotto catches 3G with a flush left hook he will not walk through it like he did Murray's shots. 3G would win the fight but anyone who suggests that Cotto fears any boxer needs to review Miguel's legacy. I felt that he should have retired after Pac. Cotto proved me dead wrong.

Miguel Cotto is one of the elite boxers of his generation. His legacy supports my view and history will confirm my view.