THE STRANGE CULT OF GOLOVKINMANIA

[Deadendgeneration]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

As for GGG. He looks the bollocks, but sadly the only p4p fighter who`d get in the ring with him is naturally a weight class and a half bigger than him. He's beat everyone worthwhile and willing at 160; even though I think he's a small middleweight, he's going to have to go to 168 to get a meaningful fight. Pac and Floyd went up against naturally Bigger men, if GGG is that good then supermiddle will be the proving ground.

[Junker]

I think GGG is that good & the only need that I can see for him to seek big fights in other weight divisions is a financial one. If he unified the Middleweight division and reigned as a dominant champion for 3 or 4 years that's enough to secure a legacy.

[black panther]

I think GGG is that good & the only need that I can see for him to seek big fights in other weight divisions is a financial one. If he unified the Middleweight division and reigned as a dominant champion for 3 or 4 years that's enough to secure a legacy.

Problem is none of the other champs want to fight him. He just needs a big name scalp like a Cotto or an Alvarez to boost his profile and earning potential. Once he gets this, he'll be more of an attractive proposition to said fighters who will know they're in for a shellacking, but will accept it because of the payday it would bring. It's a sad state of affairs though when the consensus division no.1 can't get the others in the division to fight him. Pretty much sums up what's wrong with boxing in the present time; the best don't fight the best.

[UrbanFox]

I don't know what a belm is, but Golovkin's WBA world middleweight title is not the only WBA world middleweight title.

So Klitschko is half a WBA champ and Chagaev holds the other half other.

Brilliant that

[Boxerbeetle]

Joking aside, and yes my joke was hilarious, I think that Tuan_Jim partially has a point. The Channel 5 pundits were a bit OTT.

Obviously, that can be said for a lot of sports commentary. However it's so common in boxing, it's par for the course and we don't notice it as much any more. It's not like GGG is the first person or last person they'll do it about. As annoying as it is, that's what boxing is these days.

It's not just boxing & it's not just sport - it seems to be the standard way of describing things at the moment, whether it be films/tv/music etc. If something is half-decent, you immediately get some media commentator or other asking "is this one of the top xxxxx's of all time?". Same goes for anything that disappoints - "is this one of the worst xxxxx's of all time?".

Boxing is particularly bad in this, but it's nowhere near alone.

I blame the internet & the modern obsession with listing/ranking absolutely everything.

Failing that, I obviously blame George Groves.

[Counter-puncher]

Joking aside, and yes my joke was hilarious, I think that Tuan_Jim partially has a point. The Channel 5 pundits were a bit OTT.

Obviously, that can be said for a lot of sports commentary. However it's so common in boxing, it's par for the course and we don't notice it as much any more. It's not like GGG is the first person or last person they'll do it about. As annoying as it is, that's what boxing is these days.

It's not just boxing & it's not just sport - it seems to be the standard way of describing things at the moment, whether it be films/tv/music etc. If something is half-decent, you immediately get some media commentator or other asking "is this one of the top xxxxx's of all time?". Same goes for anything that disappoints - "is this one of the worst xxxxx's of all time?".

Boxing is particularly bad in this, but it's nowhere near alone.

I blame the internet & the modern obsession with listing/ranking absolutely everything.

Failing that, I obviously blame George Groves.

that might be the best post of its kind I have ever seen

[Tuan_Jim]

Good morning friends and lovers. The other day in the Gennady Golovkin vs Martin Murray thread I made the observation that the fanatical praise of GGG by fans and the media seemed to be blown out of all proportion in comparison to his achievements. For this the herd turned on me and I was subjected to a violent verbal gang rape from which I am unlikely to ever recover.

The essence of the response was that I was wrong, I was making it up, no one was over selling GGG (“I haven't seen anyone say he's on a par with anyone in history so I don't know where you're getting that from”, “I don't imagine anyone means he's P4P Top 10 of all time or anything like that”).

And yet in last night’s broadcast of Golovkin/Murray, I learned that Golovkin, a man who’s major world title claim is holding 50% of a WBA belt, is:

“The scariest fighter since Mike Tyson” (undisputed heavyweight champion)

‘Has surpassed Marvin Hagler in world title defences’ (undisputed middleweight champion)

‘Has the highest KO ratio in middleweight title history’ (but defending 50% of the WBA belt, or a duplicate WBA belt if you prefer)

And beating him would be on par with - ‘Turpin beating Robinson’ (undisputed middleweight champion, 128-1, boxing’s all-time greatest fighter)

- Honeyghan beating Curry (undisputed welterweight champion)

- Hatton beating Tszyu (undisputed light-welterweight champion)

And that’s just a small selection of remarks made during the broadcast. And it is atypical of all Golovkin related media coverage.

Again. Golovkin holds half a WBA belt. Now if that’s not an excessive and fanatical amount of hyperbole, I don’t know what is.

My question is, if Golovkin is as great as he’s supposed to be, why do we need misinformation and half truth to prove it? And at what point, and why, did boxing presentation shift from informing the viewer to telling them The thing which is not?

You are right.



Not saying Golovkin is a hype job but comparing him to Robinson and Hagler is - misleading to say the least.

And if folk think hyping up untruths is part of the sport - that is why our sport is in shite state.

NB: Feel free to disagree with the above, some like hype, I personally don't but I understand this is all down to taste.

Thank you Mr Git - we finally agree. I don't know why people can't see the absurdity in comparisons to Robinson, or surpassing El Marvelloso via paper title route. I completely understand GGG's popularity, but the love of Golovkin seems to have clouded cold objectivity.

It's not good for boxing when the media bestows greatness on fighters simply so they can profit more easily from their future fights.

[Tuan_Jim]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

[black panther]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

I miss Darkey. A million times better than Nick "Try to tell you what you're not seeing" Halling

[Dixonian]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

I loved Tyson Fury's rant after Adam Smith had apparently referred to him as a pretender. "He's the pretender compared to Reg Gutteridge!" He went up tenfold in my estimation after that.

Great fights and great fighter's need no hype. The general trend for elevating mediocrity in the name of promotion, infuriates me massively. I'm not saying Golovkin doesn't deserve praise, but you can surely promote this guy and his abilities based on what he's achieved in his career so far without comparing him to the all-time greats. Make those comparisons when he's fought and beat the best of his era first.

[Tuan_Jim]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

I miss Darkey. A million times better than Nick "Try to tell you what you're not seeing" Halling

Darkey is sorely missed. Old school professional standards. When a Darkie, Gutteridge or Carpenter fall into some throw of histrionics it's because something superhuman had happened in the ring. All a Brit has to do now is land a punch and 'OH IT'S SENSATIONAL STUFF!!!'

Did anybody hear the Showtime call of Wilder-Stiverne? The announcer spoke as if he were a ham actor voicing a cartoon character. What in Hades was he doing?

[Tuan_Jim]

It's common with all sports commenting. Best league in the wolrd anyone? Their job is to sell their product.

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

I loved Tyson Fury's rant after Adam Smith had apparently referred to him as a pretender. "He's the pretender compared to Reg Gutteridge!" He went up tenfold in my estimation after that.

Great fights and great fighter's need no hype. The general trend for elevating mediocrity in the name of promotion, infuriates me massively. I'm not saying Golovkin doesn't deserve praise, but you can surely promote this guy and his abilities based on what he's achieved in his career so far without comparing him to the all-time greats. Make those comparisons when he's fought and beat the best of his era first.

Exactly. Golovkin is deserving of praise, but relative praise.

It's odd how offended boxing fans are by someone expecting a fighter to prove greatness in the ring. But on the other hand, if you've only followed boxing 10, 15 years, and have felt no inclination to explore the sport's rich history and many astonishing eras, these expectations probably do seem strange. I do miss the presentation of old. Hearns walks to the ring. Hagler walks to the ring. Chuck Hull rattles off the weights and away we go. Need fireworks, explosions? Want the audience worked into a frenzy? No problem, wait for round one. And the Greatness will be self evident, an announcer won't need to explain it you through obscure stats and crazed conflation.

[Dixonian]

You'd have never heard Dunphy, Carpenter, Gutteridge indulging in some cheap cynical shilling - their ethics wouldn't allow it. For a more recent example, Iain Darke would never make such absurd comparisons without an honest example of context.

It's a corporate HBO/Showtime subscription channel hard sell that has gradually seeped into all of boxing coverage over the last 10, 15 years.

I loved Tyson Fury's rant after Adam Smith had apparently referred to him as a pretender. "He's the pretender compared to Reg Gutteridge!" He went up tenfold in my estimation after that.

Great fights and great fighter's need no hype. The general trend for elevating mediocrity in the name of promotion, infuriates me massively. I'm not saying Golovkin doesn't deserve praise, but you can surely promote this guy and his abilities based on what he's achieved in his career so far without comparing him to the all-time greats. Make those comparisons when he's fought and beat the best of his era first.

Exactly. Golovkin is deserving of praise, but relative praise.

It's odd how offended boxing fans are by someone expecting a fighter to prove greatness in the ring. But on the other hand, if you've only followed boxing 10, 15 years, and have felt no inclination to explore the sport's rich history and many astonishing eras, these expectations probably do seem strange. I do miss the presentation of old. Hearns walks to the ring. Hagler walks to the ring. Chuck Hull rattles off the weights and away we go. Need fireworks, explosions? Want the audience worked into a frenzy? No problem, wait for round one. And the Greatness will be self evident, an announcer won't need to explain it you through obscure stats and crazed conflation.

I second that.

[Bard of Boxrec]

He had a rough start and was down multiple times in the thread, but now, TJ is finding his form and whipping the crowd into a frenzy, like a young Golovkin against the feared Grzegorz Proksa. It's almost reminiscent of the prime performances of the fabled overhand_right, from whom the lad learned his signature aggressive style!

[Counter-puncher]

I loved Tyson Fury's rant after Adam Smith had apparently referred to him as a pretender. "He's the pretender compared to Reg Gutteridge!" He went up tenfold in my estimation after that.

.

did he really say that? I've always liked Tyson, but that comment makes me verge on a mancrush....

[Dixonian]

I loved Tyson Fury's rant after Adam Smith had apparently referred to him as a pretender. "He's the pretender compared to Reg Gutteridge!" He went up tenfold in my estimation after that.

.

did he really say that? I've always liked Tyson, but that comment makes me verge on a mancrush....

Yeah skip to the 20-minute mark:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSuGQLXb_dQ

[Counter-puncher]

ace

[Tuan_Jim]

He had a rough start and was down multiple times in the thread, but now, TJ is finding his form and whipping the crowd into a frenzy, like a young Golovkin against the feared Grzegorz Proksa. It's almost reminiscent of the prime performances of the fabled overhand_right, from whom the lad learned his signature aggressive style!

If Howard Foster had moderated this thread it would've been locked on page 1. Instead Tuan_Jim has been allowed to rise from several heavy knockdowns and is now on the verge of winning the fight! Classic example of a poster proving his Greatness in the thread. The WBA must have some sort of belt for a feat like this?

[Bard of Boxrec]

He had a rough start and was down multiple times in the thread, but now, TJ is finding his form and whipping the crowd into a frenzy, like a young Golovkin against the feared Grzegorz Proksa. It's almost reminiscent of the prime performances of the fabled overhand_right, from whom the lad learned his signature aggressive style!

If Howard Foster had moderated this thread it would've been locked on page 1. Instead Tuan_Jim has been allowed to rise from several heavy knockdowns and is now on the verge of winning the fight! Classic example of a poster proving his Greatness in the thread. The WBA must have some sort of belt for a feat like this?

I remember the days of 15 page threads, TJ would have held his own back then. Too many of these hyped up posters of today think they rule the roost, but they need to prove it in the threads, how would they have fared in the days of Tomato Can, Erik the Viking, Jaclem, Dutch Windmill et all?

[Tuan_Jim]

Pringle wouldn't hire one of these modern posters as a verbal sparring partner. They don't have the mental stamina for a 15 page thread. They just get by on bad language and a telegraphed quip. Where's the psychic feints and slippery wordwork? Where's the stomach to argue a point to the bitter end, where nobody cares anymore, or even remembers what the original point was?

[Counter-puncher]

Pringle wouldn't hire one of these modern posters as a verbal sparring partner. They don't have the mental stamina for a 15 page thread. They just get by on bad language and a telegraphed quip. Where's the psychic feints and slippery wordwork? Where's the stomach to argue a point to the bitter end, where nobody cares anymore, or even remembers what the original point was?

you've never encountered Fat_Git?

[Bard of Boxrec]

Pringle wouldn't hire one of these modern posters as a verbal sparring partner. They don't have the mental stamina for a 15 page thread. They just get by on bad language and a telegraphed quip. Where's the psychic feints and slippery wordwork? Where's the stomach to argue a point to the bitter end, where nobody cares anymore, or even remembers what the original point was?

Well, in today's scene I would argue there are a few skilled arguers to the bitter end. Crusader is probably p4p up there, definitely has the engine for a 15-page thread, although he stops most foes before 15 pages are completed with his chopping analytical skills.

[Bard of Boxrec]

"This really is crap. You should turn over. There's porn on the other channels," said no commentator ever.

AND TUAN JIM IS DOWN AGAIN FOR THE UMPTEENTH TIME! WHAT A FIGHT WE HAVE HERE! HOLD OFF ON THE PORN FOR THE TIME BEING! OH MY GARRRRDD!

[Tuan_Jim]

Calm down Riddick Blowe. You of all people should know you can't score a knockdown by brainlessly parroting the "said no one ever" cliche. In the days of the 15 pagers such lazy work would get you disqualified from further discussion.

[Bard of Boxrec]

Calm down Riddick Blowe. You of all people should know you can't score a knockdown by brainlessly parroting the "said no one ever" cliche. In the days of the 15 pagers such lazy work would get you disqualified from further discussion.

Rd 2 is over and looking back at the replay, the ref counted but it looked like a slip...THIS CONTEST IS ONE FOR THE AGES, UP THERE WITH WLADPOCALYPSE NOW OR NOONE CAN TAKE A FULL POWER PUNCH FROM SQUATDOG!!!