London. 1979. Muhammad Ali, considered by many to be the greatest heavyweight champion of all time, was really heavy as he announced his retirement at the Royal Albert Hall.
May 29th.
....................................
Sept 26, 1980.
'Before and After.'
Muhammad Ali begins serious training for his heavyweight title fight against Larry Holmes, left, at his training camp in Deer Lake, PA in March.....and right, Ali winds down training for the Oct 2nd fight while preparing in Las Vegas.
Last edited by doug.ie on 13 Apr 2015, 08:30, edited 1 time in total.
I think when Howard Cossell interviewed Muhammad Ali around this time Ali admitted to
sticking out his stomach on purpose for the cameras for an effect.
Ali did not stay in shape between fights like Klitschko. If he took better care of his body with nutrition and training between fights, who knows, he might have beaten Holmes and last longer.
Jose Ribalta said in that new Ali book Muhammad Ali: Portrait of a Champion, he sparred with Ali in the mid 80s in Miami, so it seems Ali's heart and hunger to compete never left him but his physical skills departed early.
montrealsuper wrote:Ali did not stay in shape between fights like Klitschko. If he took better care of his body with nutrition and training between fights, who knows, he might have beaten Holmes and last longer.
Jose Ribalta said in that new Ali book Muhammad Ali: Portrait of a Champion, he sparred with Ali in the mid 80s in Miami, so it seems Ali's heart and hunger to compete never left him but his physical skills departed early.
Not that early.
He was still heavyweight champion 18 years after turning professional. His skills may have declined by then, but they certainly hadn't departed.
I used to believe Ali was the greatest but being older now and watching his fights and how his career was launched on two fixed fights.If the first Liston fight was not fixed Ali at least for the time right after would have been thought of as either a big mouth clown or a funny self promoter who really didn't believe what he was saying but liked to entertain to pump up the gate and the take home pay.The second group would think that he was worth watching reguardless of the quality of opponent.From a business point it was obvious post Marciano the sport was dying Patterson was an over protected pretender who Liston exposed.Liston to most was a detestable thug with mob ties who had to go.Enter young Cassius Clay a charasmatic, annoying,enertaining fast handed fan producing curiousity who like Howard Cosell got the coins cha chinging because young Cassius was loved and hated and not ignored.This means money.Money changes everything especially in boxing.Ali is one of the greatest but if they didn't fix the first Liston fight he may not have won a title until his draft battle was over.I think that Ali would have beaten Frazier if he had the title.But someone else would have to dispose of Liston and frazier would not have been able to.Foreman sparred with Liston and wanted no part of him.Liston of course could have self destructed which would be the most likely.Somewhere around the time he was murdered would be my guess.Liston was killed because of a knockout of another alledged mob controlled fighter Chuck Webner the famed bayonne bleeder who Liston cut to ribbons.Keep in mind Webner was not a great puncher or a skilled boxer yet in 1975 gave ALI lots of trouble because of his chin.This wasn't a case of styles making fights.A forty something Liston destroyed Webner 5 years earlier and Ali barely beat the same guy five years later.Ali s skills diminished some but it shows just how much better Liston was than ALI.
TheDennisMoore wrote:I used to believe Ali was the greatest but being older now and watching his fights and how his career was launched on two fixed fights.If the first Liston fight was not fixed Ali at least for the time right after would have been thought of as either a big mouth clown or a funny self promoter who really didn't believe what he was saying but liked to entertain to pump up the gate and the take home pay.The second group would think that he was worth watching reguardless of the quality of opponent.From a business point it was obvious post Marciano the sport was dying Patterson was an over protected pretender who Liston exposed.Liston to most was a detestable thug with mob ties who had to go.Enter young Cassius Clay a charasmatic, annoying,enertaining fast handed fan producing curiousity who like Howard Cosell got the coins cha chinging because young Cassius was loved and hated and not ignored.This means money.Money changes everything especially in boxing.Ali is one of the greatest but if they didn't fix the first Liston fight he may not have won a title until his draft battle was over.I think that Ali would have beaten Frazier if he had the title.But someone else would have to dispose of Liston and frazier would not have been able to.Foreman sparred with Liston and wanted no part of him.Liston of course could have self destructed which would be the most likely.Somewhere around the time he was murdered would be my guess.Liston was killed because of a knockout of another alledged mob controlled fighter Chuck Webner the famed bayonne bleeder who Liston cut to ribbons.Keep in mind Webner was not a great puncher or a skilled boxer yet in 1975 gave ALI lots of trouble because of his chin.This wasn't a case of styles making fights.A forty something Liston destroyed Webner 5 years earlier and Ali barely beat the same guy five years later.Ali s skills diminished some but it shows just how much better Liston was than ALI.
Webner?
That tells me all I need to know about your 'insights' Dennis.
TheDennisMoore wrote:I used to believe Ali was the greatest but being older now and watching his fights and how his career was launched on two fixed fights.If the first Liston fight was not fixed Ali at least for the time right after would have been thought of as either a big mouth clown or a funny self promoter who really didn't believe what he was saying but liked to entertain to pump up the gate and the take home pay.The second group would think that he was worth watching reguardless of the quality of opponent.From a business point it was obvious post Marciano the sport was dying Patterson was an over protected pretender who Liston exposed.Liston to most was a detestable thug with mob ties who had to go.Enter young Cassius Clay a charasmatic, annoying,enertaining fast handed fan producing curiousity who like Howard Cosell got the coins cha chinging because young Cassius was loved and hated and not ignored.This means money.Money changes everything especially in boxing.Ali is one of the greatest but if they didn't fix the first Liston fight he may not have won a title until his draft battle was over.I think that Ali would have beaten Frazier if he had the title.But someone else would have to dispose of Liston and frazier would not have been able to.Foreman sparred with Liston and wanted no part of him.Liston of course could have self destructed which would be the most likely.Somewhere around the time he was murdered would be my guess.Liston was killed because of a knockout of another alledged mob controlled fighter Chuck Webner the famed bayonne bleeder who Liston cut to ribbons.Keep in mind Webner was not a great puncher or a skilled boxer yet in 1975 gave ALI lots of trouble because of his chin.This wasn't a case of styles making fights.A forty something Liston destroyed Webner 5 years earlier and Ali barely beat the same guy five years later.Ali s skills diminished some but it shows just how much better Liston was than ALI.
You're fully entitled to your opinion, but are you seriously rating Liston over Ali because his superior performance against ONE common opponent?
Buster Mathis beat Wepner in 3 - Buster Mathis must be better than both Liston and Ali. Joe Bugner beat Wepner in 3 - Bugner better than Liston and Ali.
Mr Moore has formulated some extremely kooky opinions without even bothering to first familiarise himself with the facts, and what he doesn't know he makes up. God the internet wears a man down. I'm done with freaks for the day. Goodbye.
