What do I have? Woroner productions All time middleweight championship??

[booner10]

Found these at my grandparents house what are they?

[BoxBuzz]

Well, I'll assume you asking the question on every level.

First off, it's an old acetate reel to reel audio tape. Depending on the speed...1 7/8......3 3/4......7 1/2....15......you have anywhere from 2 hours, to 15 minutes of recordings. My guess is it's one of first two speeds. Most likely 1 7/8 recording speed. With two hours of info.

Can not tell you a thing about the boxing match that I assume took place that's captured on the recording. Might want to look up the names on the sticky.

It's not referring to 1923...since that type of tape was really not in use until the 40's. Maybe stretch to the late 30's. So it may be a month and a day. Maybe Rev and Martin are the fictional fighters names?

Or maybe it was owned by a "Reverend Martin"? lol. That's the name of the fella who married my mom and dad, and he was from the Pan handle of Fl.

AND.FYI...that sort of tape does not weather well. So.....it's likely going to break over and over and over again when you attempt to play it .....IF it has been in anything but perfect temp with no sunlight for all this time.

If it's not falling apart on the end....find yourself an old reel to reel tape deck, with the slow speed options and give it a whirl!

[BoxBuzz]

Hey a quick google search brought this up. I had forgot that this was the name of the fella who put together the original HW version of this.

So maybe here's your answer?

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/board/t ... ament.html


Also if that's a BASF upgraded type of recording tape from the late 60's or later.....it may be in playable condition.

[BoxBuzz]

Update...I've identified the reel that that tape is in, as a wollensak reel. That type was probably in production from about 63 on.

I guess the MW version of the computerized HW tourney was not as successful, since I can find little about it.

But that may be an original or one of very few copies of the "11th" fight of that series. Maybe you have a collectors item.

Surely it would be if it was "the" original master of the "HW" equivalent.

[BoxBuzz]

OK best I could find was a "rerun" of Woroner's original version...which (If I read it right) has the same seed fighters, in the same positions, but perhaps does not reflect the same outcomes.

Apparently the MW tourney was also broadcast in the late 60's. So your fight would likely be.....Kid McCoy vs Mercel Cerdan


Sugar Ray Robinson W KO 4 Jack Dempsey
Stanley Ketchel W KO 6 Gene Fullmer
Marcel Cerdan W TKO 3 Carmen Basilio
Dick Tiger W u 15 Mickey Walker
Harry Greb W TKO 3 Tony Zale
(D s 15 then) Kid McCoy W KO 15 Emile Griffith
Tiger Flowers W TKO 13 Rocky Graziano
Bob Fitzsimmons W u 15 Jake LaMotta
Quarterfinals
Sugar Ray Robinson W u 15 Bob Fitzsimmons
Stanley Ketchel W KO 8 Tiger Flowers
Kid McCoy W KO 8 Marcel Cerdan
Harry Greb W TKO 15 Dick Tiger
Semifinals
Harry Greb W u 15 Sugar Ray Robinson
(D m 15 then) Stanley Ketchel W KO 6 Kid McCoy
Final
Harry Greb W u 15 Stanley Ketchel


Also, based on the reel number...I would guess the info is recorded at 3 3/4 speed. And I imagine it was a local radio station copy, vs a master, or a commercially available version.

[booner10]

I also have two fight 15s and one fight 9, 4 reels all together. I looked online and couldn't find a single one for sale or something like it.

[BoxBuzz]

Not sure as the monetary value...if any. But they COULD be masters or sub masters. Still not sure if that's valuable.

However, the info would be fascinating to have. You should make a digital copy. I'd love to listen to those files!

[pound per pound]

OK best I could find was a "rerun" of Woroner's original version...which (If I read it right) has the same seed fighters, in the same positions, but perhaps does not reflect the same outcomes.

Apparently the MW tourney was also broadcast in the late 60's. So your fight would likely be.....Kid McCoy vs Mercel Cerdan


Sugar Ray Robinson W KO 4 Jack Dempsey
Stanley Ketchel W KO 6 Gene Fullmer
Marcel Cerdan W TKO 3 Carmen Basilio
Dick Tiger W u 15 Mickey Walker
Harry Greb W TKO 3 Tony Zale
(D s 15 then) Kid McCoy W KO 15 Emile Griffith
Tiger Flowers W TKO 13 Rocky Graziano
Bob Fitzsimmons W u 15 Jake LaMotta
Quarterfinals
Sugar Ray Robinson W u 15 Bob Fitzsimmons
Stanley Ketchel W KO 8 Tiger Flowers
Kid McCoy W KO 8 Marcel Cerdan
Harry Greb W TKO 15 Dick Tiger
Semifinals
Harry Greb W u 15 Sugar Ray Robinson
(D m 15 then) Stanley Ketchel W KO 6 Kid McCoy
Final
Harry Greb W u 15 Stanley Ketchel


Also, based on the reel number...I would guess the info is recorded at 3 3/4 speed. And I imagine it was a local radio station copy, vs a master, or a commercially available version.

Greb TKO3 over Zale? Horrible call. No way Greb stops Zale so quickly. Greb UD is better.

[Ambling Alp II]

Agreed; almost no chance Grebs stops Zale at all; and in just three rounds is silly.
Also don't think Cerdan would have stopped Basilio in just three rounds. Basilio would have made it until the late rounds. That would have been fun to see.

[cfang]

Kid McCoy koing both Griffith and then cerdan doesn't look right to me either. Also have doubts as to how on earth Fitzimmons outpoints the raging bull. If it had been a stoppage then I can kinda see that but can't see how fitzs style would win rounds over jakes.

[SenorPipino]

Wasn't this the computer middleweight tournament that I listened to faithfully every week for months on my transistor during the late 1960s?

I remember recording the middleweight final on my reel-to-reel, something that apparently others did. I haven't listened to it in decades, but this thread motivates me to go find it. I doubt, however, that it's in playable condition.

As I recall, Sugar Ray Robinson was declared the all-time greatest middleweight champion with a decisive decision over Stanley Ketchel.

This tourney, along with the heavyweight one from a year or so earlier, inspired Woroner to put together and film the Ali-Marciano "contest" in 1969.

[doug.ie]

i looked for this for years....i even was in contact with murray woroners son.....this middleweight tournament was 1968....year after the heavyweight one....i would love to hear it.
how did they have walker beating greb ?

i uploaded all the heavyweight ones from 1967 to youtube...scroll down the list here...

https://www.youtube.com/user/classicbox ... ety/videos

[doug.ie]

hang on....these are the results i had listed from it...


Round 1:

Marcel Cerdan KO 4 Carmen Basilio

Emile Griffith W points Kid McCoy

Stanley Ketchel TKO 7 Gene Fullmer

Rocky Graziano KO 11 Tiger Flowers

Sugar Ray Robinson TKO 11 Jack "Nonpareil" Dempsey

Bob Fitzsimmons W points Jack La Motta

Mickey Walker KO 9 **** Tiger

Harry Greb KO 14 Tony Zale

Round 2:

Cerdan TKO 10 Griffith

Ketchel KO 11 Graziano

Robinson TKO 3 Fitzsimmons

Walker W points Greb

Semis:

Ketchel KO 12 Cerdan

Robinson W points Walker

Final:

Robinson W points Ketchel

[BoxBuzz]

Interesting thanks!

Looks like a few of tapes still exist based on the pictures in this thread.
But that may be all of the puzzle that's available to this moment.

Would be great if it could all be restored and posted on the web in audio form!

Also based on those results the tape in the picture would more likely reflect the Robinson vs Fitz fight ?