Updating the BOXREC Forum heavyweight rankings CLOSED

[jezzamundo]

BWH Rankings as of 31 May 2015:

Champion: Wladimir Klitschko
1. Alexander Povetkin
2. Tyson Fury
3. Deontay Wilder
4. Kubrat Pulev
5. Bryant Jennings
6. Vyacheslav Glazkov
7. Carlos Takam
8. Bermane Stiverne
9. Tony Thompson
10. Dereck Chisora
11. Artur Szpilka
12. Steve Cunningham
13. Chris Arreola
14. Ruslan Chagaev
15. VACANT

Topic A - Who should take the vacant #15 ranking?

You can submit any heavyweight boxer who has competed in the last 12 months who is not already listed in these rankings. Should no boxer achieve more than 50% of the votes, a new topic with preferential voting will be created.

My vote: Anthony Joshua

[davie]

I'm with you there
AJ may still not have faced the high level of opposition but his ability looks in little doubt.
I don't think he'd be out of his depth fighting anyone from 5 down.

[tiny_acres]

Anthony Joshua. .. even though I want to see him step up the level of competition

[Freedom2013]

Topic A - Who should take the vacant #15 ranking?

My vote: Anthony Joshua

[Horse]

Anthony Joshua.

Although he did cheat against Johnson and could possibly have got disqualified if Johnson had made a meal of it.

[cold187]

Erken Teper - has beaten duhaupas who beat charr who also beat johnson

[crusader]

While he obviously hasn't fought good opposition for a top 15 fighter, the manner in which Joshua is beating his opposition compared to the way that other notable fighters have beaten the same opponents indicates to me that he's deserving of a spot in this list. While he is an offensive force, I'm curious to see how he copes with being hit by hard punches and put under pressure, though I'm not sure if there are many HWs who can do that before being taken out.

Joshua in at #15

[sykessta]

I just wanna know how a Tyson fury is ranked above wilder. I watched Tyson fury fight against Steve Cunningham and that's all it took for me to conclude that he's nothing special. Fought stiff legged, little to no head movement, slow, got floored in the 2nd then proceeded to lay all over cunningham until his legs gave out. I mean all that dude has going for him is size. Plus his level of competition isn't that great. I know Wilder has fought mostly bums but he did just shut stiverne out who beat up arreola. I don't think fury has fought anyone of that magnitude yet.think about it if a blown up cruiser weight like cunningham can put him on his a## with a single shot imagine what guys like wilder or kitschko would do to him.

[Freedom2013]

I just wanna know how a Tyson fury is ranked above wilder. I watched Tyson fury fight against Steve Cunningham and that's all it took for me to conclude that he's nothing special. Fought stiff legged, little to no head movement, slow, got floored in the 2nd then proceeded to lay all over cunningham until his legs gave out. I mean all that dude has going for him is size. Plus his level of competition isn't that great. I know Wilder has fought mostly bums but he did just shut stiverne out who beat up arreola. I don't think fury has fought anyone of that magnitude yet.think about it if a blown up cruiser weight like cunningham can put him on his a## with a single shot imagine what guys like wilder or kitschko would do to him.

Wilder has fought nearly all very low-level journeymen (including several over-40 former pot-bellied former middleweights) while Fury has beaten several contenders (Hammer, Cunningham, Chisora twice) and overall has fought better quality journeymen.

[Horse]

I just wanna know how a Tyson fury is ranked above wilder. I watched Tyson fury fight against Steve Cunningham and that's all it took for me to conclude that he's nothing special. Fought stiff legged, little to no head movement, slow, got floored in the 2nd then proceeded to lay all over cunningham until his legs gave out. I mean all that dude has going for him is size. Plus his level of competition isn't that great. I know Wilder has fought mostly bums but he did just shut stiverne out who beat up arreola. I don't think fury has fought anyone of that magnitude yet.think about it if a blown up cruiser weight like cunningham can put him on his a## with a single shot imagine what guys like wilder or kitschko would do to him.

Chisora and Cunningham are better than Stiverne.

Fury has a much better record than Wilder. He's the clear No. 3.

Pulev should be above Wilder as well.

[Lackeos]

Anthony Joshua

[Tarkus]

Joshua have not fought a live opponent yet. Knocking out journeymen should not give you top 15 rating.

My vote: Malik Scott

[tiny_acres]

Joshua have not fought a live opponent yet. Knocking out journeymen should not give you top 15 rating.

My vote: Malik Scott

Malik Scott??????
The guy that took a dive against Wilder????

[crusader]

I can understand a vote for Scott but his best win is over someone Kevin Johnson stopped and he's been knocked out twice since fighting Glazkov, who then struggled greatly with the very limited Rossy and in my view was very fortunate to get the decision over Cunningham.

The loss to Wilder was also quite bad, even considering that Wilder is a good puncher, and apart from the fighters I've specifically mentioned or whose involvement was implied Scott hasn't fought opponents who are clearly superior to people like Denis Bahktov, whom Joshua quickly destroyed. AJ obviously hasn't fought the best opposition compared to the rest of the top 15, but considering how he's beaten who he's faced I think he's a good choice.

[Tarkus]

Johnson lost 6 fights since he beat Leapai, he is not what he used to be. He is now nothing more then a journeyman.

Whether you like him or not Glaskov is 6th in this ranking and yes Wilder loss/dive was terrible but it is still one loss against the number 4 in the rankings.

Scott also beat Tupou, who was a decent contender.

Joshua has no contenders on his CV. I would say Teper, Tarver, Browne, even Fedosov could all be rated higher then him right now.

[crusader]

Glazkov shouldn't be ranked highly, so I don't think his current ranking should be used as a basis for picking Scott. He's repeatedly looked mediocre and in my view is only unbeaten due to very generous judging, and if Rossy could give him hell I'd expect Joshua to plow through him. The nature of the Wilder loss should be considered in my view because that was an easy win for Wilder even by his standards, and the only other top 15 opponent he faced managed to last much longer.

Johnson has lost several times but he's fought at a high level and did better than the cards would suggest against Charr and Hammer. He has been in with these two, Fury, Chisora, and Vitali, so for Joshua to blow him out so quickly is quite impressive to me considering that he hadn't been stopped before and had only been dropped once. As for Johnson's stoppage victim Alex Leapai, he has now lost three in a row, including a legitimately one-sided loss to Charr in which the latter was winning so comfortably that he was doing Ali shuffles and between rounds performed a cartwheel, and I wouldn't have picked him to beat Johnson at any time

I never considered Tupou a contender, let alone a solid one, but if he was then so was Denis Bakhtov, whom I would consider at least as good as anyone Fedosov has beaten, and wwhile looking at Teper and Brone's records I don't see much to split them from Joshua's. Now admittedly Joshua hasn't fought the best opponents, but in my view manner of victory should also be considered and Joshua has steamrolled his opponents in a way that few others have; that doesn't make him the only acceptable choice to fill the vacancy, but I think he fits better with the top 14 better than the other options do.

[Tarkus]

How can you compare little Bakhtov with his 9 losses against c,d,e level opposition with Tupou who even now only has 3 losses, 2 of them against Scott and Jennings and still can be viewed as a fringe contender.

Yes manner of victory is important. But fact remains that all Joshua opponents came for a payday and a survival not a win. Until he shows he can defeat a live opponent, he should not be in any rankings except perhaps in those for prospects.

[crusader]

How can you compare little Bakhtov with his 9 losses against c,d,e level opposition with Tupou who even now only has 3 losses, 2 of them against Scott and Jennings and still can be viewed as a fringe contender.

Yes manner of victory is important. But fact remains that all Joshua opponents came for a payday and a survival not a win. Until he shows he can defeat a live opponent, he should not be in any rankings except perhaps in those for prospects.

I don't understand why you have such an inflated opinion of Tupou. He isn't even in Boxrec's top 100 (he's at 142 while Bak is at 67), is outside IWBR's top 50 (at 51 while Bak is at 60), and for the most part has beaten dross. Sure, he has fewer losses than Bakhtov, but he also has 16 fewer fights and when has he shown that he'd beat people like Charr, Joshua, JC Gomez, Glazkov, Ustinov, or even Wawrzyk? Maybe being put down and barely scraping by Donnell Holmes does it for you, but it doesn't for me.

I don't think people like Teper, Browne, Scott, and Fedosov have beaten much better opposition than AJ, and considering how the latter has destroyed who he's fought along with some other factors, I think it's enough to give Joshua an edge; it's a pick that considers talent to some extent but I don't see a problem with that.

[Tarkus]

When Tupou met Scott he had one loss and was considered a contender same way Scott was, in fact he was higher rated then, I think he even was a favorite. Joshua have not had a competitive opponent yet. It is not even about the level of competition, but the fact that Joshua never had any competition. Tarver beat Banks. Teper beat that guy. Joshua beat noone. Its a bad precedent to rank fighters purely on potential. Let him beat Charr or some such and then I will be the first to rank him.

[crusader]

Tupou had fought practically no one when he faced Scott, while Bakhtov has been matched tough throughout his career and faced loads of good opponents prior to facing Joshua. Given this and the greater number of fights Bak has had, I don't think Tupou having fewer losses is relevant. Tupou was also dropped by Brian Minto victim Donnell Holmes immediately before fighting Scott and he won only by a point on two cards, so you must have low standards for what makes a 'solid contender'.

Several of the names you list haven't beaten much better opposition than Joshua has in my view, so I don't see it as much of a stretch to rank him ahead of them given how he's performed, which isn't something people are just speculating about.

[dagilechia]

Anthony Joshua

[Lennox]

Anthony Joshua.

His opposition has actually been exceptional for a 13 time fighter, it is just that the 13 fights have been largely uncompetitive because he is so good.

Does anyone really think he would not beat Chagaev if they fought tomorrow?

He is 15 in the IWBR as well which is a merit system.

[Lackeos]

Johnson lost 6 fights since he beat Leapai, he is not what he used to be. He is now nothing more then a journeyman.

Whether you like him or not Glaskov is 6th in this ranking and yes Wilder loss/dive was terrible but it is still one loss against the number 4 in the rankings.

Scott also beat Tupou, who was a decent contender.

Joshua has no contenders on his CV. I would say Teper, Tarver, Browne, even Fedosov could all be rated higher then him right now.

Ah, I see. Johnson is a journeyman, but Tupou is a contender. Thank you for your lack of a valid opinion.

While we're playing extremely fast and loose with terminology, Anthony Joshua is an undisputed champion, while Malik Scott is a tomato can. So that's why you gotta vote Joshua ahead of Scott, is because undisputed champion > tomato can.

[Tarkus]

Johnson lost 6 fights since he beat Leapai, he is not what he used to be. He is now nothing more then a journeyman.

Whether you like him or not Glaskov is 6th in this ranking and yes Wilder loss/dive was terrible but it is still one loss against the number 4 in the rankings.

Scott also beat Tupou, who was a decent contender.

Joshua has no contenders on his CV. I would say Teper, Tarver, Browne, even Fedosov could all be rated higher then him right now.

Ah, I see. Johnson is a journeyman, but Tupou is a contender. Thank you for your lack of a valid opinion.

While we're playing extremely fast and loose with terminology, Anthony Joshua is an undisputed champion, while Malik Scott is a tomato can. So that's why you gotta vote Joshua ahead of Scott, is because undisputed champion > tomato can.

Are you saying Tupou when he met Scott was a journeyman and Johnson when he met Joshua was a contender? Is that what are you saying or you just trying to be a smart ass? Yes I use terms to describe things. What should I use, the attitude?

[Belanio]

Erkan Teper