Hopkins vs Jones II = off? Never on?

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 20 Jan 2006, 08:16

Anyone know what is happening with this intriguing (yes, I think it is) match up.

Its been on the Boxrec schedules for a while, but is now off them.

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 20 Jan 2006, 08:34

According to Bernard Fernadez of Philly.com: Former undisputed middleweight champion Bernard "The Executioner" Hopkins has submitted an audition tape to HBO to succeed Roy Jones Jr. as an analyst for the pay-cable giant's boxing telecasts.

In regards of Hopkins' chances for landing the prized commentating gig", No one has been ruled in or ruled out," HBO spokesman Kevin Flaherty said in Bernard Fernadez's column.

Bernard Fernadez column also quotes Bernard Hopkins in regards to a possible fight with Roy Jones Jr.

From Fernandez's coulmn: Hopkins said "me and Roy is not a dead issue, but HBO realizes I'm in a one-and-done situation. Ross [Greenburg, HBO president] wants to do something special with my last fight, whether it's with or without Roy. One way or another, something good is going to happen for me with this last fight."

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 20 Jan 2006, 08:43

Is Roy leaving HBO? I didn't know that, I know he is not one fight and out - he wants another crack at Tarver apparently.

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 20 Jan 2006, 08:44

12 rounds of them fainting to hit each other and not wanting to get involved and damage their reputations by being stopped, I think I could survive without this one

jab · Post by **jab** » 21 Jan 2006, 21:11

stujones wrote:Is Roy leaving HBO? I didn't know that, I know he is not one fight and out - he wants another crack at Tarver apparently.

Didnt they fight 3 times already??
what would be the point? Tarver koed him once and easily outclassed and outpointed Roy once already. Tarver beat him 2 out of 3 and arguably 3 out of 3. Roy is clearly the weaker fighter. There is nothing to proove, is there?

IF they do fight, a big IF at that, Tarver will ko Roy again.

The guys that Roy should be gunning for are Johnson, Hopkins and Toney. Lacking massive power, Toney can still be a beatable opponent for Roy, given that Toney is nowhere near as fast at his weight as he would need to be against Roy.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2006, 09:23

Jones always avoided a rematch with Toney and with good reason.

At a higher weight I always thought a non weight drained Toney would have given Roy a bad night.

At heavyweight I think he would have sparked Jones, and I thought that even before Jones lost to Tarver.

Achybreaky · Post by **Achybreaky** » 23 Jan 2006, 10:22

Terence wrote:For me if Johnson can trap Jones on the ropes, wear him down and KO him at light-heavy then Toney is more than capable at heavy. I like Jones but feel he is in the Naseem Hamed bracket, great young, on-top fighters with distinct styles who eventually paid for not being able to block, parry and slip shots in an orthodox manner. Fighters who can do these things last longer (Toney and Hopkins) and for me are fighters whereas Jones was more of an athlete. Jones fought with a style that could only be kept up by a young man with no other smarts to fall back on. I like him though and was touched in round 5 of fight 3 with Tarver when Jones produced a little bit and got really excited that he still had "it." His excitement was short-lived but good to see.

Personally Jones - Hopkins is good for me as Jones is shot, Hopkins is faded and cannon-fodder for quick fighters so Jones may muster a little of the required speed to win. Toney - Jones? Toney is my favourite fighter and I'd love him to avenge Jones but not by beating up a badly faded Jones and possibly hurting him at heavyweight. That ship has sailed for James, heavyweight unification will cement James' rep IMO.

Hamed and jones are not comparable in my eyes hamed got beat once by a future hall of famer, jones got knocked out by two men who shouldnt have been able to touch him.

Toney will never unify the heavys either.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2006, 10:25

Jones was a lot older than Hamed, and had a far better resume too.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2006, 10:57

Jones Jr had sound fundamentals, he showed that against Ruiz, when he simply boxed and jabbed all night. I don't know that Hamed ever learned them in the first place.

Jones Jr was shot when he lost to Johnson and Tarver, Hamed wasn't, though he was in decline.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2006, 12:59

At middle and supermiddle, Jones was pretty much untouchable. It would have been interesting to see him rematch Toney at SM, to see whether a non weight drained toney could have caught up to him.

However, Toney struggled with Michael Nunn which suggests that at that weight he probably couldn't have beaten Jones.

At LH and above, where Jones was less mobile and threw less shots as his career went on, Toney would have had a good chance. At Cruiser he would have beaten him in my opinion as by then Toney had improved his fundamentals, whilst Jones had lost a step or two.

I agree about fundamentals to a degree. This is why mayweather is so special, he has the reflexes, speed and ability of RJJ, mixed in with much more solid defensive abilities. He really could be our generations SRL.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 23 Jan 2006, 13:56

Looking at this weekends fights, seeing some parrels between Jones and Morales. Both seem to have gone back afte what I think was their career best performance. Jones was never the same fighter after Ruiz and Morales was never the same fighter after the Pacquiao victory. Although, it is a bit too early to right Eric off as completely finished. I do think we will see a major world title belt in his hands again before he retires.

As for you Jones vs Toney II post, I think most would depend on when the fight took place, as opposed to at what weight.

If it took place before Toney settled as a Cruiserweight around 2002, then regardless of the weight - I would have favoured Jones. A simple comparison of their performances vs Montell Griffin is the reason why. Toney was all over the place mentally, and just couldn't get over the Jones loss - this effected his performances - and the fatter, older Toney of today is a much better fighter than the Toney of 1994-2002.

If the fight took place at even Heavy or Cruiser in 2003, I'm not sure who I would have tipped. Jones did a pretty good job vs Ruiz and might have just had his number. I don't think Toney had the power to hurt Jones and he did seem to retain everything during his long first reign as Light Heavyweight king and looked good in his one proffesional outing as a Heavyweight.

Naturally, I would favour Toney to beat him now in a contest, weights have nothing to do with it - cause I doubt we'll ever see Toney below Cruiserweight again. However, there is still that psychological factor of "got your number" - and I do think Jones will be alot better next time (still a pale shadow though) after he exercised some of his demons vs Tarver.

Achybreaky · Post by **Achybreaky** » 23 Jan 2006, 16:58

Terence wrote:I disagree and think they are very similar. Both were unorthodox and found success of varying levels with this style, both started to fade and behind that unorthodox athletic skill there was a serious lack of boxing basics. If that was not the case then how did Barrera beat Hamed by boxing a very simple fight and how did Jones get beaten by Johnson due to his inability to come up with a B plan once his A game did not work? Because both men hid behind natural somewhat flamboyant gifts that artificially boosted their boxing skills. Jones was a great athlete, not a great fighter. People say the chin faded late-on in a career and this is relative IMO but Jones did go down from the first seriously big shots he took in his career. I just don't think he mastered ring mechanics, if he did he'd have survived fight III with Tarver without excessive running.

As for Toney never unifying, never say never in boxing. Unlike the peace-loving Vitali Toney is prepared to fight when possible and may be inclined to do more than call out a retired Lewis ad nauseam then quit the sport. Unlike Byrd he is capable of being a draw and has not killed public interest stone dead. Unlike Valuev he can fight and Toney is also willing to work with King. If Toney grabs the WBC belt then I can see King unifying with Toney or at least partially unifying as Toney is a draw. Toney/King axis would clean-up shop IMO.

My point was regarding the level of opposition that hamed and jones lost to and less about their styles in hameds case there is no shame in losing to barrera where jones has tarnished his legacy somewhat in losing twice to tarver who i think is not fit to lace his boots if jones is 100%

I cant see toney unifying due to age his lack of discipline in regards to training and his chin hasnt been tested by a huge puncher like brewster or wlad although i can see him being to good for the limited rahman and picking up the title when they fight.