Post Your Scorecards

[scartissue]

OK, finally getting a crack at the 1972 Patterson-Bonavena fight here. Rough fight on the scorer because Patterson throws sharp punches, but just not very many. Understandable at 37. Bonavena actually fights a controlled fight with Gil Clancy in the corner and most of his work is done with his typical wildman pummeling on the inside. Anyways, here we go.

Round 1: Even (not much is done)
Round 2: Even (ditto)
Round 3: Bonavena
Round 4: Bonavena (Oscar scores a knockdown)
Round 5: Bonavena
Round 6: Patterson
Round 7: Bonavena
Round 8: Patterson (very close-if anyone scores this even or for Bonavena I wouldn't blink an eye)
Round 9: Patterson
Round 10: Patterson

Now, this is scored on NY rules which is simply a rounds basis, which my card is obviously 4-4-2 a draw. However, NY also employs the supplemental system in the event of a draw, which allows me to score the fight 5-4 in Bonavena's favor due to the 4th round knockdown. I'd love to see anyone else's score on this one.

[Ambling Alp II]

I saw this a long time ago, but I had definitely had Patterson winning. Agree that it was one of those fights where one guy throws more punches (Bonavena), but doesn't land as cleanly.

[scartissue]

Just watched a really good vid of the first Jose Napoles-Hedgemon Lewis fight on youtube. The minute's rest is deleted so it is 15 rounds of good, but tactical boxing. Here we go on the California scoring system of one point for a round, additional point for a knockdown (N/A in this case) and no points for an even round.

Round 1: Napoles
Round 2: Lewis
Round 3: Even
Round 4: Napoles
Round 5: Napoles
Round 6: Napoles
Round 7: Lewis
Round 8: Even
Round 9: Napoles
Round 10: Napoles
Round 11: Napoles
Round 12: Napoles
Round 13: Even
Round 14: Lewis
Round 15: Napoles

Total: 9-3 Napoles

I recall seeing this on delay when it took place back in '71 or I saw it early in '72 and I had it for Napoles but much closer. I must be more appreciative of Napoles' body work these days. Anyone see this one?

[dagosd2000]

Just watched a really good vid of the first Jose Napoles-Hedgemon Lewis fight on youtube. The minute's rest is deleted so it is 15 rounds of good, but tactical boxing. Here we go on the California scoring system of one point for a round, additional point for a knockdown (N/A in this case) and no points for an even round.

Round 1: Napoles
Round 2: Lewis
Round 3: Even
Round 4: Napoles
Round 5: Napoles
Round 6: Napoles
Round 7: Lewis
Round 8: Even
Round 9: Napoles
Round 10: Napoles
Round 11: Napoles
Round 12: Napoles
Round 13: Even
Round 14: Lewis
Round 15: Napoles

Total: 9-3 Napoles

I recall seeing this on delay when it took place back in '71 or I saw it early in '72 and I had it for Napoles but much closer. I must be more appreciative of Napoles' body work these days. Anyone see this one?

Dan,I went up to the Forum and saw this fight. Lewis didn't want to engage much. Hedge lacked the strength when he fought Napoles,Lopez,and Stracey.The co main with this fight was Olivares stopping Jesus Pimental.

[scartissue]

Just watched a really good vid of the first Jose Napoles-Hedgemon Lewis fight on youtube. The minute's rest is deleted so it is 15 rounds of good, but tactical boxing. Here we go on the California scoring system of one point for a round, additional point for a knockdown (N/A in this case) and no points for an even round.

Round 1: Napoles
Round 2: Lewis
Round 3: Even
Round 4: Napoles
Round 5: Napoles
Round 6: Napoles
Round 7: Lewis
Round 8: Even
Round 9: Napoles
Round 10: Napoles
Round 11: Napoles
Round 12: Napoles
Round 13: Even
Round 14: Lewis
Round 15: Napoles

Total: 9-3 Napoles

I recall seeing this on delay when it took place back in '71 or I saw it early in '72 and I had it for Napoles but much closer. I must be more appreciative of Napoles' body work these days. Anyone see this one?

Dan,I went up to the Forum and saw this fight. Lewis didn't want to engage much. Hedge lacked the strength when he fought Napoles,Lopez,and Stracey.The co main with this fight was Olivares stopping Jesus Pimental.

I can definitely see that. Hedge was so slick and really had a beautiful style, but Mantequilla forced that inside fight and that was a real body-thumping he dished out. I also recall seeing the same thing against Lopez. At times it looked like a boy against a man when you see Lopez out-muscling him. Thanks for the insight, Rog.

[dagosd2000]

Dan,if you watch Napoles' fights he wanted to start fast and dominate his opponent. He hurt Lewis the first round of that fight and that made Hedge want to back off. In the 14th round Lewis hit Jose a good shot and buckled Jose's knees,but he wasn't really hurt. A lot of viewers were made to think the fight was actually close.After the fight Napoles referred to Lewis as being a rabbit.When Jose was beaten by Monzon,he chose to give Lewis a rematch in Mexico City.By that time it was known that Hedge couldn't hang with a stronger fighter.

BTW,regarding Napoles' starting fast. Watch the Monzon fight.Napoles wins the first three rounds. Gil Clancy(who's announcing)is thinking Jose is going to pull it off. He mentions that Ray Robinson thinks he's the best fighter in the world.But Jose didn't dedicate himself to training,was sluggish,couldn't move for 15 rounds weighing 156 pounds,and when Monzon opened up his cuts it was over.

Watch the Stracey fight.Napoles knocks him down in the first round.At that point in his career Napoles trained for about 4 rounds thinking he could dust off his opponents.By the sixth rounds Jose's legs looked like they were imbedded in concrete. You can tell when a fighter doesn't have it anymore when he opens his stance and can't move.There was a time after that fight that he was thinking of fighting a rematch with Stracey.It was better off that he didn't.





Jose "Mantequilla" Napoles was nice enough to let me take a pic with him in front of his house. Ciudad Juarez,Mexico,Sept. 2014

[Seamus]

I had it 10-3-2 for Napoles, but would you believe Lewis thought he was robbed ?

[dagosd2000]

I had it 10-3-2 for Napoles, but would you believe Lewis thought he was robbed ?

After that fight,Ryan O Neal did a lot of squaking saying his guy was robbed.I remember one night at the Jai Alai Palace in Tijuana,Hedgemon Lewis fought a pretty fair Mexican welter named Raul Rodriguez. O Neal and his entourage were in the crowd.All Hollywood types with the blond hair. Well, Lewis cut the guy to ribbons. I never saw so much blood. The crowd then turned not only on Lewis,but O Neal and the starlets.Lewis didn't have time to get to the dressing room.He found his group out on the street. I'm sure Ryan had something more logical to complain about.

[dagosd2000]

I had it 10-3-2 for Napoles, but would you believe Lewis thought he was robbed ?

After that fight,Ryan O Neal did a lot of squaking saying his guy was robbed.I remember one night at the Jai Alai Palace in Tijuana,Hedgemon Lewis fought a pretty fair Mexican welter named Raul Rodriguez. O Neal and his entourage were in the crowd.All Hollywood types with the blond hair. Well, Lewis cut the guy to ribbons. I never saw so much blood. The crowd then turned not only on Lewis,but O Neal and the starlets.Lewis didn't have time to get to the dressing room.He found his group out on the street within the protection of the cops. I'm sure Ryan had something more logical to complain about that night.

[Seamus]

Montell Griffin vs James Toney II

R1.10-9 MG
R2.10-9 MG
R3.10-9 MG
R4.10-9 JT
R5.10-9 JT
R6.10-9 MG
R7.10-9 MG
R8.10-10 Even
R9.10-9 MG
R10.10-10 Even
R11.10-9 JT
R12.10-9 MG

Montell Griffin 117-113

Harold Lederman, George Foreman and the rest thought Toney was robbed, but I thought two of the judges had it just about right. Both guys should have pressed the action a little more. Griffin gave Toney alot of difficult angles throughout the bout and made him look very beatable.

[Ambling Alp II]

I remember this fight very well. I thought Griffin just pulled it out. There were some close rounds and I could see someone thinking Toney barely won or scored it a draw. However, I distinctively remember the announcers saying Toney was robbed and I was thinking what are they talking about.

[Ambling Alp II]

Dan,if you watch Napoles' fights he wanted to start fast and dominate his opponent. He hurt Lewis the first round of that fight and that made Hedge want to back off. In the 14th round Lewis hit Jose a good shot and buckled Jose's knees,but he wasn't really hurt. A lot of viewers were made to think the fight was actually close.After the fight Napoles referred to Lewis as being a rabbit.When Jose was beaten by Monzon,he chose to give Lewis a rematch in Mexico City.By that time it was known that Hedge couldn't hang with a stronger fighter.

BTW,regarding Napoles' starting fast. Watch the Monzon fight.Napoles wins the first three rounds. Gil Clancy(who's announcing)is thinking Jose is going to pull it off. He mentions that Ray Robinson thinks he's the best fighter in the world.But Jose didn't dedicate himself to training,was sluggish,couldn't move for 15 rounds weighing 156 pounds,and when Monzon opened up his cuts it was over.

Watch the Stracey fight.Napoles knocks him down in the first round.At that point in his career Napoles trained for about 4 rounds thinking he could dust off his opponents.By the sixth rounds Jose's legs looked like they were imbedded in concrete. You can tell when a fighter doesn't have it anymore when he opens his stance and can't move.There was a time after that fight that he was thinking of fighting a rematch with Stracey.It was better off that he didn't.





Jose "Mantequilla" Napoles was nice enough to let me take a pic with him in front of his house. Ciudad Juarez,Mexico,Sept. 2014

Cool picture!

[scartissue]

Dan,if you watch Napoles' fights he wanted to start fast and dominate his opponent. He hurt Lewis the first round of that fight and that made Hedge want to back off. In the 14th round Lewis hit Jose a good shot and buckled Jose's knees,but he wasn't really hurt. A lot of viewers were made to think the fight was actually close.After the fight Napoles referred to Lewis as being a rabbit.When Jose was beaten by Monzon,he chose to give Lewis a rematch in Mexico City.By that time it was known that Hedge couldn't hang with a stronger fighter.

BTW,regarding Napoles' starting fast. Watch the Monzon fight.Napoles wins the first three rounds. Gil Clancy(who's announcing)is thinking Jose is going to pull it off. He mentions that Ray Robinson thinks he's the best fighter in the world.But Jose didn't dedicate himself to training,was sluggish,couldn't move for 15 rounds weighing 156 pounds,and when Monzon opened up his cuts it was over.

Watch the Stracey fight.Napoles knocks him down in the first round.At that point in his career Napoles trained for about 4 rounds thinking he could dust off his opponents.By the sixth rounds Jose's legs looked like they were imbedded in concrete. You can tell when a fighter doesn't have it anymore when he opens his stance and can't move.There was a time after that fight that he was thinking of fighting a rematch with Stracey.It was better off that he didn't.





Jose "Mantequilla" Napoles was nice enough to let me take a pic with him in front of his house. Ciudad Juarez,Mexico,Sept. 2014

Rog, I love that painting you did of Mantequilla as well.

[Seamus]

Stracey v Napoles bout had a quite a turn around. Went from Mantequilla looking like he was going to make short work of the Brit, to a few rounds later when Stracey started battering the champion around the ring.

[scartissue]

Today I wanted to have a look-see at the Jimmy Ellis-Oscar Bonavena fight, but I found it too grainy. However, I found a gem that I didn't know was on youtube and that was the Jimmy Ellis-George Chuvalo fight. It wasn't high-def but it wasn't too shabby and I thoroughly enjoyed this one. A damn good fight scored on the 5 point must system in Ontario.

Round 1: 5-4 Ellis
Round 2: 5-4 Ellis
Round 3: 5-4 Chuvalo
Round 4: 5-5 Even
Round 5: 5-4 Chuvalo
Round 6: 5-4 Ellis
Round 7: 5-4 Chuvalo
Round 8: 5-4 Ellis
Round 9: 5-5 Even
Round 10: 5-4 Ellis

Total: 47-45 Ellis

Notes:

1) Ellis really was an underrated fighter and puncher. His right hand was so sharp and - I've never heard this reported before but - that slip by Chuvalo in the 1st round...well, let's just say there are some refs that would have scored that a knockdown. Just from body language in that 1st round one can see Chuvalo was rattled by those rights. Very sharp and very pinpoint.

2) Rounds 9 & 10 they really let it hang out. Really good rounds.

3) The scorecard of Tony Canzano had it really wide for Ellis. I think something like 7-1-2, which is ridiculous. Canzano was a Canadian judge and I think he was always overcompensating, trying to show his impartiality. I remember him in the Jose Napoles-Clyde Gray fight and again had the biggest score for the visitor. Either that or he just had a thing for Irv Ungerman fighters.

[Seamus]

Virgil Hill vs Fabrice Tiozzo I

R1.10-8 VH (knockdown)
R2.10-8 VH (knockdown)
R3.10-9 VH
R4.10-10
R5.10-9 FT
R6.10-8 FT (1 pt taken from Hill)
R7.10-10
R8.10-9 VH
R9.9-9 (1 pt taken from Hill for low blow)
R10.10-9 VH
R11.10-9 VH
R12.10-10

Virgil Hill 116-111

Drake Thadzi vs James Toney

R1.10-9 JT
R2.10-10
R3.10-9 DT
R4.10-9 DT
R5.10-10
R6.10-9 DT
R7.10-9 DT
R8.10-10
R9.10-9 DT
R10.10-9 DT
R11.10-9 DT
R12.10-9 DT

Drake Thadzi 119-112

Dariusz Michalczewski vs Drake Thadzi

R1.10-9 DT
R2.10-9 DT
R3.10-9 DT
R4.10-9 DM
R5.10-10
R6.10-9 DM
R7.10-10
R8.10-9 DM

77-77 at the time of the stoppage.

As for comments on these 3 fights. Despite the partisan crowd, Tiozzo, who I think is a very good fighter, just didn't do enough to win, both guys made use of there jab, but the Frenchmen wasn't busy enough.

James Toney looked awful against Drake Thadzi, who wasn't that much better, except he clearly wanted it more. Toney began several rounds bouncing on his toes and throwing good crisp jabs, and 40 seconds later he was flatfooted not punching and being pushed around the ring.

Against Michalczewski, Thadzi looked waaay better than he did against Toney. He came up jabbing and throwing combinations and swept the first 3 rds. Gradually Michalczewski's stamina became a factor, but I still had it even at the time of the surprise ending in the 9th. Thadzi took a shot to the jaw turned away and appeared to quit, causing the referee to stop the fight. Didn't appear to be any protest from him or his corner, so I have no idea what really happened.

[scartissue]

Azumah Nelson vs. Jeff Fenech I

Don't know why I missed this when it happened. Always heard the stories of the robbery and finally now am sitting down to watch it, enjoy it and score it.

Round 1: 10-9 Nelson
Round 2: 10-9 Nelson
Round 3: 10-9 Fenech
Round 4: 10-9 Fenech
Round 5: 10-9 Fenech
Round 6: 10-9 Fenech
Round 7: 10-9 Fenech
Round 8: 10-9 Fenech
Round 9: 10-10 Even
Round 10: 10-9 Fenech
Round 11: 10-9 Nelson
Round 12: 10-9 Fenech

Score: 117-112 Fenech

I will say this, rounds 3, 4 & 5, which were fought in the corner with Fenech the aggressor. I would have no problem anyone scoring any of these rounds even or for Nelson. They were that tight. Those counters that Nelson was landing were intense. I just thought Fenech shaded those rounds. Has this fight been commented on here before?

[Seamus]

Posted this March 2013

Azumah Nelson vs Jeff Fenech I

R1.10-9 AN
R2.10-9 AN
R3.10-9 JF
R4.10-9 JF
R5.10-9 JF
R6.10-9 AN
R7.10-9 JF
R8.10-9 JF
R9.10-9 JF
R10.10-9 JF
R11.Even 10-10
R12.10-9 JF

Jeff Fenech 117-112

Now that I've watched it in it's entirety and scored it, YES, Jeff Fenech was absolutely robbed.

[scartissue]

Wow, that's pretty damning evidence in the wake of the similarity of our cards.

[Ambling Alp II]

I think you have to draw a distinction between a "robbery" and a decision that you disagree with.
I always make a a little note if a round was really close and could reasonably have gone the way.

If you do give Nelson the 3rd, 4th, and 5th rounds, he would win 115-114.

[Seamus]

I can't see any argument for Nelson winning that fight. That was just a very bad decision.

[RadioElRadar]

Azumah Nelson vs Jeff Fenech I

1. Nelson
2. Nelson
3. Fenech
4. Even
5. Fenech
6. Fenech
7. Fenech
8. Fenech
9. Nelson
10. Even
11. Fenech
12. Fenech

117-113 Fenech

[Seamus]

Barry McGuigan vs Juan LaPorte

R1.JL
R2.BM
R3.BM
R4.BM
R5.BM
R6.BM
R7.BM
R8.BM
R9.JL
R10.BM

Not sure what scoring system was used for this fight, but I had it 8-2 in rds or 98-92 for Barry McGuigan.

If you need a reminder of just how good Barry McGuigan was, this is the fight to watch. In the first major test of his career, McGuigan simply has too much pace for the excellent Puerto Rican fighter, who had more than his share of very strong performances against impressive opposition. Laporte lands hard shots in the 5th and the 9th, but McGuigan still works him dizzy with head movement and flurries of punches that just keep coming. Barry looked better against LaPorte than Sanchez, Chavez, Nelson, or Pedroza, and only Wilfredo Gomez turned in a more dominant performance.

[Counter-puncher]

That's a really good post as usual Seamus. Mcguigans workrate was phenomenal, and, as Manny steward used to say, that kind of pressure from a tall fighter (he was what 5'7 and with long arms for his height) is very difficult to deal with. His combination of footwork, head movement and punch output made it impossible for laporte- who whilst a good fighter liked work at his own pace- to ever get going.

[Counter-puncher]

That right hand laporte landed in the 5th, massive clean shot? You mention mcguigan recovering, I remember seeing him say once he was still feeling the effects a couple of rounds later. I'll ask orbtastic if he remembers what he said, it was a nice description.