GGG-Lemieux is on for October 17th!!

[jamesmcdonnell]

Because Lemiuex has improved (he was also well ahead against Rubio, so it's not like he was way out of his depth) and is one of the top middleweights now with arguably the biggest punch?

Or do we live in that world where we write everyone off after early struggles? Remember that when Ward was also around 22 clubfighter Andy Kolle hurt him....

I can definitely envisage a scenario where Lemieux wins, depends just how hard he punches, and just how tough or smart GGG is.

[crow]

Shouldn't this take place in Canada ?

Canadians will come in mass to support Lemieux.

[caldo2025]

I can definitely envisage a scenario where Lemieux wins, depends just how hard he punches, and just how tough or smart GGG is.

The more that I think about this fight, the more I feel that Lemieux will end up struggling badly. There's been points in the last few Lemieux fights were he got backed up and that when he took a lot of punches. He doesn't get backed up often because he's a pressure fighter like GGG so he's a totally different fighter backing up. I can't help but think he's going to be backing up more than GGG in this one. It could be a whipping but i'm really hoping not. I just hope Lemieux's camp is working on this and not thinking that he's going to dictate the action in there.

[world ranked]

Because Lemiuex has improved (he was also well ahead against Rubio, so it's not like he was way out of his depth) and is one of the top middleweights now with arguably the biggest punch?

Or do we live in that world where we write everyone off after early struggles? Remember that when Ward was also around 22 clubfighter Andy Kolle hurt him....

But were making the assumption that he better. Its not not proven he hasnt been in with a puncher since.

[world ranked]

Because Lemiuex has improved (he was also well ahead against Rubio, so it's not like he was way out of his depth) and is one of the top middleweights now with arguably the biggest punch?

Or do we live in that world where we write everyone off after early struggles? Remember that when Ward was also around 22 clubfighter Andy Kolle hurt him....

But were making the assumption that he better. Its not not proven he hasnt been in with a puncher since.

[crusader]

Because Lemiuex has improved (he was also well ahead against Rubio, so it's not like he was way out of his depth) and is one of the top middleweights now with arguably the biggest punch?

Or do we live in that world where we write everyone off after early struggles? Remember that when Ward was also around 22 clubfighter Andy Kolle hurt him....

But were making the assumption that he better. Its not not proven he hasnt been in with a puncher since.

He also lost to Alcine after Rubio, but I think his wins over Rosado and N'dam, the latter of whom was a solid contender and probably top 10, showed that he's clearly improved from those points and his performances against Rosado, N'dam, and Guerrero are overall no worse than Quillin's. I also think it's clear if you've followed his career that he paces himself better, and that's relevant here because he notably started gassing in the Rubio fight, and quickly went from dominating each of the first 5 rounds to flagging in the 6th before he was hurt.

I'll also point out that despite not being the most difficult to hit that was the only fight in which he was hurt, so while he may not be the most durable I don't consider him fragile either.

[Tanzio]

Because Lemiuex has improved (he was also well ahead against Rubio, so it's not like he was way out of his depth) and is one of the top middleweights now with arguably the biggest punch?

Or do we live in that world where we write everyone off after early struggles? Remember that when Ward was also around 22 clubfighter Andy Kolle hurt him....

But were making the assumption that he better. Its not not proven he hasnt been in with a puncher since.

He also lost to Alcine after Rubio, but I think his wins over Rosado and N'dam, the latter of whom was a solid contender and probably top 10, showed that he's clearly improved from those points and his performances against Rosado, N'dam, and Guerrero are overall no worse than Quillin's. I also think it's clear if you've followed his career that he paces himself better, and that's relevant here because he notably started gassing in the Rubio fight, and quickly went from dominating each of the first 5 rounds to flagging in the 6th before he was hurt.

I'll also point out that despite not being the most difficult to hit that was the only fight in which he was hurt, so while he may not be the most durable I don't consider him fragile either.

Nice post.

Lemieux does not need this fight. He could cherry pick opponents for the rest of his career and do quite well financially in Canada.

They must believe that they have detected a flaw in 3G's game that they can exploit. Or, maybe this is the do or die moment for Lemieux. They figure he is at the best level that he will ever be at so take a shot at history.

I made a bit of fun of Lemieux as he came up, because of the bandwagon (mostly Canadian occupants) that formed far too early. When Rubio exposed him I emphasized the obvious about the young man's shortcomings and his entourage. When he lost to Alcine I concluded that he would go back to school and end up working for Canada's vast government in some capacity.

No matter what happens v 3G, Lemieux has won me over. His hard work to get back into position, his willingness to test himself against the best, his dedication to learning, his fan friendly style, and his gentlemanly demeanor are great for boxing.

[Kootenay47]

[/quote] When Rubio exposed him I emphasized the obvious about the young man's shortcomings and his entourage. When he lost to Alcine I concluded that he would go back to school and end up working for Canada's vast government in some capacity.[/quote]

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I don't think Lemieux's trainer or manager were the problem when he lost to Rubio . He was just inexperienced against a pro that could handle his pressure , some things a fighter just has to figure out for himself and losing against Rubio was probably more useful to him than winning at that stage of his career. The loss to Alcine was tough but he proved his character by persevering and is now a more well rounded fighter than before.

Fighting Golovkin is a good career move , he will get a decent payday and has a chance to win . The rewards outweigh the risk . Should Lemieux lose , he will still be a draw because of his style . If he wins then he gets a rematch with Golovkin . It will be interesting seeing how this fight unfolds , will Golovkin box carefully or will they stand and trade from the get-go .

[Tanzio]

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I don't think Lemieux's trainer or manager were the problem when he lost to Rubio . He was just inexperienced against a pro that could handle his pressure , some things a fighter just has to figure out for himself and losing against Rubio was probably more useful to him than winning at that stage of his career. The loss to Alcine was tough but he proved his character by persevering and is now a more well rounded fighter than before.

Fighting Golovkin is a good career move , he will get a decent payday and has a chance to win . The rewards outweigh the risk . Should Lemieux lose , he will still be a draw because of his style . If he wins then he gets a rematch with Golovkin . It will be interesting seeing how this fight unfolds , will Golovkin box carefully or will they stand and trade from the get-go .

I wasn't clear. By entourage I meant his wider following including the bandwagon, not his manager and trainer.

Lemieux must look to go inside and move 3G back. He has looked most vulnerable when opponents stand their ground and move forward.

[Kootenay47]

yes Lemi has to pressure GGG and he will , unfortunately for him GGG is a master of angles and footwork . I don't think it will take GGG very long to figure out Lemi . I don't see this fight going more than 4 rounds , just too much power on display.

[world ranked]

If a fighter with Lemieux exact record beat the same guys with no power we'd destroying this fight but somehow because he has power we hoping he gives GGG a fight but reality no has more chance to even be more competive than anyone GGG has already been in with. Fans falling for the power.

[Tanzio]

If a fighter with Lemieux exact record beat the same guys with no power we'd destroying this fight but somehow because he has power we hoping he gives GGG a fight but reality no has more chance to even be more competive than anyone GGG has already been in with. Fans falling for the power.

Nobody is picking Lemieux but because of his power and overall improvement this is an interesting test for 3G. I think most of us are relatively surprised that the Canadian took the fight at this point.

[ikorolev]

I am not surprised that Lemieux is taking the fight. I am surprised that his manager and DLH failed to talk him out of it. Maybe that was a price for Golovkin to step aside allowing Canelo to fight for the WBC belt, or maybe DLH wants to test Golovkin's PPV drawing power to decide if Canelo should fight him after Cotto.

[Tanzio]

I am not surprised that Lemieux is taking the fight. I am surprised that his manager and DLH failed to talk him out of it. Maybe that was a price for Golovkin to step aside allowing Canelo to fight for the WBC belt, or maybe DLH wants to test Golovkin's PPV drawing power to decide if Canelo should fight him after Cotto.

Lemieux could have kept building his brand and wait for 3G to get older or just move up, like Quillin, etc have. Lemieux would have a far better chance v Lee or Quillin or Cotto, etc.

Hopefully, Lemieux will come to win.

[jockpunk]

I'm guessing oscar told lemieux that he will get canelo if he wins.

[crusader]

If a fighter with Lemieux exact record beat the same guys with no power we'd destroying this fight but somehow because he has power we hoping he gives GGG a fight but reality no has more chance to even be more competive than anyone GGG has already been in with. Fans falling for the power.

For me it's the power and style of Lemieux that makes it interesting. Some other fighter with the same record who doesn't have much power and likes to box from the outside, for example, wouldn't interest me as much because I believe that GGG is most susceptible to pressure and he's looked fairly easy to hit in his last few fights, which are bigger problems against aggressive fighters with serious power than unaggressive fighters without serious pop. I also find Lemieux more entertaining than most other top fighters at the weight, and I'm expecting this fight to be an enjoyable watch.

You can't just throw people with the same record into the same bag.

[ikorolev]

Even two fighters with exact same record and the same power can't always be considered to be of the same level. Lemieux lost when he was 22. He is a different fighter now. I strongly doubt that Rubio would beat him now.

[Kootenay47]

I would like to see Lemieux fight Rubio again . Rubio is a solid pro and he has beat Lemi so that adds a dimension .

[Freedom2013]

James Prince, Bryant Jennings manager, turned down the offer to fight Luis Ortiz.

But Ortiz will likely still be on the card. I wonder who will step up and fight him?

A fringe contender like Ustinov, Teper, Takam or Wach would be all right.

[jockpunk]

My prediction is they offer the fight to amir monsour (i don't think he is with haymon)

[world ranked]

If a fighter with Lemieux exact record beat the same guys with no power we'd destroying this fight but somehow because he has power we hoping he gives GGG a fight but reality no has more chance to even be more competive than anyone GGG has already been in with. Fans falling for the power.

For me it's the power and style of Lemieux that makes it interesting. Some other fighter with the same record who doesn't have much power and likes to box from the outside, for example, wouldn't interest me as much because I believe that GGG is most susceptible to pressure and he's looked fairly easy to hit in his last few fights, which are bigger problems against aggressive fighters with serious power than unaggressive fighters without serious pop. I also find Lemieux more entertaining than most other top fighters at the weight, and I'm expecting this fight to be an enjoyable watch.

You can't just throw people with the same record into the same bag.

Is his style that much different that Stevens?

[crusader]

There's a very clear difference to me.

Despite his reputation as a good puncher Stevens isn't an aggressive fighter and he doesn't like to press the action. Instead he sits back and waits for opportunities to counter, which often leads to long stretches of him not doing much offensively. These tendencies were visible in his fight with Johnson, with him largely shelling up between an occasional left hook, as well as his fight with N'dam, in which he came forward but was clearly uncomfortable with the role and rarely got shots off despite the veneer of agression that was produced by him coming forward.

Lemieux, on the other hand, is a natural aggressor who prefers to move ahead and isn't afraid to let his hands go or take some shots as he does so, which is apparent in his fight against N'dam and in my view part of the reason he was able to clearly win and score 4 knockdowns while Stevens was widely beaten and hardly landed anything against the same opponent.

I think this is significant against GGG because as I've mentioned I think the latter has looked most vulnerable and ineffective when pressured and pushed back, which to me seems far more likely to consistently come from Lemieux than it did from Stevens, who for the most part fought as he usually does and thus allowed GGG to bully him.

[Tarkus]

GGG because as I've mentioned I think the latter has looked most vulnerable and ineffective when pressured and pushed back,.

Where have you seen GGG vulnerable. Only guy who came aggressively at him was Proksa and he got obliterated. Adamu was punching with him early and was broken down in time. I have not seen GGG vulnerable.

[crusader]

Vulnerable means "susceptible to physical or emotional attack or harm", and emphasizing the harm part of that definition I'd say that he was clearly vulnerable in the Ouma bout. I was also speaking in relative terms, so while I didn't mean to suggest that he looked on the verge of losing, was hurt, or anything to that effect, I think he's had the biggest problems when opponents stand their ground, trade with him in close, and/or push him back.

Rosado had all of his limited success doing this yet was invariably pounded when he tried moving around the outside; Adama won a round very clearly to me when he let his hands go and pushed GGG back, where the latter's offense is negated and he goes entirely defensive, yet he lost every second of the fight in which he was the one moving back; Stevens had his best moments when he found the courage to come at GGG with punches rather than just shelling up; Monroe tried being cagey on the outside but was trapped along the ropes and dropped twice only to greatly increase his success and arguably win a couple rounds when he took a more aggressive approach inside; and Murray had a bright start to his fight with GGG by coming out fairly aggressively but then started being driven back more and was unsurprisingly dropped all three times when he was near the ropes.

Most of GGG's stoppages have come when he's able to bully opponents and punch from mid-range where his somewhat looping shots have maximum power. To me he hasn't looked nearly as effective when he's inside with an opponent and has to significantly tighten his shots up (whereas Lemieux is most effective here), and I think DL may actually be the least vulnerable if he can find his way inside and stay there--to borrow a metaphor used by someone else to describe it, it may be safest for him in the eye of the storm.

[Tarkus]

I meant Kassim Ouma previously not Adamu of course.

I dont think those examples count as vulnerable. When someone comes at you and throws punches at you it always takes time to put them in place. Look at this weeks Parker fight, before he landed that murderous right he looked quite bothered. Anyone thinking GGG can be seriously troubled by pressure should watch Proksa fight. Of course a better and stronger fighter could do a better job, but I dont think we have seen it. Also, when Stevens went in the shell after KD, GGG dropped his guard and invited the attack, took few heavy blows, brushed them off and tear him apart. This is to say he is prepared to take big punches and Lemieux cant rely on one big punch for win.

So, even tough I am excited by the bout, I cant see much hope for Lemieux in this.