Ranking Lee, Murray, Barker & Macklin

[johnswan1]

Obviously Lee and Murray have a bit more to do before we can really rank them properly.

It's a shame how we never managed to see any them face off against each other, but how do you rank them overall?

Mine as follows:

1st Andy Lee

Achievements
Three world title fights and record of 1-1-1. Current WBO Middleweight Champion. None of those he faced Chavez Jr/Korobov/Quillin can be considered as elite, but all three were at least undefeated and in their primes when Andy faced them and he only lost to one of them. Lee is still in his prime and may yet achieve more.

Defeats
Losses to Vera (avenged) and Chavez Jr. For me the Chavez Jr loss is a big negative on Lees record.

Prediction
Beats Murray on points in close fight, stops Barker and Macklin (highlight reel job).

2nd Martin Murray

Achievements
Prizefighter winner and three time world title challenger. Although he is 0-2-1 in those challenges, many felt he won the Sturm fight while the Martinez fight was close and on foreign soil (although I didn't think he did enough in the last couple of rounds of that fight to nick it). Martin is as tough as they come with all three challenges on the road, and is the man who has lasted longest with Golovkin. He's at least as good as an average beltholder but whether he wins one himself at SM remains to be seen. I have a feeling he won't, but I'd love to see him in with Groves or DeGale. The reason why I rank him below Lee is because he doesn't have a win of significance on his record. We are yet to see whether the Golovkin defeat leaves any lasting physical or mental effect.

Defeats
Draw with Sturm (controversial), Martinez (close) & Golovkin (KO defeat).

Prediction
Loses to Lee on points in close fight, stops Barker late and beats Macklin on points in close fight.

3rd Darren Barker

Achievements
Three world title fights and record of 1-2. Former IBF Middleweight Champion. Famously got back up off the canvas to rally to an emotional victory against Daniel Geale. Prior to this he was competitive over the first half of his fight with Martinez before getting worn down late. He later was blown away by Sturm in Germany when attempting to fight/cash in with a hip injury. Barker was lucky to get the shot against Geale who was a relatively weak opponent to those faced by Murray and didn't perform as well against Martinez as Murray did, which he why I rank him below Murray.

Defeats
Stoppage defeats against both Martinez and Sturm.

Prediction
Gets stopped by Lee and Murray, beats Macklin on points in close fight.

4th Matthew Macklin

Achievements
A popular all action fighter who lost a close split decision to Sturm in Germany before he fought Murray. Gave a strong performance against Martinez before succumbing late and then got destroyed by Golovkin in three rounds. Now trying Light Middle, it's highly unlikely he will be a serious world player again.

Defeats
Early career defeats against Facey and most memorably vs current trainer Jamie Moore, Matt lost all three of his title challenges and has since been stopped again whilst rebuilding against supposed light opponent Heiland in Dublin.

Prediction
Gets stopped by Lee and loses to Barker and Murray on points in close fights.

[cocobongo]

Obviously Lee and Murray have a bit more to do before we can really rank them properly.

It's a shame how we never managed to see any them face off against each other, but how do you rank them overall?

Mine as follows:

1st Andy Lee

Achievements
Three world title fights and record of 1-1-1. Current WBO Middleweight Champion. None of those he faced Chavez Jr/Korobov/Quillin can be considered as elite, but all three were at least undefeated and in their primes when Andy faced them and he only lost to one of them. Lee is still in his prime and may yet achieve more.

Defeats
Losses to Vera (avenged) and Chavez Jr. For me the Chavez Jr loss is a big negative on Lees record.

Prediction
Beats Murray on points in close fight, stops Barker and Macklin (highlight reel job).

2nd Martin Murray

Achievements
Prizefighter winner and three time world title challenger. Although he is 0-3 in those challenges, many felt he won the Sturm fight while the Martinez fight was close and on foreign soil (although I didn't think he did enough in the last couple of rounds of that fight to nick it). Martin is as tough as they come with all three challenges on the road, and is the man who has lasted longest with Golovkin. He's at least as good as an average beltholder but whether he wins one himself at SM remains to be seen. I have a feeling he won't, but I'd love to see him in with Groves or DeGale. The reason why I rank him below Lee is because he doesn't have a win of significance on his record. We are yet to see whether the Golovkin defeat leaves any lasting physical or mental effect.

Defeats
Losses to Sturm (controversial), Martinez (close) & Golovkin (KO defeat).

Prediction
Loses to Lee on points in close fight, stops Barker late and beats Macklin on points in close fight.

3rd Darren Barker

Achievements
Three world title fights and record of 1-2. Former IBF Middleweight Champion. Famously got back up off the canvas to rally to an emotional victory against Daniel Geale. Prior to this he was competitive over the first half of his fight with Martinez before getting worn down late. He later was blown away by Sturm in Germany when attempting to fight/cash in with a hip injury. Barker was lucky to get the shot against Geale who was a relatively weak opponent to those faced by Murray and didn't perform as well against Martinez as Murray did, which he why I rank him below Murray.

Defeats
Stoppage defeats against both Martinez and Sturm.

Prediction
Gets stopped by Lee and Murray, beats Macklin on points in close fight.

4th Matthew Macklin

Achievements
A popular all action fighter who lost a close split decision to Sturm in Germany before he fought Murray. Gave a strong performance against Martinez before succumbing late and then got destroyed by Golovkin in three rounds. Now trying Light Middle, it's highly unlikely he will be a serious world player again.

Defeats
Early career defeats against Facey and most memorably vs current trainer Jamie Moore, Matt lost all three of his title challenges and has since been stopped again whilst rebuilding against supposed light opponent Heiland in Dublin.

Prediction
Gets stopped by Lee and loses to Barker and Murray on points in close fights.

How do you see Billy Joe doing vs Lee?

[johnswan1]

I favour Lee slightly but would not be too surprised if BJS beats him. Lee is fragile, but does BJS have the power? Neither of them seem to have the best stamina. Good fight, Lee has a strong advantage in experience. Reason why I left BJS out of these rankings is because it's too early in his career to know his level and this is his first title shot.

[Boxerbeetle]

I agree that the Chavez Jr fight is a very big negative on Lee's resume - Lee just looked so weak against him.

At his very best, I could imagine Barker out-boxing all the others & beating them all on points, but to be fair I'd say all possible match-ups between these 4 middleweights would pretty much be 50-50. Huge shame we never got to find out.

[slapbangwhallop]

I agree that the Chavez Jr fight is a very big negative on Lee's resume - Lee just looked so weak against him.

At his very best, I could imagine Barker out-boxing all the others & beating them all on points, but to be fair I'd say all possible match-ups between these 4 middleweights would pretty much be 50-50. Huge shame we never got to find out.

Chavez did come into the ring about 15 stone though!

Barker never beat anyone except an exceptionally average Daniel Geale.

[Boxerbeetle]

I agree that the Chavez Jr fight is a very big negative on Lee's resume - Lee just looked so weak against him.

At his very best, I could imagine Barker out-boxing all the others & beating them all on points, but to be fair I'd say all possible match-ups between these 4 middleweights would pretty much be 50-50. Huge shame we never got to find out.

Chavez did come into the ring about 15 stone though!

Barker never beat anyone except an exceptionally average Daniel Geale.

Who have the rest beaten though?

[slapbangwhallop]

I agree that the Chavez Jr fight is a very big negative on Lee's resume - Lee just looked so weak against him.

At his very best, I could imagine Barker out-boxing all the others & beating them all on points, but to be fair I'd say all possible match-ups between these 4 middleweights would pretty much be 50-50. Huge shame we never got to find out.

Chavez did come into the ring about 15 stone though!

Barker never beat anyone except an exceptionally average Daniel Geale.

Who have the rest beaten though?

I was merely replying to your two points. Never rated Barker though, loved a vacant title did Daz, I also thought he'd have been stopped by any of the other three.

[Boxerbeetle]

Chavez did come into the ring about 15 stone though!

Barker never beat anyone except an exceptionally average Daniel Geale.

Who have the rest beaten though?

I was merely replying to your two points. Never rated Barker though, loved a vacant title did Daz, I also thought he'd have been stopped by any of the other three.

Yeah that's fair enough. I can't say I ever rated Barker particularly highly either, although I enjoyed watching him box when he was on form & I think he's the only one who could potentially have out-boxed all of the others (as opposed to out-fighting them). As I say, I think all the match-ups would have been 50-50s.

[danamba7]

Yeah that's fair enough. I can't say I ever rated Barker particularly highly either, although I enjoyed watching him box when he was on form & I think he's the only one who could potentially have out-boxed all of the others (as opposed to out-fighting them). As I say, I think all the match-ups would have been 50-50s.

I enjoyed watching Barker too. Had a nice style. I think he'd have beaten Macklin but for me Murray beats all of them. Murray Lee would've been class at 160.

[slapbangwhallop]

Who have the rest beaten though?

I was merely replying to your two points. Never rated Barker though, loved a vacant title did Daz, I also thought he'd have been stopped by any of the other three.

Yeah that's fair enough. I can't say I ever rated Barker particularly highly either, although I enjoyed watching him box when he was on form & I think he's the only one who could potentially have out-boxed all of the others (as opposed to out-fighting them). As I say, I think all the match-ups would have been 50-50s.

Annoying that we'll never find out. Neither Duddy-Lee-Macklin will ever fight each other and its looking more and more unlikely that any of Macklin-Barker-Murray-Lee will do so either. A real pain.

If Macklin-Barker would have happened on the Mag 7 show in Brum that would have been a cracker.

[expe]

Lee
Macklin
Murray
Barker

[rio]

Murray did not lose to sturm it was a draw

[johnswan1]

Murray did not lose to sturm it was a draw

Correct, will amend now.

[forcefraser]

Regarding Murray, I thought the consensus was that he should have got the nod against Martinez, but was lucky to getthedraw against Sturm.

[lillywhite14]

On their best night I take Murray to beat them all.

[johnswan1]

Murray-Chavez Jr that beat Lee would be a great Middleweight scrap.

[davie]

Yeah that's fair enough. I can't say I ever rated Barker particularly highly either, although I enjoyed watching him box when he was on form & I think he's the only one who could potentially have out-boxed all of the others (as opposed to out-fighting them). As I say, I think all the match-ups would have been 50-50s.

I enjoyed watching Barker too. Had a nice style. I think he'd have beaten Macklin but for me Murray beats all of them. Murray Lee would've been class at 160.

Murray beats them all.
Pretty much sums it ip for me.
Don't think there's a huge gulf between the 4 but Martin looked strongest in fights at the top level, even if he never picked up a strap.

So desperately unlucky not to have a world title. Did it the hard way every time.
Would have loved to see him get a world title shot against Geale, Barker, Korobov, Soliman Quillin, Lee or Chaves Jr.
I think any of them would have been winnable fights for Martin and I look forward to him being back in the mix at SMW. Although the chances wont come for ever, if he doesn't take the next chance that presents itself the clock is ticking.


Of the other 3 it's hard to pick between Barker and Lee.
But Macklin would probably have to settle for 4th

[brian13]

They all beat Barker anyway, Lee in most convincing fashion because he is the best boxer of the lot. Murray beats Barker and gives Lee a serious fight. Macklin & Murray stylistically is a war.

Ranking them would be: 1) Murray, 2) Lee, 3)Macklin 4) Barker. Murray & Lee is too close but Murray gives everyone a torrid night, hence he is number one.

[keirw]

I'd pick Murray to win by UD against the three others.
I'd pick Lee to beat Macklin by decision and KO Barker.
I'd pick Barker to outbox Macklin (provided his hip held up)
Macklin gives all three a good scrap but ultimately loses to all three.

Not that it really matters who I'd back as the fights were never (and probably will neve be) made, sadly.

[TheWigwam]

I thought Sturm beat Murray by a couple of rounds and arguably Macklin did better than Murray against the German.
Despite this my list would be

Murray
Lee (very close 2nd - likely to end up 1st imo)

Barker
Macklin (though the last 2 are very close as well and I'm uncertain)