Rocky Marciano vs Jersey Joe Walcott II in 3-D(1953)

[Brutu]

I remembered reading a book about the history of 3-D in film history
some years ago,that stated that the rematch title fight
Rocky Marciano vs Jersey Joe Walcott May.15.1953 at the Chicago
Stadium was filmed in the(then)new process of 3-D.
here is a link to a publicity photograph taken from
their first fight to promote it.

JET May.15.1953.

http://books.google.com/books?id=skIDAA ... pg=PA55&dq

also
JET March.26.1953
http://books.google.com/books?id=nLsDAA ... pg=PA49&dq

[Brutu]

It sounds like a 3-D film print of the actual fight doesnt or ever existed.
Other then the flat kinescope version.
Link to a newspaper article after the fight May.18.1953

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=rT ... 3163207&dq

[Brutu]

The first (full length)motion picture to start the 3-D craze
was Bwana Devil(released November.30.1952).
It was released thru United Artist which would film Marciano-Walcott II in 3-D.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bwana_Devil

[jaclem2]

..nat fleischer saw the 3d film of the fight. he said it showed that the right hand that floored walcott was much clearer than the regular tv broadcast and film and was a better and more powerful punch than could be seen otherwise. something about the angle. i saw that fight on live tv and i thought walcott had decided to gently retire and take his paycheck and go on with a nice happy life. i have never seen the 3d version, though, so maybe it was a clean knockout punch after all. i do recall that when walcott got up he leaned back on the ring ropes as if he was disoriented but then he got lively and started complaining about a fast count.

whatever...when the bell rang to start that first round walcott didn't look happy to be in there. after all, what could he have done that he didn't do in his brilliant stand in the first fight where he got kayoed by one punch despite the great fight he put up? in that one he went after marciano in the first seconds of the fight. this time he danced away until he decided to sit this one out.

[funso banjo baby]

even 3d wouldnt help find the ko punch

[jaclem2]

...funso....i'm inclined to agree....i'm just reporting what nat fleischer said. a few other boxing writers saw it at the same time but i don't recall their comments, if any...

[Brutu]

Sounds like you guys had seen the live home television
version that aired Friday.May.15.1953 on NBC-TV and radio
(9 pm EST).
The United Artist 3-D filmed version of it premiered in cinemas
across the U.S.A the following Tuesday.

Since Walcott had complained that he had been shoved to the canvas
by Marciano and then given a fast count of 10 by the referee,
the comissioners reviewed
the 3-D version of the fight and then agreed that Walcott was knocked down and out by a left hook followed by a right uppercut to the jaw
by Marciano and was given a full 10 count too.

[Brutu]

Here is a link to the"flat version" of Marciano-Walcott 3D.
You can clearly see Marciano knock out Walcott with a left
hook and a devastating right uppercut to Walcott's mandible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

[Brutu]

For the completist,here is another link to the (longer)live NBC-TV broadcast of Marciano-Walcott II
(notice that the camera is on the other side of the ring,then the United Artists 3D cameras,
and the television viewer in 1953 could not see clearly Marciano's right uppercut.
Check the refs count,was the first swish of his hand that began the ten count
recorded in the tv frame?
Also check out the Rock's own look of disappontment at 12:35.
here is the link to the NBC-TV kinescope recording.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzkEZNEV5iA

[Brutu]

Summer is coming and I always start remembering back to the days of going to the
Great American Drive-In.


Besides I had to have a reason to resurrect this thread again because I noticed that someone has attempted again to "Knock the Rock"
in another thread here at this forum.
I think the punch that Marciano knocked out Walcott with in their first fight shook Walcott down to his DNA and probably aged him about 10 years overnight as a fighter in the process .

[Caractacus]

That was another famous fight with a filmed"Reversed Angle".

[Caractacus]

Here is a link to the"flat version" of Marciano-Walcott 3D.
You can clearly see Marciano knock out Walcott with a left
hook and a devastating right uppercut to Walcott's mandible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

check out the punch at 4:02,
looks like Walcott was hit with a baseball bat almost.

[evrenb]

That was another famous fight with a filmed"Reversed Angle".

I believe there are two main versions - one film and the other the Kinescope 'live' broadcast which was shown in 3D as you have described here.

[Caractacus]

Here is a link to the (longer)live NBC-TV broadcast of Marciano-Walcott II
(notice that the camera is on the other side of the ring,then the United Artists 3D cameras,
and the television viewer in 1953 could not see clearly Marciano's right uppercut.
Check the refs count,was the first swish of his hand that began the ten count
recorded in the tv frame?
Also check out the Rock's own look of disappontment at 12:35.
here is the link to the NBC-TV kinescope recording.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzkEZNEV5iA

[kaiserbill]

Nothing wrong with that punch.
Walcott is clearly disorientated after hitting the canvas early in the count.

Giving him the benefit of the doubt, if anything, he may have mistimed getting up.
But then, it's never a clever idea to try get up at 9 and a half.

One thing that is rarely spoken about with Rocky, and is on display here, is his ability to rapidly follow his opponent at close quarters when they are weaving, and change direction extremely rapidly and in an impressively quick and small space....and deliver fast quality heavy punches when doing so.
He caught quite a few fighters out with it.
Generates great leverage very quickly in small spaces, even when changing direction.

I suspect his low centre of gravity, stockiness, and short arms really helped in this regard.

It's quite impressive actually, when you watch his fights.

[Cap]

Walcott quit. Simple. He collects a quarter million and walks away without any damage. He hadn't even really trained hard because he knew he'd given his best the first time. Ol' Jersey Joe fought an unbelievable 8 times with the heavyweight title on the line! You'd think he was the only heavyweight around in those days! Well connected and knew which way the wind blew.

[Caractacus]

The Two known filmed versions of Rocky Marciano vrs Jersey Joe Walcott II

Here is the kinescope of the fight as aired live on NBC-TV May.15.1953

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzkEZNEV5iA

Here is the fight as filmed with 3D cameras by Allied Artist for showing in the cinemas.
(and again check out the sledgehammer right cross/uppercut that Marciano lands on Walcott at about 4:02 of the clip,
it looks to have been almost as devastating a punch as the one he knocked him out for the title)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

[BoxBuzz]

The Two known filmed versions of Rocky Marciano vrs Jersey Joe Walcott II

Here is the kinescope of the fight as aired live on NBC-TV May.15.1953

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzkEZNEV5iA

Here is the fight as filmed with 3D cameras by Allied Artist for showing in the cinemas.
(and again check out the sledgehammer right cross/uppercut that Marciano lands on Walcott at about 4:02 of the clip,
it looks to have been almost as devastating a punch as the one he knocked him out for the title)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

I do believe I heard the guy say "Rocky by a knockdown...uh I mean Rocky by a knock out.

[Ambling Alp II]

Walcott quit. Simple. He collects a quarter million and walks away without any damage. He hadn't even really trained hard because he knew he'd given his best the first time. Ol' Jersey Joe fought an unbelievable 8 times with the heavyweight title on the line! You'd think he was the only heavyweight around in those days! Well connected and knew which way the wind blew.

To me it's really a question whether he quit or was throwing the fight.

There are some suspicious things going on that each by themselves might not mean a lot, but add them to together and it looks very questionable.

1. Walcott is not throwing punches. He is constantly clinching. That is not like him.
2. He goes down and like people have pointed out, he looks like he could have got up.
3. After he gets up, he walks around for a while. Then suddenly, as if he just remembered he is supposed to be mad the referee, he starts complaining about the count.

It just does not look right.

[Cap]

Walcott quit. Simple. He collects a quarter million and walks away without any damage. He hadn't even really trained hard because he knew he'd given his best the first time. Ol' Jersey Joe fought an unbelievable 8 times with the heavyweight title on the line! You'd think he was the only heavyweight around in those days! Well connected and knew which way the wind blew.

To me it's really a question whether he quit or was throwing the fight.

There are some suspicious things going on that each by themselves might not mean a lot, but add them to together and it looks very questionable.

1. Walcott is not throwing punches. He is constantly clinching. That is not like him.
2. He goes down and like people have pointed out, he looks like he could have got up.
3. After he gets up, he walks around for a while. Then suddenly, as if he just remembered he is supposed to be mad the referee, he starts complaining about the count.

It just does not look right.

Totally agree. Terrible acting job by Walcott. Most probably he made this decision on his own. Why take a beating again when all he has to do is fall down and take ten?

[Caractacus]

Are you guys serious or just playing the Devil's advocate here?
Jersey Joe Walcott throw a major heavyweight title fight in front of a live nationwide television audience(NBC-TV) and also in front of a specially rigged friggen 3D camera for cinema viewing on the Big Screen at ringside?
Are you questioning Jersey Joe Walcott's integrity not just as a fighter but also as a man?
Be real.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

[Ambling Alp II]

I'm dead serious. Doesn't matter if the fight was televised or not.
Why wasn't Walcott throwing punches?
There were at least 9 clinches in the first round. There were hardly any clinches in the first fight.
He looked like he could have got up.

It doesn't look right.

[Caractacus]

IYOP Which other fights in his career do you think Jersey Joe Walcott may have thrown? LOL

BTW no one is ever quite the same after they had fought The Rock,
No One!

PS
As far as the cliching.That was probably a tatic that Walcott's team worked on to try and smother the punching power of Marciano,
a technique frequently used by Jack Johnson.
Also Walcott's ribs and belly were probably still smarting from their first fight.
Also Marciano came in this fight more aggressive then the first fight,something the Walcott team may have not expected.
and the reason he didnt get up so fast was maybe because his head was still ringing!
Use some logic man.

[Ambling Alp II]

Your not a Marciano fan by any chance?

I don't know of any other fights that he may have thrown. So what?
"BTW no one is ever quite the same after they had fought The Rock,
No One!"

The tactic to beat Marciano was to not throw punches?
Walcott's ribs and were still smarting from their previous fight? Eight months prior?
Oh his head was still ringing? I see, that's what happened.

[Caractacus]

Thanks for the lead.
and finally here is the actual compleat 3-D print of Allied Artist film of Marciano vrs Walcott II.
(but your probably going to need some 3-D glasses from the cinema to fully appreciate it).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9js8el0OxI