ClivePatrickLyons wrote:Louis would have stopped Marciano in a fight that would have had the crowd on their feet for most of the early round's by round 10 The Brown Bomber would have taken control of the fight and starts to bust the Rock up the ref steps in to stop the carnage widway through round 14
ClivePatrickLyons wrote:Louis would have stopped Marciano in a fight that would have had the crowd on their feet for most of the early round's by round 10 The Brown Bomber would have taken control of the fight and starts to bust the Rock up the ref steps in to stop the carnage widway through round 14
"The Way It Was" with Louis and Walcott talking about their first and second fight.
I think if one compares the fights with Louis, and the Marciano fight (first one) one can see that Walcott certainly gotten better. The argument that he was older doesnt necessarily apply, because Louis was old when Walcott fought him--- and yet Walcott looked supernatural against a prime Marciano, and Walcott lost to Louis in that rematch.
What's interesting in this show... Is that Walcott said that the referee in the second fight was working against him, and the moment Walcott was kayoed he was turning to yell at the referee... Louis apologized for hitting Walcott. And Walcott was also asked who hit harder between Louis and Marciano, and he said that Marciano had a harder punch.
The Brown Bomber in his prime made 25 defence's The Rock made 6 defence's and in those 6 he never faced any-one like a prime Louis
Joe would stop The Rock between round's 12 to 15 no doubt
The sheer amount of title defenses doesn't by itself mean very much.
Pretty sure that Marciano would have gotton past Johnny Paychek and Jack Roper.
True, Marciano never fought anyone as good as a prime Louis.
Also true that Louis never beat anyone as good as a prime Marciano.
Having said all this, I rate Louis higher and think he would have won head to head prime for prime.
Louis was more impressive before he won the title.
The fight that they did have when Louis was way past it shows a gleam of what would have happened.
That Louis did as well as he did at that stage of career makes one think in his prime he wins this.
Ambling Alp II wrote:The sheer amount of title defenses doesn't by itself mean very much.
Pretty sure that Marciano would have gotton past Johnny Paychek and Jack Roper.
True, Marciano never fought anyone as good as a prime Louis.
Also true that Louis never beat anyone as good as a prime Marciano.
Having said all this, I rate Louis higher and think he would have won head to head prime for prime.
Louis was more impressive before he won the title.
The fight that they did have when Louis was way past it shows a gleam of what would have happened.
That Louis did as well as he did at that stage of career makes one think in his prime he wins this.
The one argument, I could make (because I agree with most that you have said) is that the Marciano who fought Louis was more of a buller than the bobbing and weaving man he would become by his retirement. Watch Marciano's fights with Charles and Moore, and compare it to the films of Marciano against Louis and Savold. Marciano just bulled his way in, and the slipping/bobbing/weaving was not really utilized as he would in later bouts. I think the Marciano near retirement's end was more devestating and effective than the version Louis fought. So when one says "prime" Marciano, I am thinking post Louis.
Joe battered marcianos face and with nothing but a jab when he was totally shot to pieces can you imagine what he would have done to him if he still had his speed, combinations, and right hand? He would have carved marciano up.
Caractacus wrote:Check this fight out.
This was Joe Louis's 9th title defense(February 1940)
Now just imagine if this particular boxer(who had a somewhat similar boxing style) had actually been Rocky Marciano
for comparative purposes.
That is like saying that if La Starza had Louis' power he would have beat Marciano.
Godoy lacked the punch that Marciano had. However, Godoy was harder to hit than Marciano. They really are not that similar. (Worth mentioning that Louis had less trouble with Godoy the 2nd time around anyway.)
A better example to look is the fight they really had. Marciano was much closer to his prime than Louis was. Yet Louis still more punches than he should have at that late stage in his career. He was much slower and didn't throw the volume of punches that he did earlier in his career. He was more competitive than he should have been.
This makes me conclude that that Louis probably would have won. Would Marciano have an outside chance? Sure. More often than not Louis would win this.
Caractacus wrote:You know,One usually hears from the dissers about Marciano just fighting "Old Men"
but which future Hall of famers excatly did Joe Louis (in his prime)defend the title against from
about 1937 to 1941?
Billy Conn? and who else?
Ambling Alp II wrote:The sheer amount of title defenses doesn't by itself mean very much.
Pretty sure that Marciano would have gotton past Johnny Paychek and Jack Roper.
True, Marciano never fought anyone as good as a prime Louis.
Also true that Louis never beat anyone as good as a prime Marciano.
Having said all this, I rate Louis higher and think he would have won head to head prime for prime.
Louis was more impressive before he won the title.
The fight that they did have when Louis was way past it shows a gleam of what would have happened.
That Louis did as well as he did at that stage of career makes one think in his prime he wins this.
Mate the moral of the story...............NEVER FACED ANY-ONE AS GOOD AS JOE.........PERIOD
Interesting enough Arturo Godoy's trainer for the Louis vrs Godoy match in 1940 was Charlie Goldman,
who had taught Godoy the crouch and weave fighting method earlier.
At some point Godoy's and Marciano professional boxing careers overlapped in the late 1940's,
at the gym Charlie Goldman was training them at,but im not sure if the two ever actually sparred together.
Caractacus wrote:Interesting enough Arturo Godoy's trainer for the Louis vrs Godoy match in 1940 was Charlie Goldman,
who had taught Godoy the crouch and weave fighting method earlier.
At some point Godoy's and Marciano professional boxing careers overlapped in the late 1940's,
at the gym Charlie Goldman was training them at,but im not sure if the two ever actually sparred together.
Ambling Alp II wrote:That is like saying that if La Starza had Louis' power he would have beat Marciano.
Godoy lacked the punch that Marciano had. However, Godoy was harder to hit than Marciano. They really are not that similar. (Worth mentioning that Louis had less trouble with Godoy the 2nd time around anyway.)
A better example to look is the fight they really had. Marciano was much closer to his prime than Louis was. Yet Louis still more punches than he should have at that late stage in his career. He was much slower and didn't throw the volume of punches that he did earlier in his career. He was more competitive than he should have been.
This makes me conclude that that Louis probably would have won. Would Marciano have an outside chance? Sure. More often than not Louis would win this.
