Jesse Vargas on PEDS?

[Fightdoctor]

I've been following the career of Jessie Vargas for a while now. He started off at welterweight, went down to junior welter and now is back at welter. I've always viewed him as a smart, skilled technical boxer. Yet he was always lacking when it came to strength, punching power and physicality. In fact I believed that was why he moved down to 140 lbs - so as not to have such a disadvantage against smaller, less physical foes. The Jesse Vargas that I saw at the weigh-in was a different person. Physically transformed. Muscular, broad and very strong-looking. Then came the fight. Jesse displayed power that I had never seen before. I have no proof other than the eye test. But I do believe he is juicing. Do you think Jesse vargas is or has been using PEDS?

[crusader]

Vargas may well be juicing, but he hurt several guys he fought at 140 and 147 over the last few years.

With him it's been more of an issue of not finishing things--e.g. having Omotoso all over the place in the 6th, not putting him away, then coasting for much of the bout's remainder. I haven't taken note of his physique, so I can't say much about that.

[Badhusker]

I am all for the very strictest penalties for juicing, but just because someone has improved their physique or power, etc, does NOT mean automatically they are juicing. Starting this kind of crap is how lawsuits happen. We all have the right of free speech, but in my opinion stupid to accuse someone without any proof whatsoever. Its not like he flat out refused any random testing. If he did, then the accusation is warranted. The same crap started with JMM before he fought Pac the last time. He said he would take any and all tests that Pac would, and the testing demand was dropped, but not the pointless accusations.

[Wales]

Controversial post of the day

Not saying Vargas is but so many are doing it there comes a point where u think "fornicate it, level the playing field and let everyone do it"

Come fight night canelo will be, what, 185 and khan lucky to edge over 160.

Like the olympics, have a normal one and a steroid one. See someone do 100m in 7 seconds

[SFW]

I would say, with multiple people bragging about being able to create undetectable enhancers like Memo Heredia (not coincidentally Marquez employee and associate) that it is absolutely insane to cling to such an archaic idea that if there's no proof (yet) a fighter must be clean....... No lol. I don't know about Vargas, but he doesn't raise near as many red flags as JMM did/does.

[Wales]

Not sure about arnarchic when off top of my head following recent top fighters been caught, so anyone could be...

Vitali Klit
Roy Jones Jnr
James Toney
Evander Holyfield
Mosley
Vargas
Mayorga
Botha

[diddy]

Of course he's on something. They all are. If there isn't random blood testing for a fight you can rest assured the 2 guys heading into the ring are on something of some shape or form.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Of course he's on something. They all are. If there isn't random blood testing for a fight you can rest assured the 2 guys heading into the ring are on something of some shape or form.

It amazes me people think any athletes are clean. An entire sport of guys throwing, hitting and catching a ball was overrun with peds but it imagined to skip past dudes that fist fight for a living?

[diddy]

People are not bright. Christ they still pay for PPVs when it's readily free online.

[Badhusker]

I am one of the few I guess that have at least some faith that many athletes are not taking performance enhancing drugs. The need for stringent testing is getting to be more and more important. I am also not naive enough to believe it doesn't go on. To say that all athletes are dirty and cheaters is a naive statement. I would call it downright stupid to be honest.

[Undefeated49-0]

People are not bright. Christ they still pay for PPVs when it's readily free online.

Share the 411/your link(s).

[caldo2025]

I don't blame the OP for the unfounded PED accusation as we are all living through the Steroid Era. But I don't think there's any kind of "smoking gun" surrounding Vargas. To me a smoking gun is something like Floyd with an illegal IV hanging out of his arm and an athlete improving at age 40.

With Vargas, we have been hearing about his talent for years but he's not performed well enough under the big lights to pull in the type of money that promoters & networks expected out of him. He was criticized for not attacking and being happy with just slipping by these fight on the cards and winning some questionable outcomes. Something clicked in that last round against Timothy Bradley and i think we'll look back and call it the most important moment in Vargas's GREAT, yes i said it, GREAT career. He went on the attack and hurt TB as badly as we've seen him hurt. That pace he had in that 12th round was the exact pace he started the Ali fight with and didn't let up until Ali was out of there.

All of the greats say it and i believe it to be especially true with Jesse Vargas, "You learn more through a loss than you do a win". Not Steroids, but a 26 year old kid blooming in front of eyes through trial and error. That's all that i see.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I am one of the few I guess that have at least some faith that many athletes are not taking performance enhancing drugs. The need for stringent testing is getting to be more and more important. I am also not naive enough to believe it doesn't go on. To say that all athletes are dirty and cheaters is a naive statement. I would call it downright stupid to be honest.

They're not all dirty, but nobody can be ruled out. There were a ton of guys juicing at my HS in the mid 80's. Boxing probably has the worst testing in sports. The ufc might have the best.

[Gambler]

Just throwing this out there: there was no drug testing in the Ali v Vargas fight.

Look up a pre-fight interview with Sadam Ali on Youtube titled: 'SADAM ALI talks VARGAS Bonus Title Shot, CHEESECAKE & Jay-Z'. Ali expressed concerns about wanting drug testing but the Vargas Camp declined.

[scallum2015]

Controversial post of the day

Not saying Vargas is but so many are doing it there comes a point where u think "eff it, level the playing field and let everyone do it"

Come fight night canelo will be, what, 185 and khan lucky to edge over 160.

Like the olympics, have a normal one and a steroid one. See someone do 100m in 7 seconds

The true Studs will not need steroids. Steroids are for those who are not confident in Thier skills imo

[Larrylefthook]

I don't blame the OP for the unfounded PED accusation as we are all living through the Steroid Era. But I don't think there's any kind of "smoking gun" surrounding Vargas. To me a smoking gun is something like Floyd with an illegal IV hanging out of his arm and an athlete improving at age 40.

With Vargas, we have been hearing about his talent for years but he's not performed well enough under the big lights to pull in the type of money that promoters & networks expected out of him. He was criticized for not attacking and being happy with just slipping by these fight on the cards and winning some questionable outcomes. Something clicked in that last round against Timothy Bradley and i think we'll look back and call it the most important moment in Vargas's GREAT, yes i said it, GREAT career. He went on the attack and hurt TB as badly as we've seen him hurt. That pace he had in that 12th round was the exact pace he started the Ali fight with and didn't let up until Ali was out of there.

All of the greats say it and i believe it to be especially true with Jesse Vargas, "You learn more through a loss than you do a win". Not Steroids, but a 26 year old kid blooming in front of eyes through trial and error. That's all that i see.

Hold on, you think Vargas will end up an ATG? Or modern great?

[caldo2025]

I don't blame the OP for the unfounded PED accusation as we are all living through the Steroid Era. But I don't think there's any kind of "smoking gun" surrounding Vargas. To me a smoking gun is something like Floyd with an illegal IV hanging out of his arm and an athlete improving at age 40.

With Vargas, we have been hearing about his talent for years but he's not performed well enough under the big lights to pull in the type of money that promoters & networks expected out of him. He was criticized for not attacking and being happy with just slipping by these fight on the cards and winning some questionable outcomes. Something clicked in that last round against Timothy Bradley and i think we'll look back and call it the most important moment in Vargas's GREAT, yes i said it, GREAT career. He went on the attack and hurt TB as badly as we've seen him hurt. That pace he had in that 12th round was the exact pace he started the Ali fight with and didn't let up until Ali was out of there.

All of the greats say it and i believe it to be especially true with Jesse Vargas, "You learn more through a loss than you do a win". Not Steroids, but a 26 year old kid blooming in front of eyes through trial and error. That's all that i see.

Hold on, you think Vargas will end up an ATG? Or modern great?

Vargas will end up with several world titles before he's done and to me, that's a "great career". Is he going to be an ATG boxer? Unlikely. He's a good looking 26 year old kid, speaks in perfect Spanish and English who has roots in Mexico and USA. That's a promoters wet dream. He's got the attention of a lot or people right now.

[Larrylefthook]

I don't blame the OP for the unfounded PED accusation as we are all living through the Steroid Era. But I don't think there's any kind of "smoking gun" surrounding Vargas. To me a smoking gun is something like Floyd with an illegal IV hanging out of his arm and an athlete improving at age 40.

With Vargas, we have been hearing about his talent for years but he's not performed well enough under the big lights to pull in the type of money that promoters & networks expected out of him. He was criticized for not attacking and being happy with just slipping by these fight on the cards and winning some questionable outcomes. Something clicked in that last round against Timothy Bradley and i think we'll look back and call it the most important moment in Vargas's GREAT, yes i said it, GREAT career. He went on the attack and hurt TB as badly as we've seen him hurt. That pace he had in that 12th round was the exact pace he started the Ali fight with and didn't let up until Ali was out of there.

All of the greats say it and i believe it to be especially true with Jesse Vargas, "You learn more through a loss than you do a win". Not Steroids, but a 26 year old kid blooming in front of eyes through trial and error. That's all that i see.

Hold on, you think Vargas will end up an ATG? Or modern great?

Vargas will end up with several world titles before he's done and to me, that's a "great career". Is he going to be an ATG boxer? Unlikely. He's a good looking 26 year old kid, speaks in perfect Spanish and English who has roots in Mexico and USA. That's a promoters wet dream. He's got the attention of a lot or people right now.

Who of the top guys at WW would you have him as favourite to beat? I think he'd struggle to make my top 10 at WW.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I don't blame the OP for the unfounded PED accusation as we are all living through the Steroid Era. But I don't think there's any kind of "smoking gun" surrounding Vargas. To me a smoking gun is something like Floyd with an illegal IV hanging out of his arm and an athlete improving at age 40.

With Vargas, we have been hearing about his talent for years but he's not performed well enough under the big lights to pull in the type of money that promoters & networks expected out of him. He was criticized for not attacking and being happy with just slipping by these fight on the cards and winning some questionable outcomes. Something clicked in that last round against Timothy Bradley and i think we'll look back and call it the most important moment in Vargas's GREAT, yes i said it, GREAT career. He went on the attack and hurt TB as badly as we've seen him hurt. That pace he had in that 12th round was the exact pace he started the Ali fight with and didn't let up until Ali was out of there.

All of the greats say it and i believe it to be especially true with Jesse Vargas, "You learn more through a loss than you do a win". Not Steroids, but a 26 year old kid blooming in front of eyes through trial and error. That's all that i see.

Hold on, you think Vargas will end up an ATG? Or modern great?

Vargas will end up with several world titles before he's done and to me, that's a "great career". Is he going to be an ATG boxer? Unlikely. He's a good looking 26 year old kid, speaks in perfect Spanish and English who has roots in Mexico and USA. That's a promoters wet dream. He's got the attention of a lot or people right now.

He doesn't have the attention of the fans.

[Wales]

Controversial post of the day

Not saying Vargas is but so many are doing it there comes a point where u think "eff it, level the playing field and let everyone do it"

Come fight night canelo will be, what, 185 and khan lucky to edge over 160.

Like the olympics, have a normal one and a steroid one. See someone do 100m in 7 seconds

Steroids are for those who are not confident in Thier skills imo

Think Roy Jones jnr was pretty confident in his skills, as were others i listed.

[caldo2025]

Hold on, you think Vargas will end up an ATG? Or modern great?

Vargas will end up with several world titles before he's done and to me, that's a "great career". Is he going to be an ATG boxer? Unlikely. He's a good looking 26 year old kid, speaks in perfect Spanish and English who has roots in Mexico and USA. That's a promoters wet dream. He's got the attention of a lot or people right now.

Who of the top guys at WW would you have him as favourite to beat? I think he'd struggle to make my top 10 at WW.

I'm seeing that newer rankings have him coming in at #8 ranked WW on average and I think that where he deserves to be right now. He's only 26 years old and going to keep improving until he reaches his prime so he's a full night for any WW right now. In the future, he'll beat some people that will surprise you.

[Larrylefthook]

Vargas will end up with several world titles before he's done and to me, that's a "great career". Is he going to be an ATG boxer? Unlikely. He's a good looking 26 year old kid, speaks in perfect Spanish and English who has roots in Mexico and USA. That's a promoters wet dream. He's got the attention of a lot or people right now.

Who of the top guys at WW would you have him as favourite to beat? I think he'd struggle to make my top 10 at WW.

I'm seeing that newer rankings have him coming in at #8 ranked WW on average and I think that where he deserves to be right now. He's only 26 years old and going to keep improving until he reaches his prime so he's a full night for any WW right now. In the future, he'll beat some people that will surprise you.

I think 8th is about as high as he can be ranked and don't think he will ever be an elite WW, he's gonna be 27 in less then 2 months and there are too many guys around the same age as him (Thurman 27, Garcia almost 28, Crawford 28, Porter 28 and Spence 26) there's 5 guys who are in his age range I don't think he will ever be good enough to beat.

[claudevsq]

Mentioning Danny García, what about Mikey García? He would for sure be one of the best... Can't wait for his comeback, although it might be at light welterweight...

[palooka]

Of course he's on something. They all are. If there isn't random blood testing for a fight you can rest assured the 2 guys heading into the ring are on something of some shape or form.

Unfortunately I think you're right, diddy.

[caldo2025]

Who of the top guys at WW would you have him as favourite to beat? I think he'd struggle to make my top 10 at WW.

I'm seeing that newer rankings have him coming in at #8 ranked WW on average and I think that where he deserves to be right now. He's only 26 years old and going to keep improving until he reaches his prime so he's a full night for any WW right now. In the future, he'll beat some people that will surprise you.

I think 8th is about as high as he can be ranked and don't think he will ever be an elite WW, he's gonna be 27 in less then 2 months and there are too many guys around the same age as him (Thurman 27, Garcia almost 28, Crawford 28, Porter 28 and Spence 26) there's 5 guys who are in his age range I don't think he will ever be good enough to beat.

I'm in the minority with my opinion on Vargas for sure. I've been watching his fights for several years and his style prior to the Bradley fight was painfully dull and timid. He would show these flashes of brilliance but then go out of his way to avoid exchanges. He would do just enough to survive. Not sure if he was timid because he was scared or maybe he just didn't believe in himself. But in that last round with Bradley it was like a light went on. He finally let it all hang out and he's never done that in the fights I've seen him in. He floored TB and hurt him badly.

Against Ali, Vargas let it all hang out from the opening bell this time and I couldn't believe how he kept that pace for 9 rounds. Knocking out Ali through an accumulation of blows and ridiculous pressure was remarkable. It wasn't a flash ko or luck. If Vargas brings the same sort of fight to any of those names you mention, I really do think Vargas would be very much alive in those fights.