Perseus wrote:Do you guys really believe Browne is the first person to have some negative tests then have one pop positive?
This is not new territory.
Pre fight drug test, post fight drug test and sometimes they even have random drug tests(and sometimes they have no tests at all but that was not what happened here).
How often are multiple failed tests reported?
I can only think of one: Erik Morales
They just don't get caught every time, if they did there would be no drug problems in professional sports.
The drug tests can be beat but if they are indeed doing something wrong AND they get tested often enough they may eventually fail one.....................just one................and one is all it takes to get in trouble.
Browne came in at the lowest weight of his career with his physique chiseled like never before then fails a drug test.
The sudden change in body shape is consistent with what Clenbuterol will do for you.
Saying they didn't know and claiming they were set up by the boogey man is also consistent with failed drug tests.
Browne was less than 5 pounds lighter than his fight before several months ago. Does Clenbuterol give you a chiseled physique too?
The red flag is the venue and people there. If he tests clean in a random test 5 days before with blood and urine, and dirty (urine only) after the contest, I would guess yes, it was a dirty sample, but not his doing. Blood testing that close to the fight is not normal in itself.
Badhusker wrote:
The red flag is the venue and people there. If he tests clean in a random test 5 days before with blood and urine, and dirty (urine only) after the contest, I would guess yes, it was a dirty sample, but not his doing. Blood testing that close to the fight is not normal in itself.
...and he did. I just posted a copy of the NEGATIVE report from the first test a few minutes ago. There was actually about 7 days between tests. The first, see the report, was February 29th and the second March 6th
My gut feeling is he is innocent. If I am wrong Lucas Browne must be incredibly stupid.
If he was clean a few days before the fight (Proven), why would take that drug so close to the fight, he knows he will get caught, he knows if he wins it will be a No Contest so he will be stripped and so make no money from a defence which is the whole purpose of his career so far. He is not young so it will be hard to rebuild.
I don't know why a heavyweight would want to use that drug. The plus about being a heavyweight is that you don't need to crush down to make a weight and you box at a natural weight, although in training camp it is reasonable to lose 10-20 lbs just with the training.
That negative test goes a long way toward confirming that Browne was indeed masking something but after enough tests they got him.
Hardly anything unique there.
Keep on testing them, it's pretty much the only chance of catching the ones that know what they are doing.
Go ahead and keep thinking athletes get caught every time they get drug tested though.
Just because he passed one test doesn't mean he was clean. Guys who are cheating pass tests all the time because they cycled properly or they're either not tested enough or the masking agents did their job. It's not as easy to get caught as you think. The masking agents these guys use can be very effective. Especially if they are being advised properly on how and when to take them. VADA has some really advanced testing protocols. They are expensive to use. Which is a big reason they aren't used often. Expensive and effective.
Perseus wrote:That negative test goes a long way toward confirming that Browne was indeed masking something but after enough tests they got him.
Hardly anything unique there.
Keep on testing them, it's pretty much the only chance of catching the ones that know what they are doing.
Go ahead and keep thinking athletes get caught every time they get drug tested though.
Exactly. It's like the people who shoplift. They are very rarely actually caught but when they are "it was my first time".
Lennox wrote:My gut feeling is he is innocent. If I am wrong Lucas Browne must be incredibly stupid.
....
..we all know that those athletes who get caught as opposed to those who dope and don't get caught are not the smartest, in fact they ARE incredibly stupid...
diddy wrote:Just because he passed one test doesn't mean he was clean. Guys who are cheating pass tests all the time because they cycled properly or they're either not tested enough or the masking agents did their job. It's not as easy to get caught as you think. The masking agents these guys use can be very effective. Especially if they are being advised properly on how and when to take them. VADA has some really advanced testing protocols. They are expensive to use. Which is a big reason they aren't used often. Expensive and effective.
This is all very accurate and logical.
But if we're using logic we still come around to the fact that clen would be a horrible drug to have taken that close to the fight. Any "advisor" worth their salt within that industry would have cut that at least two weeks before the fight.
..I think we are creating here a loophole for potential dopers ..allowing anyone to dope and instead of proving their innocence we let them come up with all these fascinating stories and actually buying them...setting a dangerous precedent which opens a pandora box for a lot of possible excuses/misuses ANYWHERE in the world..
I never truly noticed Lucas Browne until the recent...I mean..no way could I spell his name (first or last). But, what I would like to know is WHERE WOULD THIS GUY be rated about now? Never mind the controversy, he going- to get OUT of it one way ("time served") OR ANOTHER ("Grace").
ImranSarwar wrote:I never truly noticed Lucas Browne until the recent...I mean..no way could I spell his name (first or last). But, what I would like to know is WHERE WOULD THIS GUY be rated about now? Never mind the controversy, he going- to get OUT of it one way ("time served") OR ANOTHER ("Grace").
isnt it strange that he is the 2nd Boxer to test positive after facing Chagalev in his backyard. Ques Frendo allegedly.
In my opinion the Russians spiked Big Daddy.
ImranSarwar wrote:I never truly noticed Lucas Browne until the recent...I mean..no way could I spell his name (first or last). But, what I would like to know is WHERE WOULD THIS GUY be rated about now? Never mind the controversy, he going- to get OUT of it one way ("time served") OR ANOTHER ("Grace").
ImranSarwar wrote:I never truly noticed Lucas Browne until the recent...I mean..no way could I spell his name (first or last). But, what I would like to know is WHERE WOULD THIS GUY be rated about now? Never mind the controversy, he going- to get OUT of it one way ("time served") OR ANOTHER ("Grace").
Why would he take a fat burner 6 days before the fight? It doesn't make any logical sense. David Haye and Tyson Fury drank and ate their own food when in Germany to fight Wlad. They didn't take any chances.
Why didn't Browne take advice? People even mentioned about it weeks before the fight took place. I think he was given it without knowing.
gilgamesh wrote:So has this become a No Contest or what?
No. A month after the fight it is still listed as a win to Browne and no word of any suspension either.
Boxing commissions never seem to be in a hurry to hand out suspensions or hear appeals.
Don't forget VADA has no actual authority in this situation, any punishment comes from the commission.
Is it possible that they may ignore VADA?
Did the commission drug test the boxers? If so maybe they will only act on this if Browne has also failed the commission drug test?
Browne just passed a lie detector test, and I believe him too. The scene in Chechnya that night was surreal with the president of the country in his purple couch and in Chagaev's corner, flanked by the military and Putin's Russian Night Wolves motorcycle gang leader "The Surgeon". Why not just forget about the whole drug testing thing, especially now that it is being politicized. I think that many of these drugs should just be legalized. There is a very blurry line between what performance enhancing drugs and vitamins, minerals, plants, etc. are legal what is illegal. Also it can be a game of who has the more knowledgeable medical advisers and knows how to hide their usage better. Strictly enforce it amongst amateur athletes especially kids but let the pros do what they want with their bodies because they will anyway, the well off ones with the best doctors and tricksters that money can buy, and the poor ones with back alley sawbone shysters.
x2x wrote:Browne just passed a lie detector test, and I believe him too. The scene in Chechnya that night was surreal with the president of the country in his purple couch and in Chagaev's corner, flanked by the military and Putin's Russian Night Wolves motorcycle gang leader "The Surgeon". Why not just forget about the whole drug testing thing, especially now that it is being politicized. I think that many of these drugs should just be legalized. There is a very blurry line between what performance enhancing drugs and vitamins, minerals, plants, etc. are legal what is illegal. Also it can be a game of who has the more knowledgeable medical advisers and knows how to hide their usage better. Strictly enforce it amongst amateur athletes especially kids but let the pros do what they want with their bodies because they will anyway, the well off ones with the best doctors and tricksters that money can buy, and the poor ones with back alley sawbone shysters.
I believe Browne too, but simply because the drug he popped for would be so stupid to take that close to a fight that it HAS to be a hoax. Lie detector tests are easy to beat.
And I fully agree on the legalization of PED's. They're only banned for political reasons anyway.
punchoutsb wrote:
I believe Browne too, but simply because the drug he popped for would be so stupid to take that close to a fight that it HAS to be a hoax. Lie detector tests are easy to beat.
Easy to beat, or fail too if you're nervous. I once attended a presentation by a man who ran a police lie detector company. He sounded like a raving maniac. If I repeated some of the things he said you would think I'm making it up. But yes Browne's drug rap doesn't make a lot of sense.
And I fully agree on the legalization of PED's. They're only banned for political reasons anyway.
Browne said that only he and Brian Minto were fed the steaks in Grozny and he suspects that drugs may have been put in the steak. Minto lost his fight but was he also given a drug test?
