Most Skillfull Fighter Of Alltime ?

[evrenb]

Not in the league of the aforementioned greats but I always found stevie Johnston very skillful.

In the same vein, I always enjoyed watching Harold Brazier - he was in a lower league than the greats but was clever and skilled.

I was always a fan of Brazier too..I enjoyed his match with Kevin Pompey which I think I have on film somewhere...and calvin grove..good fighter..

[Idisagree]

Prime Camacho was very skillful. Speed, footwork, some pop, defense, ring generalship. He was the complete package at one point. Too bad his life style prevented him from really doing more.

I see someone keeps mentioning Eusebio Pedroza? He was good but he would not be at the top of any list when it comes to skillful. He was just just dirty as hell and he was crafty but skillful? Not saying he didn't have skills but he shouldn't be mentioned among the greatest most skillful. Hell, skill for skill I would say even prime Ivan Calderon had more skills that Pedroza.

Others to me where Duran, Whitaker, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hagler, Hearns, Burley, Pep, Charles, Lopez, Benitez, Floyd, Benny Leonard, Ross, and the many others.

[elmersalsa]

Prime Camacho was very skillful. Speed, footwork, some pop, defense, ring generalship. He was the complete package at one point. Too bad his life style prevented him from really doing more.

I see someone keeps mentioning Eusebio Pedroza? He was good but he would not be at the top of any list when it comes to skillful. He was just just dirty as hell and he was crafty but skillful? Not saying he didn't have skills but he shouldn't be mentioned among the greatest most skillful. Hell, skill for skill I would say even prime Ivan Calderon had more skills that Pedroza.

Others to me where Duran, Whitaker, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hagler, Hearns, Burley, Pep, Charles, Lopez, Benitez, Floyd, Benny Leonard, Ross, and the many others.

The great Eusebio Pedroza was more complete than the great Sugar Ray Robinson.

One of the most complete boxers of my lifetime

[Idisagree]

Prime Camacho was very skillful. Speed, footwork, some pop, defense, ring generalship. He was the complete package at one point. Too bad his life style prevented him from really doing more.

I see someone keeps mentioning Eusebio Pedroza? He was good but he would not be at the top of any list when it comes to skillful. He was just just dirty as hell and he was crafty but skillful? Not saying he didn't have skills but he shouldn't be mentioned among the greatest most skillful. Hell, skill for skill I would say even prime Ivan Calderon had more skills that Pedroza.

Others to me where Duran, Whitaker, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hagler, Hearns, Burley, Pep, Charles, Lopez, Benitez, Floyd, Benny Leonard, Ross, and the many others.

The great Eusebio Pedroza was more complete than the great Sugar Ray Robinson.

One of the most complete boxers of my lifetime

But you comment made me Good one.

[forestbox]

Floyd Mayweather could make a good fighter look average.

[King Carlos]

Hell, skill for skill I would say even prime Ivan Calderon had more skills that Pedroza.

[BoxBuzz]

Maxie Rosenbloom....and yes....another one who can not be seen on any film.....Harry Greb.

[elmersalsa]

Anybody that doesn't believe that the great Eusebio Pedroza was not a skillful complete boxer needs an eye surgery, plus glasses. Or just simply, a complete true slate.

[Syntax Error]

SRL comes first to mind. he had such an arsenal of
tactics to choose from. this rare talent of moving
like a dancer while having real pep in his punch. i
do not like how he mocked other great fighters, but
the skills were all his. he makes boxing look so terribly
easy. you see a leonard fight you want to try it yourself.

This is spot on.

Peak SRL had no weaknesses & could do everything.

It's a shame his career was so truncated because we missed a lot of prime Leonard, as he would have engaged in some truly mega contests in 1983, '84, '85 & '86 had he stayed active & not taken to cocaine.

[elmersalsa]

SRL comes first to mind. he had such an arsenal of
tactics to choose from. this rare talent of moving
like a dancer while having real pep in his punch. i
do not like how he mocked other great fighters, but
the skills were all his. he makes boxing look so terribly
easy. you see a leonard fight you want to try it yourself.

This is spot on.

Peak SRL had no weaknesses & could do everything.

It's a shame his career was so truncated because we missed a lot of prime Leonard, as he would have engaged in some truly mega contests in 1983, '84, '85 & '86 had he stayed active & not taken to cocaine.

Try the great Roberto Duran

[davie]

Sugar Ray Robinson could knock you out going backward's he'll do me

To be fair, so can GGG but that's entirely down to power and punching technique.
Although you can describe having fantastic punching technique a skill, i'm not sure it encapsulates all that we consider of being skillful

And of course I'm not in any way trying to compare SRR with GGG in terms of skill, just saying, being able to KO someone while moving backwards is not the best example you could give

[Vinsanity]

There's not enough good footage of Archie Moore , Willie pep, or Robinson to really know how good they really were it's a shame it's like myths but I believe it

[keithmoonhangover]

SRL comes first to mind. he had such an arsenal of
tactics to choose from. this rare talent of moving
like a dancer while having real pep in his punch. i
do not like how he mocked other great fighters, but
the skills were all his. he makes boxing look so terribly
easy. you see a leonard fight you want to try it yourself.

This is spot on.

Peak SRL had no weaknesses & could do everything.

It's a shame his career was so truncated because we missed a lot of prime Leonard, as he would have engaged in some truly mega contests in 1983, '84, '85 & '86 had he stayed active & not taken to cocaine.

Try the great Roberto Duran

Leonard had more skills than Duran. Faster hands, faster feet and more will to win.

[elmersalsa]

This is spot on.

Peak SRL had no weaknesses & could do everything.

It's a shame his career was so truncated because we missed a lot of prime Leonard, as he would have engaged in some truly mega contests in 1983, '84, '85 & '86 had he stayed active & not taken to cocaine.

Try the great Roberto Duran

Leonard had more skills than Duran. Faster hands, faster feet and more will to win.

You gotta be kidding me. What a joke that was.

[keithmoonhangover]

you gotta be kidding me. What a joke that was.

Nope. Leonard's will to win is beyond reproach. Let me ask you two questions, which I know you haven't got the guts to answer.

1. Did Leonard ever quit in a fight?
2. Did Duran ever quit in a fight?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Leonard wasn't as good as Duran defensively, but his will was as strong as it gets. Benny Leonard might be the most skilled fighter ever. Old film of him doesn't even look old.

[elmersalsa]

you gotta be kidding me. What a joke that was.

Nope. Leonard's will to win is beyond reproach. Let me ask you two questions, which I know you haven't got the guts to answer.

1. Did Leonard ever quit in a fight?
2. Did Duran ever quit in a fight?

1. No
2.Yes


I ask now, what's the point? One fight doesn't make a fighter.

I ask you this, and let's see if you got the guts to answer
1. Did Duran beat his wife like Leonard?
2. Did Leonard beat his wife?

Answer me. What that got to do with skills?

[Syntax Error]

you gotta be kidding me. What a joke that was.

Nope. Leonard's will to win is beyond reproach. Let me ask you two questions, which I know you haven't got the guts to answer.

1. Did Leonard ever quit in a fight?
2. Did Duran ever quit in a fight?

1. No
2.Yes


I ask now, what's the point? One fight doesn't make a fighter.

I ask you this, and let's see if you got the guts to answer
1. Did Duran beat his wife like Leonard?
2. Did Leonard beat his wife?

Answer me. What that got to do with skills?

Don't forget the Pat Lawlor fight.

[elmersalsa]

Nope. Leonard's will to win is beyond reproach. Let me ask you two questions, which I know you haven't got the guts to answer.

1. Did Leonard ever quit in a fight?
2. Did Duran ever quit in a fight?

1. No
2.Yes


I ask now, what's the point? One fight doesn't make a fighter.

I ask you this, and let's see if you got the guts to answer
1. Did Duran beat his wife like Leonard?
2. Did Leonard beat his wife?

Answer me. What that got to do with skills?

Don't forget the Pat Lawlor fight.

The out of prime Duran that was Supposed to be way retired by then Syntax Error? Really? Give me a break! What that has to do with skills?

[Syntax Error]

1. No
2.Yes


I ask now, what's the point? One fight doesn't make a fighter.

I ask you this, and let's see if you got the guts to answer
1. Did Duran beat his wife like Leonard?
2. Did Leonard beat his wife?

Answer me. What that got to do with skills?

Don't forget the Pat Lawlor fight.

The out of prime Duran that was Supposed to be way retired by then Syntax Error? Really? Give me a break! What that has to do with skills?

I'm not talking about skills, I am talking about quitting in fights (which this thread seems to have veered off into), something Duran did more than once.

[elmersalsa]

Don't forget the Pat Lawlor fight.

The out of prime Duran that was Supposed to be way retired by then Syntax Error? Really? Give me a break! What that has to do with skills?

I'm not talking about skills, I am talking about quitting in fights (which this thread seems to have veered off into), something Duran did more than once.

So that makes him a quitter out of 121 pro fights? Really?

[elmersalsa]

These Duran's haters, smh

[Syntax Error]

The out of prime Duran that was Supposed to be way retired by then Syntax Error? Really? Give me a break! What that has to do with skills?

I'm not talking about skills, I am talking about quitting in fights (which this thread seems to have veered off into), something Duran did more than once.

So that makes him a quitter out of 121 pro fights? Really?

Never said that; just stated a fact that he quit in more than one of his fights.

My pointing out facts doesn't make me a Duran 'hater'.

[man]

Should be an easy question. Not about who accomplished the most or could have, or who was the biggest puncher, most durable, fastest,fittest. etc. Just a simple, who had the greatest ring skills in the history of the sport ?

sugar ray and ali. on top of their movement
skills they had intelligence which made them
win fights they would have lost otherwise.

[Badhusker]

SRL

Not sure that I agree about SRL as far as skill. SRL had 40 fights. I don't think that he compares in skill with greats like Charles, Moore, Pep, and Robinson, who had well over 100 fights. What Leonard had was speed and talent. When he started losing some of his speed, he started having trouble in some fights. I believe that SRL saw the handwriting on the wall when he lost to Norris at 34, and then retired (at least until the Camacho fight).

Roberto Duran fought until he was 50, and his skill carried him in some of his fights even though he was far past his prime. He gave a 34 year old Camacho a good fight even though he was 45 at the time. Some even thought he won including none other than Sugar Ray Leonard (which led up to his fight with Camacho).

JMO, but I thought what made SRL so good was his speed and talent. I would go along with Crease's list and have SRL as top 5 all time in the welterweight division.

SRL top 5 ATG? I saw him many times, and disagree. He was great, but not top 5. Super close fight with Benitez, his fight with Hearns he was definitely losing through 12 or 13....would have lost it by UD if a 12 rounder. He admitted Hearns beat him in a rematch that was called a draw. Great at stealing rounds with little flurries at the end. Beat? Hagler at the end of Hagler's career. Was totally shot at 34. If him and Floyd fought at 34, I guess that would make Floyd the GOAT? I actually put Hagler and Hearns on equal footing status as Leonard.