Who is The #1 Heavyweight of All Time?

[BoxBuzz]

Vitali stepped in the ring with the Heavyweight Champion of the World....Lennox Lewis...... He stepped into the ring with a case of serious intentions, he stepped out with a bad case of Pizza Face.

Troo Fax.

[man]

Lewis would have had to win 5 of the 6 remaining rounds to win a close 115-113 D... Vitali needed 3 of 6 to win... But that doesn't matter. Since foul blows caused the cuts and Vitali should have won a Unanimous Technical Decision according to the rules. The video clearly depicts the back of Lewis's glove as the edge and palm of Lewis's right glove slash Vitali's left eyelid open in a holding and hitting (so double foul) technique. some 10 seconds into the 3rd round..

Lewis continued to foul and was warned for rubbing the palm of his glove in Vitali's face.. if fouls cause or contribute to cuts that stop a fight, and 4 rounds have passed before a cut stoppage, the fight goes to the scorecards... If fewer than 4 rounds have elapsed it's a draw.

please. the stoppage was legit and
the cuts were not really controversial.
no ellbows, no head butts, and that
back of the glove thing can happen
in an active bout. no big deal.

am i the only sane person in this thread?

... The cuts were VERY controversial, since the British commentators said "the fight would go to the scorecards now" at the closing of the 4th round... Look at the first 15 seconds of the 3rd round, because that's when all the damage occurred... The thumb strike happened like 7 seconds into the round... and the holding and hitting palm slash 3 seconds later... Vitali was fine at the end of the 2nd... 15 seconds into the 3rd he was pouring blood -- and that was from the clearly visible palm slash which ripped the thumb strike nick wide open and slashed 2 more deep cuts on Vitali's face... And even if you think the referee could have missed the was holding and hitting at the same time ... clearly a foul.

watched it, disagree with you; rough,
unclear exchange, no foul.

I'm the only other one.

goodness.

[man]

Lewis would have had to win 5 of the 6 remaining rounds to win a close 115-113 D... Vitali needed 3 of 6 to win... But that doesn't matter. Since foul blows caused the cuts and Vitali should have won a Unanimous Technical Decision according to the rules. The video clearly depicts the back of Lewis's glove as the edge and palm of Lewis's right glove slash Vitali's left eyelid open in a holding and hitting (so double foul) technique. some 10 seconds into the 3rd round..

Lewis continued to foul and was warned for rubbing the palm of his glove in Vitali's face.. if fouls cause or contribute to cuts that stop a fight, and 4 rounds have passed before a cut stoppage, the fight goes to the scorecards... If fewer than 4 rounds have elapsed it's a draw.

please. the stoppage was legit and
the cuts were not really controversial.
no ellbows, no head butts, and that
back of the glove thing can happen
in an active bout. no big deal.

am i the only sane person in this thread?

I'm the only other one... The cuts were VERY controversial, since the British commentators said "the fight would go to the scorecards now" at the closing of the 4th round... Look at the first 15 seconds of the 3rd round, because that's when all the damage occurred... The thumb strike happened like 7 seconds into the round... and the holding and hitting palm slash 3 seconds later... Vitali was fine at the end of the 2nd... 15 seconds into the 3rd he was pouring blood -- and that was from the clearly visible palm slash which ripped the thumb strike nick wide open and slashed 2 more deep cuts on Vitali's face... And even if you think the referee could have missed the was holding and hitting at the same time ... clearly a foul.

watched it, disagree with you; rough,
unclear exchange, no foul.

I'm the only other one.

goodness.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Nobody sane thinks Lewis almost lost that fight. He definitely got buckled, I remember it clearly as I was cheering on Vitali. The fight was easy to score, 4-2 Vitali. Sadly, for him and Kalan, it wasn't a 6 round fight. He got his ass whipped.

Great effort though, Vitali just doesn't have the one punch power of a Rahman. Maybe that's why he was so afraid to face the Rock.

[Counter-puncher]

Nobody sane thinks Lewis almost lost that fight.

Its a lol that kalan will say that about lewis-klit but seems to think the same doesn't apply to hearns-Barkley 1, as Barkley was much closer to being stopped than Lewis was....

[Kalan]

please. the stoppage was legit and
the cuts were not really controversial.
no ellbows, no head butts, and that
back of the glove thing can happen
in an active bout. no big deal.

am i the only sane person in this thread?

I'm the only other one... The cuts were VERY controversial, since the British commentators said "the fight would go to the scorecards now" at the closing of the 4th round... Look at the first 15 seconds of the 3rd round, because that's when all the damage occurred... The thumb strike happened like 7 seconds into the round... and the holding and hitting palm slash 3 seconds later... Vitali was fine at the end of the 2nd... 15 seconds into the 3rd he was pouring blood -- and that was from the clearly visible palm slash which ripped the thumb strike nick wide open and slashed 2 more deep cuts on Vitali's face... And even if you think the referee could have missed the was holding and hitting at the same time ... clearly a foul.

watched it, disagree with you; rough,
unclear exchange, no foul.

I'm the only other one.

goodness.

It wasn't an exchange... It was Lewis doing thumb strike and a palm slash while holding and hitting... The problem is they removed the most damning videos from youtube that show the thumb strike and palm slash in detail... But you know Vitali never suffered another threatening cut in his career and that slash as Lewis was holding and hitting clearly opened the wound -- because Vitali was pouring blood after the clinch.

I would be the first to give Lewis credit if he won on skillful boxing and clean punches scored... but he lost the first 2 rounds big and went for the thumb strikes and the slashing of Klitschko's eye -- and he was losing the fight after 6 -- in a scorecard scenario.

[Tomasino]

Lewis learned his fearsome 'gloved thumb strike' and deadly 'Palm slash' from none other than Mr Miyagi.

[gilgamesh]

Anybody else see Lennox Lewis commit any fouls when the cuts open on Vitali?

[BoxBuzz]

Anybody else see Lennox Lewis commit any fouls when the cuts open on Vitali?

Ya can't just go and turn a man's face into a Pizza. Gotta be a rule on that....it ain't right.

[Controversial]

Lewis in rematches was always better, career heaviest against Klit which shows his conditioning was not the best. Deserved the win first time around and would've smashed Klit properly in the rematch.

[cfang]

Lewis in rematches was always better, career heaviest against Klit which shows his conditioning was not the best. Deserved the win first time around and would've smashed Klit properly in the rematch.

Agree 100%. The reason Klit never got cut the same way again was that he never faced anyone remotely in Lennox's class. Lewis was a great heavy who hit hard and was better than the Klits - fact.

[man]

Lewis in rematches was always better, career heaviest against Klit which shows his conditioning was not the best. Deserved the win first time around and would've smashed Klit properly in the rematch.

Agree 100%. The reason Klit never got cut the same way again was that he never faced anyone remotely in Lennox's class. Lewis was a great heavy who hit hard and was better than the Klits - fact.

agreed.

[Kalan]

Lewis was losing the fight on ALL SCORECARDS and would have been crushed in the rematch...

NOBODY CAN DENY this instance of face palming in the 4th round at 4:15 of the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9OkXneaGkM at 2:O3 of the 4th round... Lewis rubs Vitali's face with his palm and the referee yells "NO NO NO NO" and gives Lewis a ridiculously light warning by gesturing the palming infraction with his own palm for a split second while Lewis didn't even look at him.

[gilgamesh]

It's easy to deny it if you watch the clip and see it didn't happen.

[Controversial]

If there was any deliberate foul play it was Klit vs Charr. Even an old and out of shape Lewis was too good for a prime Klit, Lewis would've handled him much easier in the rematch.

[Kalan]

Lewis was losing the fight on ALL SCORECARDS and would have been crushed in the rematch...

NOBODY CAN DENY this instance of face palming in the 4th round at 4:15 of the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9OkXneaGkM at 2:O3 of the 4th round... Lewis rubs Vitali's face with his palm and the referee yells "NO NO NO NO" and gives Lewis a ridiculously light warning by gesturing the palming infraction with his own palm for a split second while Lewis didn't even look at him.

Gilgamesh... "It's easy to deny it if you watch the clip and see it didn't happen" ... If you did that and didn't see it you're a deaf, blind, idiot.

[jbizzle20]

McCall and Rahman landed lucky punches, simple ... Lewis was never behind against anyone except Klitschko (who Lewis fought on 2 weeks notice and in the WORST shape of his life yet still Lewis f*cked up Vitali

When you land a lucky punch you had help from your opponent... He made his chin available... The video record is clear... After almost getting knocked out in the first 2 rounds, Lewis f*cked Vitali up shortly into the 3rd round with an obvious thumb strike to the corner of VK's left eye... a wrestling grab around the head and Lewis's hair rubbed into the nick he opened with the thumb strike - while he held Vitali around the neck - followed... then maintaining his headlock Lewis ripped Vitali with a palm rake with his right glove... All those fouls opened 3 major cuts on Vitali's face (including his cheek) and blood started streaming into his left eye... That was the only time Vitali ever suffered a serious cut in his career -- and the only fight Lewis ever won on cuts... That fight should have gone to the scorecards because fouls contributed mightily to those cuts... Proper result??? Vitali Klitschko wins by Unanimous Technical Decision over Lennox Lewis in 6 rounds.. I think it's interesting that Klitschko could maintain his lead on the scorecards having to fight 4 rounds half blinded.

Kind of like Ward-Kessler went to the scorecards -- because unintentional head-butts by Ward opened a far less severe cut on Kessler.

As for Lewis fighting Vitali on 2 weeks notice... Lewis had been training for a World Heavyweight Championship Fight for MONTHS... Vitali had less than 2 weeks to prepare for a World Heavyweight Championship Fight.. Lewis retired after they made Vitali his mandatory challenger -- and after vociferously proclaiming he would give Vitali a rematch.. LL knew he dodged a bullet and wouldn't have Lou Moret as his referee in the rematch.

I think you're totally confused man. Lewis took the fight on 2 weeks notice. It said so in the broadcast. Klitschko was prepping for a Lewis fight his entire career, up until that point. Lewis basically retired after Tyson and didn't think it was worth defending against Byrd then people clamored so loudly for Lewis to fight Klitschko that he got tired of it and fought him anyway just to quiet them. After beating Klitschko, Lewis realized that the public would never be satisfied no matter who he beat, so he just called it quits. Lewis' mother pleaded with him to call it quits, as well. Those two factors convinced Lewis to walk away. This is substantially documented. As far as the cuts, it looked more like the big counter that Lewis landed near the start of the 3rd. That was a clean, hard overhand that ripped across Klitschko's face. Lewis was throwing his jabs in a raking motion across the face, but with the knuckles of the glove. It almost look like he was doing it because of exhaustion. The punches were just thrown out there with no whip on them. After Lewis realized how bad the cuts were getting, he started targeting them. That's a very common strategy in boxing.

[Kalan]

Lewis was training for a Heavyweight Championship Fight for months... Vitali Klitschko trained for a Heavyweight Championship Fight for less than 2 weeks.

When you do World Heavyweight Title Fights you prepare better. You have bigger camps, more sparring partners, more trainers, better facilities, more cooks, more maids, more bottle washers... Lewis was ready as Hell, bigger and stronger than ever... Not an ounce of fat on him... Vitali wasn't even close to ready... Vitali was still winning the fight on ALL SCORECARDS at the conclusion of the fight and would have crushed Lewis in any rematch -- which Lewis promised and reneged on.

[keithmoonhangover]

Lewis was ready as Hell, bigger and stronger than ever... Not an ounce of fat on him...

I don't think this statement is factual.

[Kalan]

Lewis was preparing for a top rated challenger in a Heavyweight Championship Title Defense, for months. Klitschko was preparing for Joe Blow from Kokomo

[keithmoonhangover]

Joe Blow from Kokomo

He had the same experience as Wilt Chamberlain.

[evrenb]

Lewis was preparing for a top rated challenger in a Heavyweight Championship Title Defense, for months. Klitschko was preparing for Joe Blow from Kokomo

I believe Lewis was scheduled to fight Kirk Johnson on that date, with Vitali on the undercard with view to them meeting later in the year if both won their respective bouts. Johnson pulled out injured two weeks prior, so Lewis being the great champion he was took on Vitali in a brutal contest. Imo Lewis was not in good shape physically or revved up mentally. Vitali on the other hand was physically sharp (as always) and undoubtedly super motivated.

[Kalan]

McCall and Rahman landed lucky punches, simple ... Lewis was never behind against anyone except Klitschko (who Lewis fought on 2 weeks notice and in the WORST shape of his life yet still Lewis f*cked up Vitali

When you land a lucky punch you had help from your opponent... He made his chin available... The video record is clear... After almost getting knocked out in the first 2 rounds, Lewis f*cked Vitali up shortly into the 3rd round with an obvious thumb strike to the corner of VK's left eye... a wrestling grab around the head and Lewis's hair rubbed into the nick he opened with the thumb strike - while he held Vitali around the neck - followed... then maintaining his headlock Lewis ripped Vitali with a palm rake with his right glove... All those fouls opened 3 major cuts on Vitali's face (including his cheek) and blood started streaming into his left eye... That was the only time Vitali ever suffered a serious cut in his career -- and the only fight Lewis ever won on cuts... That fight should have gone to the scorecards because fouls contributed mightily to those cuts... Proper result??? Vitali Klitschko wins by Unanimous Technical Decision over Lennox Lewis in 6 rounds.. I think it's interesting that Klitschko could maintain his lead on the scorecards having to fight 4 rounds half blinded.

Kind of like Ward-Kessler went to the scorecards -- because unintentional head-butts by Ward opened a far less severe cut on Kessler.

As for Lewis fighting Vitali on 2 weeks notice... Lewis had been training for a World Heavyweight Championship Fight for MONTHS... Vitali had less than 2 weeks to prepare for a World Heavyweight Championship Fight.. Lewis retired after they made Vitali his mandatory challenger -- and after vociferously proclaiming he would give Vitali a rematch.. LL knew he dodged a bullet and wouldn't have Lou Moret as his referee in the rematch.

I think you're totally confused man. Lewis took the fight on 2 weeks notice. It said so in the broadcast. Klitschko was prepping for a Lewis fight his entire career, up until that point. Lewis basically retired after Tyson and didn't think it was worth defending against Byrd then people clamored so loudly for Lewis to fight Klitschko that he got tired of it and fought him anyway just to quiet them. After beating Klitschko, Lewis realized that the public would never be satisfied no matter who he beat, so he just called it quits. Lewis' mother pleaded with him to call it quits, as well. Those two factors convinced Lewis to walk away. This is substantially documented. As far as the cuts, it looked more like the big counter that Lewis landed near the start of the 3rd. That was a clean, hard overhand that ripped across Klitschko's face. Lewis was throwing his jabs in a raking motion across the face, but with the knuckles of the glove. It almost look like he was doing it because of exhaustion. The punches were just thrown out there with no whip on them. After Lewis realized how bad the cuts were getting, he started targeting them. That's a very
common strategy in boxing.

Klitschko was NOT prepping for Lewis. Lewis wasn't the champ for his whole career. Lewis lost the title a couple times and there was no guarantee he was going to win it back. Klitschko would be foolish to focus on Lewis, who could lose the title at any time. And a Heavyweight Champion's training camp is altogether different than anybody else's training camp -- except for the guy who's scheduled to be his next challenger. Because you pull out all stops when you're the champ... you line up more sparring partners, trainers, coaches, and just more help in general -- because it's important you hold on to the title, and important that you win the title. If you're preparing for a 2nd rate Heavyweight---such as Klitschko was doing---the pay isn't nearly as good.. You can't afford to invest millions in a training camp and you don't NEED to.. Lewis was getting 10 X the training expenses Klitschko was getting and he had a HELL of a lot more help on board. When the opportunity was presented Vitali had NO time to get more help on board -- Lewis already had everybody he needed in camp.

That overhand right 10 seconds into the 3rd round was a classic thumb strike... Within 5 seconds after that Lewis grabbed VK around the neck and slashed that nick open, while ripping open 2 more cuts on Vitali's face with a palm slash.. VK was pouring blood from his face when he came out of the clinch.. Klitschko should have been awarded the fight by Unanimous Technical Decision... More than 4 rounds were completed and he was winning on all scorecards. Since foul blows caused and contributed to the cuts the fight goes to the scorecards as the British TV announcers said it would. The fans knew who won the fight. They booed Lewis and cheered Vitali. Lewis promised Larry Merchant and the fans he would give Vitali a rematch. He lied.

[gilgamesh]

Lewis was ready as Hell, bigger and stronger than ever... Not an ounce of fat on him...

I don't think this statement is factual.

It's one thing to make up stuff nobody can prove, but it's a whole other level of moronic to make up stuff about fights and events that other people saw and know for a fact what the case was

I guess this is his new thing, 1st Wilt Chamberlain could beat Ali, and now Vitali should've won his fight with Lennox in spite of getting ripped to shreds by punches.

There was a cartoon in Ring Magazine making fun of Lennox's poor conditioning after the fight

Even an out of shape, older, Lennox Lewis was better than the very best Vitali Klitschko could be. For the record I'm a fan of Vitali and I always liked him, but the truth is the truth.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Vitali was fighting Cedric Boswell. Would have been one of his tougher fights.