Babe Ruth vs Ali

[Boxing Prospect]

Dick Dastardly vs Fred Flintstone...now that's a match where we all want to know what would happen.

Fred Wins, Dick Dastardly didn't win any thing

[Boxing Prospect]

How many High School boxers are there???? ... None... There's almost no college boxers and the ones that exist suck to the quasars. There's not a deep pool of talent.

Lots, heck Japan just had a high school boxing tournament

[Kalan]

Ali had "read the book" so to speak of many very very talented fighters coming his way, he lived chapter after chapter..... and he wrote the book on ring generalship. He always figured out a way in his prime, to deal effectively with what was before him. As much as you want to "gift" Wilt with every talent, skill, and option known in the physical universe and beyond.

Wilt would only have 6 months of training, never having cracked that same book to see what a real fight was like. Never knowing what it's like to have someone come after him with ill intent for all they are worth. Who was going to give him that experience?

Hell if Ali himself and his trainer took on the training of Wilt, showing Wilt every weakness he had, and...

First BuzzBox... Ali could barely read. He wasn't too bright and failed the Armed Forces entrance exam.. Somebody's going to have to read the book to him.

Second... A ring general doesn't run or lay on the ropes taking punishment.. 29 is prime and Ali didn't figure a way to beat pudgy little Frazier 1st fight.

Third... Wilt wouldn't want to crack the "Ali Book". Ali was loaded with flaws. This video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEYeLqRie3k against 188-pound Light Heavyweight Doug Jones---who Ali had massive height, weight, and reach on---details a few of his flaws.

Fourth... Having Ali coming at you with ill intent isn't like having Anthony Joshua coming at you with ill intent. Ali was wide open.. a soft puncher... a poor body attacker... a poor attacker in general... didn't duck under punches very well... relied on his ability to absorb punches.. got his bell rung repeatedly... and really got hurt bad in the ring... That's why he wouldn't risk it with Wilt.

Fifth... Angelo Dundee never boxed in his life... How can you teach something you never did and are no good at??? Boxing isn't rocket science so a lot of guys are taught the wrong way to do everything. There's no "text book boxer" because there's no book. Some trainer are good. Some are terrible

Sixth... If you have a big, tall, strong, fast, smart, highly trained, brutally powerful, well conditioned, and outstandingly talented athlete you're 75% there. A brilliantly talented athlete can be taught a scientific boxing stance, footwork, jab, straight right, left hook, right hook, uppercuts and 45's, body shots, all the feint, and all the defensive maneuvers for every punch.. There's 24 hours in a day and Wilt Chamberlain was a fanatic.. He probably wouold spend about 18 of those hours every day over the first 2 months getting the basic skills down to perfection.. That's over 1080 hours.

The reason Wilt wanted to work so long and hard was so he could learn to box both orthodox and southpaw equally well... Wilt noticed that no Heavyweight Challenger in Fistic History had every been a southpaw up to 1965 when he first started contemplating a Chamberlain-Ali Fight.

After 2 mos. he would start sparring and sharpen those skills up against boxers of Ali's height and frame size... After a few weeks of sparring He might decide to box 15 rounds 10 to 11AM... and another 15 rounds 6 to 7PM... using about 15 sparring partners 2 rounds each... His goal was to be ready to fight in 4 months -- so the last 2 months he could refine and pull everything together, so as to be ready to knock Ali stiff by the completion of 6 months of training. After he developed a good deal of skill he planned to spar without headgear and with regulation boxing gloves for the final 3 months to get used to the feeling of them..

Wilt also planned to add a good deal of size and strength. employing strength trainers throughout a 6-month camp... The only thing I really know is he planned on training unbelievably hard and sparring with regulation boxing gloves and no headgear... and planned on learning both orthodox and southpaw styles and the situations he could change stances up.. Chamberlain pursued the fight for some years, hoping Ali would change his mind. He didn't see the same vulnerabilities or box office potential in fighting other Heavyweights out there.

[Kalan]

How many High School boxers are there???? ... None... There's almost no college boxers and the ones that exist suck to the quasars. There's not a deep pool of talent.

Lots, heck Japan just had a high school boxing tournament

LOL... How many Heavyweights are in the tournament??? Japan has never produced a single top Heavyweight. No High School in the United States sponsors a Boxing team to my knowledge -- where there's literally millions of High School Basketball players... You're going to get some damned good players.

[BoxBuzz]

First ...

Second...

Third...

Fourth...

Fifth...

Sixth... .

So just so I'm not confused here. You're telling me, that you believe, that Wilt Chamberlain would stand a good chance at beating Ali in a boxing match.

Is that what your suggesting?

[Caractacus]

If you dont mind me asking,has the Muhammad Ali vrs Wilt Chamberlain thread been unlocked ?
Why arnt all these posts directed there so it can read"100" replys by now ?

[Kalan]

First ...

Second...

Third...

Fourth...

Fifth...

Sixth... .

So just so I'm not confused here. You're telling me, that you believe, that Wilt Chamberlain would stand a good chance at beating Ali in a boxing match.

Is that what your suggesting?

NO!!!! You already know that... I'm telling you why he would spring the upset and why Ali didn't have a chance in HELL if Ali ever signed the contract... Ali had no intention of doing that... Boxing isn't like other sports -- sheer size, strength, athletic ability, toughness, punching power, and style dynamics can determine a Boxing match... Frazier beat Ali and was strongly favored to beat Foreman, who'd never beaten a top fighter to that point... That still didn't mean Frazier had a chance in HELL because Foreman was too big, tall, strong, and punched too hard for the little guy.

[Caractacus]

The one undedermined factor Chamberlain admitted to though,was if he could take a punch or not from a 200 plus pound man.
Wilt Chamberlain sort of had a gracile looking neck and head.
I seem to remember reading Jack Dempsey once remarking and saying about Georges Carpentier before their fight
that Carpentier had a longish and narrow cranium and didnt think that he would be able to take a punch from a heavyweight so well.

[BoxBuzz]

First ...

Second...

Third...

Fourth...

Fifth...

Sixth... .

So just so I'm not confused here. You're telling me, that you believe, that Wilt Chamberlain would stand a good chance at beating Ali in a boxing match.

Is that what your suggesting?

NO!!!! .

Good, cause I was so confused, that for moment there, I thought you were saying that some basketball guy was going to somehow beat down the HW champion of the world.

[Kalan]

NO BuzzBox... You like to twist my responses, put words in my mouth, and try to pull my chain. Since I have trained 100's of boxers I know what it takes to make a great boxer. Like John Wooden said, "You keep the guy with all the experience. Give me the great athletes who have the discipline to apply themselves and learn the game. They'll run the experienced guys off the floor." That's why he wanted Lou Alcindor and Bill Walton and won all those national championships.

[BoxBuzz]

NO BuzzBox... You like to twist my responses, put words in my mouth, and try to pull my chain. .

I really don't have the intention of provoking you. And on some things like Monzon's skillset, I find we agree. I just find that I do honestly disagree with you on many things.


And I'm about as willing to share my thoughts as you are.

[Syntax Error]

What was the point in locking the humongous Wilt Chamberlain v Muhammad Ali masturbation thread if the 'baitin' is then allowed to continue on another thread entirely?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

What was the point in locking the humongous Wilt Chamberlain v Muhammad Ali masturbation thread if the 'baitin' is then allowed to continue on another thread entirely?

It's ridiculous. Poor babe. This place has gone from being ridiculously over modded to a prancing ground for trolls.

[Kalan]

You're the worst offender SaadOff... You never have anything intelligent or enlightening to say, so you crack wise and hurl hate.

[Caractacus]

yeah I agree with Kalen, just go to some of these so called posters messages
and see if they ever post any legitament threads or posts on the subject of boxing.
Its all attacking someone else mainly.

[Caractacus]

NO BuzzBox... You like to twist my responses, put words in my mouth, and try to pull my chain. Since I have trained 100's of boxers I know what it takes to make a great boxer. Like John Wooden said, "You keep the guy with all the experience. Give me the great athletes who have the discipline to apply themselves and learn the game. They'll run the experienced guys off the floor." That's why he wanted Lou Alcindor and Bill Walton and won all those national championships.

hey Kalen,can you tell us a little about your background without naming names please ?

[Kalan]

I never intended to box when I was a kid. I was involved with other sports and came to Boxing very late. I became friends with a name boxer and he got me started sparring with him. I was an amateur and pro but never considered coaching. Decades after I quit I was asked to coach and got my certification. I preferred starting with sub-novice amateurs because they didn't have bad habits they had to unlearn. They're a fresh slate. I came into a program where their best fighter didn't have a winning record. Within 2 years we were the power in the region and were winning 90% of our fights including producing national and international champions. I trained all the new guys in the fundamentals and made sure they were solid when they started sparring. I drilled balance, footwork, feinting, timing and patience. Not swinging big or hard. Boxing and being smart and tricking the other kid into swinging away so you can pick him off. Five years in I quit a little abruptly. I had to pay a lot of more attention to my job and making money for a few years there. I needed a lot of it at the time for several reasons. Unfortunately the whole program disintegrated and fell apart after I left. It's gone. I probably could have done it a lot differently. Some of the kids I trained are pros and still call me.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

[gp.]

Can't add much to that.

[gp.]

yeah I agree with Kalen

Now there's a shock.

I like how you spelled his name wrong deliberately to try and convince idiots there's no connection between you.

[hhaehre]

I never intended to box when I was a kid. I was involved with other sports and came to Boxing very late. I became friends with a name boxer and he got me started sparring with him. I was an amateur and pro but never considered coaching. Decades after I quit I was asked to coach and got my certification. I preferred starting with sub-novice amateurs because they didn't have bad habits they had to unlearn. They're a fresh slate. I came into a program where their best fighter didn't have a winning record. Within 2 years we were the power in the region and were winning 90% of our fights including producing national and international champions. I trained all the new guys in the fundamentals and made sure they were solid when they started sparring. I drilled balance, footwork, feinting, timing and patience. Not swinging big or hard. Boxing and being smart and tricking the other kid into swinging away so you can pick him off. Five years in I quit a little abruptly. I had to pay a lot of more attention to my job and making money for a few years there. I needed a lot of it at the time for several reasons. Unfortunately the whole program disintegrated and fell apart after I left. It's gone. I probably could have done it a lot differently. Some of the kids I trained are pros and still call me.

[gp.]

Kalan, everyone here (with the exception of the four supporters you always cite, presumably) thinks you're a lying, deluded fool. Why wouldn't you just tell them who you are and put them in their place? Surely that would be satisfying. Plenty of pro boxers have posted here and acknowledged who they are.

[keithmoonhangover]

I was an amateur and pro but never considered coaching.

I was a presidential candidate in Mongolia, while rewriting the unabridged version of the bible. I also had a spells as a test pilot, a Michelin star chef and was Wilt Chamberlain's maid for years.

[Kalan]

Do I give a crap what some idiots think gp???? NO... A lot of haters think Obama was born in Kenya and isn't the president... A lot of people think Hillary Clinton should be in jail for having a private email server like every former Secretary of State had since email was invented... A lot of people think more guns in the hands of more people is the answer to gun violence... Some people insist Climate Change is a fraud... Am I going to persuade these idiots differently??? You can only work with somebody who has a brain... I can only state that facts and I could GAF LESS what some brainless haters on the Internet believe.

[Sidney Carton]

Babe Ruth was a short, fat, tub-of-lard....

Babe Ruth was 6' 3" tall.