Did Dominic Ingle make the correct decision ?

[stujones]

Spot on both in boxing and managerial terms. If Kell would have taken a sustained beating for the next couple of rounds forcing a ref stoppage or a 10 count - it wouldn't have look good in terms of box office appeal - all it would have looked like a good small guy having some success against an exceptional bigger guy before being whallopped to the ground. Now, though Eddie has a SBO star DESPITE losing and losing within the first half of the fight.

When Khan fought Canelo I said it was a great move cause Khan had nothing to lose as people were expecting a KO victory anyway. I was actually way off, all it did was solidify Khan's dodgy chin and he lost some appeal. Not many are saying Khan could compete at 154 post Canelo. Whereas it is being suggested that Brook at 154 is a coronation just waiting to happen - I think had Brook being KO cold or even stopped on rubberly legs, then I aint sure people would be saying the same.

[nitro5912]

I am not knocking Brook, and have no problems with the fight stopping where it did.

However there's something to be said for the fact that if you are going to fight on, surely you don't want to make a show of any injuries as you are just inviting your opponent to hit you there. It might be difficult not to react to them sometimes, but surely if you can, and again if you are going to fight on, the sensible thing is to try and hide it?

If people can see the bruising and the way his eye was shutting on TV, from ringside etc do you think GGG didn't?

Kell was doing no different than many fighters when cut, they paw the blood away etc,

You could see the bruising almost instantly.

[MightyWarrior]

Yes of course he did the right thing, and think it was preplanned in that before the round, I think he told Kell he was going to stop it if things didn't improve. Which is why I think Kell was waving GGG in, as a final act of bravado. And you cannot blame him, showed massive balls, had landed his best punches and realised there was no stopping this man...

In the HBO version on YouTube, ingle is whispering to Kell before the round, then you can hear him say something like " I'm watching okay ? I'm watching everything! " in other words don't worry I'm not going to let it go too long, I'm watching out for you...which struck me as brilliant reassurance you want to hear from your corner, real compassion... as there are a lot of brave cornermen who let their man take too much punishment ...

Great & humane move by Dom looking out for Kell.

[GPTM1403]

Brook diagnosed the nature and extent of the injury correctly, so you have got a bit of a mute point.

Brook was praised by Froch, Haye, Calzaghe, Macklin, Broner, Leonard and Holyfield. You instead focus on his reaction when getting his eye socket broken, yet choose to ignore his subsequent reaction in coming back to win the round against the world's most ferocious puncher. Maybe that says something about you.

The next time I suspect I've suffered a fracture I'll not bother going to the hospital, I'll call up Kell Brook and let him have a lucky guess. Do you remember when Tyson thought he'd broken his back during a fight? Tyson was also guilty of showing out and moaning in fights not going his way. Littlepug is right in what he says; as a boxer you maintain your poker face at all times during a fight.

The next time I suffer a potential fracture or snapped ligament on the football pitch, I won't bother going to the hospital but instead carry on playing the game because I'm a man and should maintain my poker face whilst playing, potentially turning an ankle sprain into a full blown fracture and ligament damage.

Seriously, you must have hurt yourself doing something and thought ouch that hurt, that feels like it could be broken I best head off to A&E instead of carrying on.

Given that kell said he was seeing numerous visions of GGG, was starting to ship shots, not load up on his own suggests he knew something was wrong. He could have stayed in the fight, took more punishment and got carried out on a stretcher, lose his license due to poor vision all because he had his eye socket fractured.

Behave yourself

THIS. He also said later he started off trying to rub the eye clear because he thought something was in it.

[THEBUTCH]

Perfectly timed stoppage. I agree with those who say it was pre-planned. Brook was never going out on his shield and Ingle saved him for another day. People can say what they want about Amir Khan, but he does go out on his shield and always boxes to win (not just put up a show).

[littlepug]

Perfectly timed stoppage. I agree with those who say it was pre-planned. Brook was never going out on his shield and Ingle saved him for another day. People can say what they want about Amir Khan, but he does go out on his shield and always boxes to win (not just put up a show).

agree

[GPTM1403]

Perfectly timed stoppage. I agree with those who say it was pre-planned. Brook was never going out on his shield and Ingle saved him for another day. People can say what they want about Amir Khan, but he does go out on his shield and always boxes to win (not just put up a show).

That is a bit disingenuous, there is a reason you don't see Khan being saved like this and it is because he hasn't got the punch resistance to be in a position to be saved. He's out of it before the towel can be raised whereas Brook was taking punishment and staying upright. They did the right thing to stop it but the only thing I'd say was pre planned about it was they knew with the eye injury if he started getting pummelled they were going to stop it because he couldn't see properly. (I wouldn't rule out that DI had decided before the fight he'd put KB's career first and stop it if he was in real danger - but that isn't the same as what you seem to be implying, that it was a total scam with the intention of bailing out at the first opportunity).

[Rob3_142]

I think it was the right time bearing in mind the opposition. Two weight classes above etc. The real problem was the matchmaking from the start. Kell could have been a national hero instead he comes out the plucky loser based on taking on a job with all the chips against him. Disappointed in hearn who i think is great for british boxing. One thing calling for competetive fights but to put your world champion up against it like that because he basically doesnt want to spend the money to get a suitable opponent for him is poor. Done the same with edwards tonite...sold him short. And doesnt mind doing it to his fighters to make some money. No one begrudges eddie making money because he works bloody hard and is a great promotor. But it shouldnt be at the expess of someones health. People avoiding golvokin up at middleweight because hes pretty much a murderous puncher. Was talks of froch fighting him. To stick a welterweight in with hims asking for trouble. Promoters got an obligation to these fighters. Should never have been made. Luckily ingle had the sense to call a halt before it got dangerous.

Really impressed with the ingles tbh...been great for british boxing. Teach the fighters the right way. Hate to think how a joe gallacher trained welterweight for example would have done against golovkin.

I think it's extremely harsh to be that critical towards Hearn. His job is to make the fights, and that's exactly what he did. He's been struggling to match Kell in a big fight. If he didn't take the opportunity, he'd be stuck with another mandatory in WW, and he'd have taken even more stick for that. In fact let's not forget GGG wasn't supposed to be fighting Kell at all, he was supposed to be fighting Eubanks Junior. They didn't sign the contract in time, and Hearn/Brook was presented with an opportunity to still bring the best P4P boxer in the world to the UK and provide one of his assets with that big fight he'd been crying out for. I have no doubt that Brook and Ingle would have made the final decision anyway. I think it was always a tall order, but perhaps an opportunity to good to turn down.

[bbjc]

People are gonna have different opinions on it. I like eddie. Think he does a great job. But theres one or two critisms that i thinks fair. Fr ank warr en had a lot more faults but one thing about frank is he knew how to build a fighter. He milked it right enough. Hearns got so many fighters in his stable he sees them as dispensible for the right price. Its all about the next big event. Giving guys huge oppertunities. But cant agree putting golvokin in with brook is a decent decision in anyway. Especially when you consider kells a champion in his own right. No matter how you look at it...hes short changing someone. Weather its kell or the fans paying 15 quid. Not fair on the fans in that when he gets in trouble the towel gets waved in or kell cause hes fighting someone he pretty much cant beat. Should have paid the money out got a 147 fighter in and built brook towards a big event against a fight he at least had a chance in.

Now looks like hes gonna use kell as just a moneymaker. Canelo will be too strong for brook. 147 looks off the agenda. He could have beaten vargas. Garcia. Khan maybe etc and went down as a british great making good money on the way. I dont think brook will get back on track from here tbh. Will be stuck between divisions.

Hes sacrificed brook at the expense of his events and money. Dangerous fight. Should never have been made just like the khan canelo fight. All for putting champions in to tough fights but not in a fight they cant win. Also not from frankie gavin to golvokin either. Build them. At least work towards the fights.

I wouldnt join matchroom if i was a young boxer coming through...you d be paid well. But he ll sacrifice you for an event if need be. I dont think he has the same judgement as wa rren just thinks if he gives a big inspirational speech it ll be enough to see the fighter through.

I can write a lot of good things about eddie also tbf...but cant agree with that decision to stick him in with golovkin.

[Rob3_142]

Letting the mask slip only makes the night harder. I remember Foreman raging over Bowe lying down every time Golota hit him in the balls. His attitude was you absorb all pain and show your opponent nothing. Again, Tucker had his orbital bone shattered vs Seldon and carried himself as if walking to the shop for a paper. I don't mean to criticise Brook, his challenge was wonderful, I just feel his registering his injury so graphically possibly made his night worse. Cerdan went on against LaMotta with a broken arm! I just wonder if so much soft match making ultimately robs a potentially great talent of the classic boxing mental tricks necessary to wriggle through the rocky fights.

Wriggle through the rocky fights? He was fighting GGG, arguably one of the greatest of all time, and the absolute best of a generation. He broke his cheekbone in the second round, and according to the scorecards was ahead up until the 5th round. You don't mean to criticise Brook, but you are, unfairly. It seems to me that you haven't experienced high level competition, and ever an injury during.

The fight was going one direction, Brook's eye was visibly busted up, so it was no mystery to GGG why he was clutching it. All it was doing was illustrating a quite serious situation to his corner, and had he decided to 'poker face' Ingle might not have thrown the towel in when he did. You just need to accept and agree that the right decision was made, and the clutching of his eye only helped the right decision be reached.

[gilgamesh]

Considering there were people wanting to see a rematch after the fight ended, and everyone was calling it a farce before it started...yeah he probably made the right decision.

[Tuan_Jim]

Letting the mask slip only makes the night harder. I remember Foreman raging over Bowe lying down every time Golota hit him in the balls. His attitude was you absorb all pain and show your opponent nothing. Again, Tucker had his orbital bone shattered vs Seldon and carried himself as if walking to the shop for a paper. I don't mean to criticise Brook, his challenge was wonderful, I just feel his registering his injury so graphically possibly made his night worse. Cerdan went on against LaMotta with a broken arm! I just wonder if so much soft match making ultimately robs a potentially great talent of the classic boxing mental tricks necessary to wriggle through the rocky fights.

Wriggle through the rocky fights? He was fighting GGG, arguably one of the greatest of all time, and the absolute best of a generation. He broke his cheekbone in the second round, and according to the scorecards was ahead up until the 5th round. You don't mean to criticise Brook, but you are, unfairly. It seems to me that you haven't experienced high level competition, and ever an injury during.

Bloody hell. Must everyone here have their orbital crushed before they can proffer opinion? I've got opinions on politics too, though have never ran a country myself. You cheaply bestow the tag "one of the greatest of all time" on a fighter who hasn't beaten one single A-class fighter. It seems to me that you aren't too historically literate boxing-wise, but we allow you an opinion.

[lillywhite14]

Absolutely the right decision imo.

The only people I've spoke to who said it was a poor decision are the casuals who want to see eyeballs hanging out of sockets and twitching, unconcious bodies on a canvas.

Brook wasn't throwing anything back and had a bad injury. It was only going one way from that point on. You'd have to be a sadist to want to see a few more rounds of that.

The injury seemed to unsettle Kell, understandably, but he did seem very, very uncomfortable against Jones too when he broke his nose. People react differently to things. Still the right decision.

[Rob3_142]

People are gonna have different opinions on it. I like eddie. Think he does a great job. But theres one or two critisms that i thinks fair. Fr ank warr en had a lot more faults but one thing about frank is he knew how to build a fighter. He milked it right enough. Hearns got so many fighters in his stable he sees them as dispensible for the right price. Its all about the next big event. Giving guys huge oppertunities. But cant agree putting golvokin in with brook is a decent decision in anyway. Especially when you consider kells a champion in his own right. No matter how you look at it...hes short changing someone. Weather its kell or the fans paying 15 quid. Not fair on the fans in that when he gets in trouble the towel gets waved in or kell cause hes fighting someone he pretty much cant beat. Should have paid the money out got a 147 fighter in and built brook towards a big event against a fight he at least had a chance in.

Now looks like hes gonna use kell as just a moneymaker. Canelo will be too strong for brook. 147 looks off the agenda. He could have beaten vargas. Garcia. Khan maybe etc and went down as a british great making good money on the way. I dont think brook will get back on track from here tbh. Will be stuck between divisions.

Hes sacrificed brook at the expense of his events and money. Dangerous fight. Should never have been made just like the khan canelo fight. All for putting champions in to tough fights but not in a fight they cant win. Also not from frankie gavin to golvokin either. Build them. At least work towards the fights.

I wouldnt join matchroom if i was a young boxer coming through...you d be paid well. But he ll sacrifice you for an event if need be. I dont think he has the same judgement as wa rren just thinks if he gives a big inspirational speech it ll be enough to see the fighter through.

I can write a lot of good things about eddie also tbf...but cant agree with that decision to stick him in with golovkin.

I still think it's pretty unfair to criticise. They've been trying to match Brook with big WW fights for a while now, and it sounds like pulling teeth. Agree that these fights need to be made, but what do you do when the guy on the other side is demanding the lions share when he's the challenger? I still don't understand why Khan is ducking the Brook fight. It seems like such an obvious fight to make. Khan claims that Brook is not a 'big enough star' to challenge him. He demands a 80:20 split in his favour. What has Brook got to do to win a little bit of respect? He was up until the GGG fight an unbeaten world champ. Now Khan is talking about rematching Danny Garcia!

[Anzi]

I think the eye damage influenced Dominic Ingle's decision, though he was under the cosh in the last round, Brook was taking the shots well, but the eye would of got worse, so Dominic Ingle was spot on, he would not have stopped it in that round, if it was not for the damaged eye, Brook was having some success in the fight.

Yes mate agree with that the eye was a game changer if it was any other body part Ingle might have let it go but getting double vision is scary would have been so sad if the Blackwell scenario occured with Kell

It would have been terrible if anything worse would have happened to Kell.

[Pugilist-specialist]

Funny thing is ......one of the posters on here who knocking Kell boxed with a hand injury can't remember if it was broken or not and got thrown out for not trying.....

Sad isn't it!
Someone with a 0-19 record sees a young kid from the same gym develop and then he posts on here that he'll never be a world champion. No praise for the kid when he wins a world title and now he's lost for the first time in 37, against a murderous puncher from 2 weight divisions above, he's back on his keyboard again!

[rhino222]

I think it was a perfect stoppage. some people have said preplanned, and I think I know where they are coming from.

It was the correct type of fight that Brook had to do, I initially thought he would play defensive and try to last him out but with what I have seen of GGG (never seen him fight before) he is quite impressive. Defensive boxing would have not done Brook and good at all. He went all out for a knock out and gave 3 or 4 really good rounds. Just could not land a punch that put GGG on his back.

After the 3rd it was clear Brook had something wrong, my wife was wanting the stoppage then as she was thinking of McClellan, to be honest it was in the back of my mind too. I think after the 3rd the writing was on the wall and it was just a matter of time.

I can see where people thought 'pre-planned' and I would imagine tactics was go hell for leather while you can but as soon as you get into trouble and cant give back or tire out we are done. No point in getting your self perminantly hurt.

Ingle could have thrown the towel at the ref but I would imagine he was waving it aournd and had more thought in his head getting the refs attention.

It was perfect and the right time.

you let your wife watch it? from the kitchen i hope. serving hatch?

[Pugilist-specialist]

Perfectly timed stoppage. I agree with those who say it was pre-planned. Brook was never going out on his shield and Ingle saved him for another day. People can say what they want about Amir Khan, but he does go out on his shield and always boxes to win (not just put up a show).

Does he keep his shield on a stretcher?

[Pugilist-specialist]

Oh yes, in a similar situation I'd presumably have soiled myself publicly and started crying, so not criticising Brook at all, but I was surprised at how such an experienced fighter could make such a show of his distress.

He was dabbing at it and pulling faces in round 2 and then came storming back to win the round.

I've said in multiple posts how astounded I was by his attacks, but regarding the injury as I recall he was making a show of his concern regarding it in every round. Have I misremembered the fight? Will watch it again tonight I'm sure.

Kell claimed he was touching the eye to re-focus it, but then Golovkin would hit him on it again!

[Pugilist-specialist]

I could give Dom stick for allowing the fight in the first place, but that's for another thread.

Dom is his trainer not manager.

[Rob3_142]

Letting the mask slip only makes the night harder. I remember Foreman raging over Bowe lying down every time Golota hit him in the balls. His attitude was you absorb all pain and show your opponent nothing. Again, Tucker had his orbital bone shattered vs Seldon and carried himself as if walking to the shop for a paper. I don't mean to criticise Brook, his challenge was wonderful, I just feel his registering his injury so graphically possibly made his night worse. Cerdan went on against LaMotta with a broken arm! I just wonder if so much soft match making ultimately robs a potentially great talent of the classic boxing mental tricks necessary to wriggle through the rocky fights.

Wriggle through the rocky fights? He was fighting GGG, arguably one of the greatest of all time, and the absolute best of a generation. He broke his cheekbone in the second round, and according to the scorecards was ahead up until the 5th round. You don't mean to criticise Brook, but you are, unfairly. It seems to me that you haven't experienced high level competition, and ever an injury during.

Bloody hell. Must everyone here have their orbital crushed before they can proffer opinion? I've got opinions on politics too, though have never ran a country myself. You cheaply bestow the tag "one of the greatest of all time" on a fighter who hasn't beaten one single A-class fighter. It seems to me that you aren't too historically literate boxing-wise, but we allow you an opinion.

You're talking about an instinctive action of him clutching his face when part of his skull is shattered. Politics is an incredibly subjective subject, where there is always conjecture. We're talking about something pretty cut and dry here.

As far as GGG's pedigree goes, I think my comments are pretty fair. Agreed I'd have liked to see him in the ring with some more A-class fighters, but who wouldn't? Considering the likes of Canelo would rather vacate his WBC belt than share a ring with him. It's pretty well documented that he's one of the world's most avoided fighters. Never knocked off his feet in 375 fights and the highest KO rate in middleweight history (which includes his last 23). There's a very good argument for his place as one of the best ever, I just hope he gets the chance to prove it before it's too late.

[Switch hitter]

Funny thing is ......one of the posters on here who knocking Kell boxed with a hand injury can't remember if it was broken or not and got thrown out for not trying.....

Sad isn't it!
Someone with a 0-19 record sees a young kid from the same gym develop and then he posts on here that he'll never be a world champion. No praise for the kid when he wins a world title and now he's lost for the first time in 37, against a murderous puncher from 2 weight divisions above, he's back on his keyboard again!

[TheGman]

Brook said he seen 4-5 GGG's said his eye socket had gone but then said he didnt punch that hard haha. Dom was right to wave the white flag,brook was looking for a way out i thought then when he seen the towel getting waved decided he wants to throw punches,good job by dom

[kbackup408]

Brook said he seen 4-5 GGG's said his eye socket had gone but then said he didnt punch that hard haha. Dom was right to wave the white flag,brook was looking for a way out i thought then when he seen the towel getting waved decided he wants to throw punches,good job by dom

At the end of the day, Dom has done something Kell will appreciate maybe 5/6 years down the line, when Kell looks back in his career sure he would have some regret but the fact he can still potentially get some huge pay days it will help soften the blow

[Teddy's Toupee]

Funny thing is ......one of the posters on here who knocking Kell boxed with a hand injury can't remember if it was broken or not and got thrown out for not trying.....

Sad isn't it!
Someone with a 0-19 record sees a young kid from the same gym develop and then he posts on here that he'll never be a world champion. No praise for the kid when he wins a world title and now he's lost for the first time in 37, against a murderous puncher from 2 weight divisions above, he's back on his keyboard again!

It was broken, four days before I got in the ring. The lad I was in with was the number ten middleweight in the country and I took the fight at 24 hours notice although I'd not been in the gym for four or five weeks. I wasn't thrown out, the ref stopped the fight at the end of the fifth. I don't remember pulling any faces, or waving my hand around and I took my lumps with a poker face. If you're suggesting I'm hiding behind my keyboard, Chris, just say so. Kell's a world class fighter and I agree with littlepug that you shouldn't let your opponent know that an injury is bothering you. The matchup was a cynical one. Any reasonable person would take the view that both Dominic and Kell didn't honestly believe he had a realistic chance of winning and the large purse on offer, along with the fact that his world title at welterweight wouldn't be affected by the outcome, was the major motivating factor in taking the bout.