Oh deary me.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 28 Feb 2006, 19:56

After seeing him in Clinton Woods' corner for the first Johnson match, I really did think Terrible Tim Witherspoon looked very contented as a coach (if albeit not a particularly convincing one) - I thought his money issues were behind him and he was one fighter who I thought we'd seen the last of.

Wrong.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=000432

dve3333 · Post by **dve3333** » 28 Feb 2006, 20:07

48 years old

:( Bloody hell its things like this after watching a quality fight like Mosley-Vargas that you realise how murky Boxing can be.
But as its on the same bill as his son and in their hometown hopefully its just some sort of farewell

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 01 Mar 2006, 12:51

Christ, Tim already talks like he's got a mouthful of marbles... does he want to end up like Greg Page??...

mattyp151 · Post by **mattyp151** » 01 Mar 2006, 13:01

silkov wrote:Christ, Tim already talks like he's got a mouthful of marbles... does he want to end up like Greg Page??...

well, the fight is in 2 weeks approx, and he still doesn't have an opponent, you think he's gonna fight anyone above a corpse?

Coconut · Post by **Coconut** » 01 Mar 2006, 13:09

Corpse To Fight Tim With A Spoon

I'd read that preview

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 01 Mar 2006, 14:17

silkov wrote:Christ, Tim already talks like he's got a mouthful of marbles... does he want to end up like Greg Page??...

I spoke to him a few weeks ago. He was fine.

I wish he didn't have to fight - he's skint, I believe.

Shirow · Post by **Shirow** » 01 Mar 2006, 14:24

That's a crying shame. Awful to think of the humiliating defeats he's going to have to pursue before he feels he can retire again.

It's the 20th anniversary of his KO of Bruno too this year. Puts in all in perspective.

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 01 Mar 2006, 14:56

Shirow wrote:That's a crying shame. Awful to think of the humiliating defeats he's going to have to pursue before he feels he can retire again.

It's the 20th anniversary of his KO of Bruno too this year. Puts in all in perspective.

F ucking hell. That does make you think. Damn shame. One of the most underrated heavys of the last 30 years.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 01 Mar 2006, 15:19

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:
silkov wrote:Christ, Tim already talks like he's got a mouthful of marbles... does he want to end up like Greg Page??...
I spoke to him a few weeks ago. He was fine.

I wish he didn't have to fight - he's skint, I believe.

Seems to speak with a lisp from when I've seen recently... still seems very sharp but how long will that last if he continues to fight again?... these are big guys throwing big punches, even a journeyman heavyweight will carry some punch... hope he doesn't pursue a full career...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 01 Mar 2006, 15:20

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:
Shirow wrote:That's a crying shame. Awful to think of the humiliating defeats he's going to have to pursue before he feels he can retire again.

It's the 20th anniversary of his KO of Bruno too this year. Puts in all in perspective.
F ucking hell. That does make you think. Damn shame. One of the most underrated heavys of the last 30 years.

Tyson never went anywhere near him in the 80s or even 90s...

Steudle · Post by **Steudle** » 02 Mar 2006, 00:47

Maybe he wants to fight on the same card with his son then get out??

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 02 Mar 2006, 03:43

Steudle wrote:Maybe he wants to fight on the same card with his son then get out??

Yes, I hadn't thought of that. Good idea. Let's hope so.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 02 Mar 2006, 03:51

he should think of what happened to greg page

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 02 Mar 2006, 06:00

Fortunately for Witherspoon he's not one of those guys who got hit a lot in his career. If he takes part in some low level fights he probably knows how to cover up enough not to take a beating.

As Ian said, he sounds fine when he speaks, he's just got a bit of a drawl because of his accent. The only time I remember him getting battered was against Bonecrusher Smith and that was all over pretty quick.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 02 Mar 2006, 08:07

yeah he did have a good defense. shame he never got it together 100% as he looked superb in that war with Larry Holmes in 1983. if he'd have been disciplined who knows what he would have achieved - my guess is he wouldn't be coming back now

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 02 Mar 2006, 08:17

His contractual dispute with Don King wrecked his career. Think he's on record as saying that he didn't train for the bonecrusher Smith fight and was totally demoralised coming into the fight.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 02 Mar 2006, 09:45

I have to say that i always thought Witherspoon was overrated, he was a good fighter, but the way people talk about him is as if he was a great one.

I keep on hearing that he was unmotivated against Bonecrusher Smith, but thats his fault , very good fighters still win those fights, and usually when someone is undertrained they don't get blasted in the 1st round they would get stopped late on. I think he just got caught and was stopped fair and square.

As a person i have respect for him , for standing up against King , that probably cost him another title shot.
I don't think that he would have beat Tyson though.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 02 Mar 2006, 10:06

Yep, good points. Witherspoon was a very good fighter, but he wasn't a great one. Tyson would have knocked seven bells of shit out of him if Witherspoon had gotten past Smith.

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 02 Mar 2006, 10:11

I think a well motivated Spoon would have been Tyson's hardest fight of the 80's easy

good jab skills and power and I can't see him being intimidated the way a lot of Mike's opponents were

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 02 Mar 2006, 10:53

Don't think he would have been able to do what Douglas did though. Douglas was a big powerful guy and had good movement and skills, his problem was motivation.

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 02 Mar 2006, 11:07

topper123 wrote:I have to say that i always thought Witherspoon was overrated, he was a good fighter, but the way people talk about him is as if he was a great one.

I keep on hearing that he was unmotivated against Bonecrusher Smith, but thats his fault

These aren't great points, whatsoever IMO. The guy was desperately underrated - a plain fornicating scandal to say the opposite. It isn't really 'people' who talk about him as if he was a great one - just the odd few like me who always trumpet his cause.

In only his sixteenth fight he gave all-time great Larry Holmes, then 42-0, absolute nightmares and dropped a split.

I love this "it was his fault" shit. You have absolutely no idea what was going on behind the scenes - or if you do, you are incredibly lacking in understanding/sympathy.

However, definitely some good points in the second half of your post - I give him more respect than almost anyone else for having the dignity to tell King to go to hell, which definitely ruined his career.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 02 Mar 2006, 11:34

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:
topper123 wrote:I have to say that i always thought Witherspoon was overrated, he was a good fighter, but the way people talk about him is as if he was a great one.

I keep on hearing that he was unmotivated against Bonecrusher Smith, but thats his fault
These aren't great points, whatsoever. The guy was desperately underrated - a plain fornicating scandal to say the opposite. It isn't really 'people' who talk about him as if he was a great one - just the odd few like me who always trumpet his cause.

In only his sixteenth fight he gave all-time great Larry Holmes, then 42-0, absolute nightmares and dropped a split.

I love this "it was his fault" shit. You have absolutely no idea what was going on behind the scenes - or if you do, you are incredibly lacking in understanding/sympathy.

However, you do make some good points in the second half of your post - I give him more respect than almost anyone else for having the dignity to tell King to go to hell, which definitely ruined his career.

King may have ripped him off , but who got him the title shot after only 15 fights, King.

Witherspoon didn't have a gun stuck to his head to sign the contracts to King, at some point he has to hold his hands up and say he was enticed by the wad of cash that King held in front of him. Thats what cost him getting propaly paid after the Bruno fight.

And it was completly wrong by King what he did, but Witherspoon should have checked the contract to see what he was signing.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 02 Mar 2006, 11:46

topper123 wrote:
Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:
topper123 wrote:I have to say that i always thought Witherspoon was overrated, he was a good fighter, but the way people talk about him is as if he was a great one.

I keep on hearing that he was unmotivated against Bonecrusher Smith, but thats his fault
These aren't great points, whatsoever. The guy was desperately underrated - a plain fornicating scandal to say the opposite. It isn't really 'people' who talk about him as if he was a great one - just the odd few like me who always trumpet his cause.

In only his sixteenth fight he gave all-time great Larry Holmes, then 42-0, absolute nightmares and dropped a split.

I love this "it was his fault" shit. You have absolutely no idea what was going on behind the scenes - or if you do, you are incredibly lacking in understanding/sympathy.

However, you do make some good points in the second half of your post - I give him more respect than almost anyone else for having the dignity to tell King to go to hell, which definitely ruined his career.
King may have ripped him off , but who got him the title shot after only 15 fights, King.

Witherspoon didn't have a gun stuck to his head to sign the contracts to King, at some point he has to hold his hands up and say he was enticed by the wad of cash that King held in front of him. Thats what cost him getting propaly paid after the Bruno fight.

And it was completly wrong by King what he did, but Witherspoon should have checked the contract to see what he was signing.

You need to read up on what King used to do. He'd get a boxer to sign something without them reading the contract, its an old trick and he did it to many... his top fighters would be sharing gum sheilds and trunks in training etc and they often never saw money that they were supposed to be fighting for. To not sympathise for a young guy who was swindled by a very very streetwise man many years older than him is rather harsh... I imagine that at one point Witherspoon like many other fighters trusted King and by the time he realised what was going on it was too late...

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 02 Mar 2006, 12:02

What was Bruno like with Witherspoon before he ran out of gas?

Was it like with Bonecrusher?

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 02 Mar 2006, 12:08

Bruno was winning on points, although Witherspoon was having his moments Frank was definetly on top. I believe Mr McNeilly covered it in his FISTORY article some time ago, it wasn't quite out of nowhere was it Ian, Bruno began to slow a bit and Witherspoon timed him with a big shot.