WBU Middleweight title

[Flump]

It goes to show how devalued boxing "world" titles have become if we are seriously discussing whether Lee Churcher has the right to call himself a world champion. I suppose that in a world where we are asked to say what sex we perceive ourself to be then anything is acceptable.

But he's a world champion in his league there is nothing wrong with that. Holding world titles became devalued in terms many many years ago.

The problem I have with this is that it will be billed as a world title fight to an unsuspecting public and if they don't know better will go away thinking they've watched a world title fight when in reality it is nothing of the sort. It's this sort of nonsense and conning of the public that has been pushing boxing into the margins for years. I remember Joe Bugner was on I'm A Celebrity years ago and was being referred to as the oldest man to win the world heavyweight title because he held the WBF title, I felt like smashing my own telly in.

[magwitch]

That title has about as much value as Charlie Z`s homemade belt.

I disagree. I think Ricky Hatton legitimized the WBU belt. I believe the fighter makes the belt, and not vice-versa.
I remember seeing a really excellent 12 rounder on an ice-rink between Michael Hunter and Frankie De Milo for the lightly regarded WBF belt. The belt’s not much to shout about - but the fight was brilliant. Hunter said on here that for the people of Hartlepool it was a world title fight, and he was dead right when I think about it.
Of course 3 years later the IBF belt also rolled into town. Good fighters do still compete for “lesser” belts.

he didn't legitimize it he just used it as a tool to get certain level fighters over here for seasoning

He was a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone. If it was good enough for Hatton, it’s good enough for anyone. Nothing to stop other boxers from attempting to surf that wave.

[Mimmy]

It goes to show how devalued boxing "world" titles have become if we are seriously discussing whether Lee Churcher has the right to call himself a world champion. I suppose that in a world where we are asked to say what sex we perceive ourself to be then anything is acceptable.

But he's a world champion in his league there is nothing wrong with that. Holding world titles became devalued in terms many many years ago.

The problem I have with this is that it will be billed as a world title fight to an unsuspecting public and if they don't know better will go away thinking they've watched a world title fight when in reality it is nothing of the sort. It's this sort of nonsense and conning of the public that has been pushing boxing into the margins for years. I remember Joe Bugner was on I'm A Celebrity years ago and was being referred to as the oldest man to win the world heavyweight title because he held the WBF title, I felt like smashing my own telly in.

I dont agree with that at all, for 1 The WBU title would have been on a MBC show, tickets for a kick off would be very reasonable at around £15 -20 ring side seat. I would imagine the majority of the fans would be family and friends, and friends of friends. I would not imagine you would get anyone stumbling in to thinking they are going to be watching a grade 1 boxing show. Everyone watching would appreciate that the shows contestnats are either ex-pro boxers who are plying their trade at a lower lever. The fights will proberly be more competetive too. Ive never been to a MBC show but have watched some live on FB. I dont think for 1 minute that spectators are thinking they are watching the future undisputed champions. Far from it.

[bripez]

I agree with Mimmy - reading the link the lad says that he isn't claiming to be anything that he isn't.

I don't know why so many people get so excited - if you happen to be walking past your local leisure centre and pay £20 to watch a (hopefully reasonably evenly matched) boxing show, then I am sure not many people would be thinking they are watching Floyd Mayweathers next opponent.

If such a title allows a boxer a bit of recognition in his local community, gives him the opportunity of more regular fights and maybe even earns him a few quid then I cant see the problem.

[SAPFO]

Ricky Hatton, George Foreman, Thomas Hearns, James Toney, Johnny Nelson, Micky Ward all won the WBU (shamelessly pasted from Wiki)

A recent example that comes to my mind of a solid British level operating fighter who won the WBU would be former middleweight Wayne Elcock.

[littlepug]

I disagree. I think Ricky Hatton legitimized the WBU belt. I believe the fighter makes the belt, and not vice-versa.
I remember seeing a really excellent 12 rounder on an ice-rink between Michael Hunter and Frankie De Milo for the lightly regarded WBF belt. The belt’s not much to shout about - but the fight was brilliant. Hunter said on here that for the people of Hartlepool it was a world title fight, and he was dead right when I think about it.
Of course 3 years later the IBF belt also rolled into town. Good fighters do still compete for “lesser” belts.

he didn't legitimize it he just used it as a tool to get certain level fighters over here for seasoning

He was a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone. If it was good enough for Hatton, it’s good enough for anyone. Nothing to stop other boxers from attempting to surf that wave.

he BECAME a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone because of the seasoning he got from the fighters he boxed for the WBU

[magwitch]

he didn't legitimize it he just used it as a tool to get certain level fighters over here for seasoning

He was a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone. If it was good enough for Hatton, it’s good enough for anyone. Nothing to stop other boxers from attempting to surf that wave.

he BECAME a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone because of the seasoning he got from the fighters he boxed for the WBU

So it worked. It was a good thing for him. Boxing as well as fanbase-building. I wouldn’t expect a 20-21yr old English lad to be already seasoned. Maybe in Mexico and Argentina and a few other places where they mature earlier, but not Manchester. Of course he needed seasoning - but Hatton was still in the top bracket at every stage of his development.

[magwitch]

He was a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone. If it was good enough for Hatton, it’s good enough for anyone. Nothing to stop other boxers from attempting to surf that wave.

he BECAME a bona-fide operator that could fight anyone because of the seasoning he got from the fighters he boxed for the WBU

So it worked. It was a good thing for him. Boxing as well as fanbase-building. I wouldn’t expect a 20-21yr old English lad to be already seasoned. Maybe in Mexico and Argentina and a few other places where they mature earlier, but not Manchester. Of course he needed seasoning - but Hatton was still in the top bracket at every stage of his development - for his age/ number of fights, I mean.

[questionmore]

But he's a world champion in his league there is nothing wrong with that. Holding world titles became devalued in terms many many years ago.

The problem I have with this is that it will be billed as a world title fight to an unsuspecting public and if they don't know better will go away thinking they've watched a world title fight when in reality it is nothing of the sort. It's this sort of nonsense and conning of the public that has been pushing boxing into the margins for years. I remember Joe Bugner was on I'm A Celebrity years ago and was being referred to as the oldest man to win the world heavyweight title because he held the WBF title, I felt like smashing my own telly in.

I dont agree with that at all, for 1 The WBU title would have been on a MBC show, tickets for a kick off would be very reasonable at around £15 -20 ring side seat. I would imagine the majority of the fans would be family and friends, and friends of friends. I would not imagine you would get anyone stumbling in to thinking they are going to be watching a grade 1 boxing show. Everyone watching would appreciate that the shows contestnats are either ex-pro boxers who are plying their trade at a lower lever. The fights will proberly be more competetive too. Ive never been to a MBC show but have watched some live on FB. I dont think for 1 minute that spectators are thinking they are watching the future undisputed champions. Far from it.

I think the problem is that the boxing savy won't be fooled by some cloned bona fide title. If the target audience is friends & family etc and the prestige is holding a world title belt regardless of its preceding capitol letters. Then let them fight for a MBC or BIBA world title belt and be done with it. Then grandfather's, father's, son's, daughters can go home and sleep with the belt proud in the knowledge he's a world champion. So it's a lot less likely to undermine anyone & everyone's happy ?

[leejonesjnr]

I don't really have a problem with boxers contesting any title they can and in the case of BIBA/MBC boxers there aren't really any 'proper' titles up for grabs at the moment. I do think however that nonsense World Championships would be better avoided, especially with the many many many many many belts that BIBA/MBC can use instead. Also worth noting is that this is not the WBU of old and actually, before the contest happened the organisation withdrew recognition of BIBA/MBC, so I don't really know where that leaves things.

[questionmore]

I don't really have a problem with boxers contesting any title they can and in the case of BIBA/MBC boxers there aren't really any 'proper' titles up for grabs at the moment. I do think however that nonsense World Championships would be better avoided, especially with the many many many many many belts that BIBA/MBC can use instead. Also worth noting is that this is not the WBU of old and actually, before the contest happened the organisation withdrew recognition of BIBA/MBC, so I don't really know where that leaves things.

Cloned