Wilder v Povetkin - who's dirty?

[asdfjkl]

Could you please provide some evidence, or a link to a reputable source which explains that he only had 1/14th of a microgram in his system, please?

70 nanogram is close near 1/14th of a microgram... So kalan is right. And please don't tell me you seriously didn't know this

Know what? I just asked for some supporting evidence. I just want to know where this evidence came from.

It's all over the place, just google it.

[asdfjkl]

Could you please provide some evidence, or a link to a reputable source which explains that he only had 1/14th of a microgram in his system, please?

70 nanogram is close near 1/14th of a microgram... So kalan is right. And please don't tell me you seriously didn't know this

I love when Russians play innocent ;) You can defend Povetkin how do you want. Russians are the most know cheaters in the sport. https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/ ... g-olympics

That's because the American media spreads it everywere and other media just copy paste it, it's not like it comes any way close near reality.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

The guardian? Lol at that source. Though I did read on ESPN that the Russians have admitted to an unprecedented doping and cover up program for their Olympic program.

[Badhusker]

This topic is about as lame as the many Ward vs Kovalev ones.
I'm done with both.

[Rob3_142]

70 nanogram is close near 1/14th of a microgram... So kalan is right. And please don't tell me you seriously didn't know this

Know what? I just asked for some supporting evidence. I just want to know where this evidence came from.

It's all over the place, just google it.

I have Googled it, and all I get is statements from Ryabinsky that it was only 0.00000000001g of Ostarine found in the sample, and that the other 4 samples came back negative.

Problem with this is as follows;

1) Ryabinsky sharing levels is not sufficient as a source.
2) Testing positive any amount is still a failed result (unless there is otherwise a known threshold).
3) In any other sport, this would result in an immediate ban (pending the B sample).
4) Obviously they're going to deny any wrongdoing and 'accidental ingestion'. How many athletes own up straight away?

There is two outcomes here. He's tested positive and he will be banned for around two years. Or there is contamination, which will be verified by the B sample, and the conviction will be rescinded (which I believe will be followed by a libel case).

Sounds like they already knew the positive test was going to come through as they had a pretty swift replacement. Apparently Stiverne was informed of a replacement if the fight didn't go ahead on the Tuesday of that week.

[asdfjkl]

Know what? I just asked for some supporting evidence. I just want to know where this evidence came from.

It's all over the place, just google it.

I have Googled it, and all I get is statements from Ryabinsky that it was only 0.00000000001g of Ostarine found in the sample, and that the other 4 samples came back negative.
Problem with this is as follows;

1) Ryabinsky sharing levels is not sufficient as a source.
2) Testing positive any amount is still a failed result (unless there is otherwise a known threshold).
3) In any other sport, this would result in an immediate ban (pending the B sample).
4) Obviously they're going to deny any wrongdoing and 'accidental ingestion'. How many athletes own up straight away?

There is two outcomes here. He's tested positive and he will be banned for around two years. Or there is contamination, which will be verified by the B sample, and the conviction will be rescinded (which I believe will be followed by a libel case).

Sounds like they already knew the positive test was going to come through as they had a pretty swift replacement. Apparently Stiverne was informed of a replacement if the fight didn't go ahead on the Tuesday of that week.

You do realise we spoke about the meldonium situation? Where Povetkin was wrongly accused of some wrongdoing? This is basically a different version of the same story, I wonder if the B-sample will proof him to be innocent again.

[Rob3_142]

It's all over the place, just google it.

I have Googled it, and all I get is statements from Ryabinsky that it was only 0.00000000001g of Ostarine found in the sample, and that the other 4 samples came back negative.
Problem with this is as follows;

1) Ryabinsky sharing levels is not sufficient as a source.
2) Testing positive any amount is still a failed result (unless there is otherwise a known threshold).
3) In any other sport, this would result in an immediate ban (pending the B sample).
4) Obviously they're going to deny any wrongdoing and 'accidental ingestion'. How many athletes own up straight away?

There is two outcomes here. He's tested positive and he will be banned for around two years. Or there is contamination, which will be verified by the B sample, and the conviction will be rescinded (which I believe will be followed by a libel case).

Sounds like they already knew the positive test was going to come through as they had a pretty swift replacement. Apparently Stiverne was informed of a replacement if the fight didn't go ahead on the Tuesday of that week.

You do realise we spoke about the meldonium situation? Where Povetkin was wrongly accused of some wrongdoing? This is basically a different version of the same story, I wonder if the B-sample will proof him to be innocent again.

Well I'm far from satisfied from the Melodonium situation either, and the circumstances are not the same. But I too will be looking forward to the B sample.

[asdfjkl]

I have Googled it, and all I get is statements from Ryabinsky that it was only 0.00000000001g of Ostarine found in the sample, and that the other 4 samples came back negative.
Problem with this is as follows;

1) Ryabinsky sharing levels is not sufficient as a source.
2) Testing positive any amount is still a failed result (unless there is otherwise a known threshold).
3) In any other sport, this would result in an immediate ban (pending the B sample).
4) Obviously they're going to deny any wrongdoing and 'accidental ingestion'. How many athletes own up straight away?

There is two outcomes here. He's tested positive and he will be banned for around two years. Or there is contamination, which will be verified by the B sample, and the conviction will be rescinded (which I believe will be followed by a libel case).

Sounds like they already knew the positive test was going to come through as they had a pretty swift replacement. Apparently Stiverne was informed of a replacement if the fight didn't go ahead on the Tuesday of that week.

You do realise we spoke about the meldonium situation? Where Povetkin was wrongly accused of some wrongdoing? This is basically a different version of the same story, I wonder if the B-sample will proof him to be innocent again.

Well I'm far from satisfied from the Melodonium situation either, and the circumstances are not the same. But I too will be looking forward to the B sample.

There was 70 nanogram of meldonium, which was like 1/14th of a microgram, which was left from 2015. This new test was expected to be something similar and the 10 0's seem to be more and more in Povetkin and his team their advantage, I couldn't catch them on any lie so far.

[Badhusker]

Can someone post the % of the drug Ostarine that Bute and Browne also got caught with? As far as I know it doesn't matter how much of a banned drug you have in your system. If they let Povetkin off, I guess they should let the other two off too?

[Kalan]

It matters how much of a drug is in your system... 1 nanogram is probably due to using a contaminated test tube that wasn't washed thoroughly. VADA has been known to get false positives and come up with crappy data about their tests... There the most unprofessional group in existence -- and they're mixed up with convicted and imprisoned PED pusher Victor Conte, who's a total low life.

[Kalan]

VADA doesn't release the date about the concentration of a PED found in a boxer's sample... This is one reason they're not to be trusted... They can and do use innuendo to smear a foreign boxer's reputation -- when he indeed passed his tests with flying colors.. An extremely low concentration of a drug is not going to assist anyone athletically -- and would defeat any purpose in taking it.

[Badhusker]

VADA doesn't release the date about the concentration of a PED found in a boxer's sample[/b]... This is one reason they're not to be trusted... They can and do use innuendo to smear a foreign boxer's reputation -- when he indeed passed his tests with flying colors.. An extremely low concentration of a drug is not going to assist anyone athletically -- and would defeat any purpose in taking it.

Doesn't release the date about the concentration or did you mean the % or amount? Regardless if you meant they don't release concentration amounts how do we know what Povetkin's was for Ostarine?

By the way, if cycled properly, and with the extremely low half life's of some drugs, we don't know how much it would assist someone athletically. That is why there is no recourse if any amount is detected in their system.

[Rob3_142]

VADA doesn't release the date about the concentration of a PED found in a boxer's sample[/b]... This is one reason they're not to be trusted... They can and do use innuendo to smear a foreign boxer's reputation -- when he indeed passed his tests with flying colors.. An extremely low concentration of a drug is not going to assist anyone athletically -- and would defeat any purpose in taking it.

Doesn't release the date about the concentration or did you mean the % or amount? Regardless if you meant they don't release concentration amounts how do we know what Povetkin's was for Ostarine?

By the way, if cycled properly, and with the extremely low half life's of some drugs, we don't know how much it would assist someone athletically. That is why there is no recourse if any amount is detected in their system.

This is it. If you're finding traces of the drug in the system anyway, regardless of the concentration, it's an indication that there could have been a higher dose earlier. The only question is, how many tests, and in what proximity to the failed test were there? If this is test number 3 of 4, and the 4th was a positive test, and the others negative, it does raise a question of contamination. That said, I don't know how many tests were done when.

[Kalan]

VADA knew damned well that the cut off point was 1 microgram of Meldonium (i.e. 1 millionth of a gram of Meldonium) which could still be detectable in an athlete who stopped taking the normal dosage when the coming ban was announced. Tennis player Maria Sharapova had well over that amount and failed her test. Alexander Povetkin had LESS than 1/14th that amount in his sample... He very easily PASSED the test.

From the guidelines issued by WADA, VADA knew Povetkin passed his test... but they preferred to smear his reputation with innuendo, and destroy the Wilder-Povetkin fight -- because Ryabinsky legitimately outbid American promoters for the fight and wanted to stage the fight in Russia, which was his privilege. Losing this lucrative Heavyweight Championship Fight pissed American promoters off to no end. Never fear. The fight and Ryabinsky's promotion were destroyed by VADA and their pals at the WBC... The V in VADA stands for VOLUNTARY... VADA conspired with the WBC to make their testing MANDATORY for all WBC Title Fights...

A WBC boxer doesn't have the option of choosing a more professional and honest, accredited testing agency. They're forced to use the gang who's involved with ex-con PED distributor Victor Conte, who was sent to prison after his athletes have repeated failed PED tests -- after Conte assured them that everything they took was legal and they would pass any PED test... One of the athletes who sued Conte was Shane Mosley. They settled out of court for an undisclosed sum and the agreement was confidential -- as these settlements often are -- Mosley can't talk about it.

[Rob3_142]

VADA knew damned well that the cut off point was 1 microgram of Meldonium (i.e. 1 millionth of a gram of Meldonium) which could still be detectable in an athlete who stopped taking the normal dosage when the coming ban was announced. Tennis player Maria Sharapova had well over that amount and failed her test. Alexander Povetkin had LESS than 1/14th that amount in his sample... He very easily PASSED the test.

You don't need to keep writing that, we all know what a microgram is. How much Melodonium did Maria Sharapova have in her system?

From the guidelines issued by WADA, VADA knew Povetkin passed his test... but they preferred to smear his reputation with innuendo, and destroy the Wilder-Povetkin fight -- because Ryabinsky legitimately outbid American promoters for the fight and wanted to stage the fight in Russia, which was his privilege. Losing this lucrative Heavyweight Championship Fight pissed American promoters off to no end. Never fear. The fight and Ryabinsky's promotion were destroyed by VADA and their pals at the WBC... The V in VADA stands for VOLUNTARY... VADA conspired with the WBC to make their testing MANDATORY for all WBC Title Fights...

So you think that the WBC twice conceded two sets of sanctioning fees, they way they make their money, just to get one over on the Russian's?

[Kalan]

The WBC makes money whenever Deontay Wilder fights -- no matter how soft his opponent is... They want him to keep the title, fight soft opponents, fight often, and keep paying them... It's in their interest to have the World Champion under their control... Wilder has sent them gifts and gratuities to keep them happy.

They also have their good buddies at VADA to share in the booty of the drug testing bonanza... VADA is helping keep this American Heavyweight Champion under their sphere of influence... Wilder gets to fight who he wants when he wants – but they do have to come up with mandatory challengers to present the appearance of fairness. They can get rid of troublesome ones who are a threat to KO Wilder and help rich and thankful American promotors at the same time.

[Badhusker]

Kalan,

You keep spewing the same bullshit about the drug Povetkin got caught with for the Wilder fight. Ok, he had it in his system but was under the allowable limit. We all get that.

How about the recent dirty test with Ostarine? You seem to avoid that, along with my previous question about what concentration Bute or Browne had. If no one has any idea what Bute or Browne had, we have no idea what Povetkin had.

[Kalan]

Kalan,

You keep spewing the same bullshit about the drug Povetkin got caught with for the Wilder fight. Ok, he had it in his system but was under the allowable limit. We all get that.

How about the recent dirty test with Ostarine? You seem to avoid that, along with my previous question about what concentration Bute or Browne had. If no one has any idea what Bute or Browne had, we have no idea what Povetkin had.

Are you joking???? You're the guy spewing BS... Povetkin didn't get caught for ANYTHING before the Wilder fight.. He was WAY under the allowable concentration, which means you pass the test... They inferred to the world that he DIDN'T pass which was BULLCRAP

VADA absolutely KNEW Povetkin was WAY in the clear on all his PED tests for Wilder... Yet they chose to smear Povetkin's reputation and destroy Ryabinsky's promotion.. After that smear job, WHY would you trust them when all of Povetkin's tests came up negative for Stiverne for months... and then 20 hours before the fight they smear him again for an unbelievably small trace of a drug that was legal for decades, and is not a steroid.. Again they DIDN'T announce the extremely small concentration that was in Povetkin's sample, just said he was "positive" ... I think they contaminated his sample because Povetkin said he never took Ostarine... Bute and Browne said the same thing... Stiverne ADMITTED to taking methylhexaneamine and had a good amount of that banned PED in his sample that was performance enhancing -- but VADA let him slide and let the fight go forward.

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

[Badhusker]

Kalan,

You keep spewing the same bullshit about the drug Povetkin got caught with for the Wilder fight. Ok, he had it in his system but was under the allowable limit. We all get that.

How about the recent dirty test with Ostarine? You seem to avoid that, along with my previous question about what concentration Bute or Browne had. If no one has any idea what Bute or Browne had, we have no idea what Povetkin had.

Are you joking???? You're the guy spewing BS... Povetkin didn't get caught for ANYTHING before the Wilder fight.. He was WAY under the allowable concentration, which means you pass the test... They inferred to the world that he DIDN'T pass which was BULLCRAP

VADA absolutely KNEW Povetkin was WAY in the clear on all his PED tests for Wilder... Yet they chose to smear Povetkin's reputation and destroy Ryabinsky's promotion.. After that smear job, WHY would you trust them when all of Povetkin's tests came up negative for Stiverne for months... and then 20 hours before the fight they smear him again for an unbelievably small trace of a drug that was legal for decades, and is not a steroid.. Again they DIDN'T announce the extremely small concentration that was in Povetkin's sample, just said he was "positive" ... I think they contaminated his sample because Povetkin said he never took Ostarine... Bute and Browne said the same thing... Stiverne ADMITTED to taking methylhexaneamine and had a good amount of that banned PED in his sample that was performance enhancing -- but VADA let him slide and let the fight go forward.

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

When a boxer is caught with a positive test for a banned drug, especially both samples when previous tests are clean, there are red flags and an investigation is done. I told you Povetkin tested under the allowable limit, but to have any in your system after being told the drug would be banned in October of the previous year seems to me like justifiable to investigate further. Do you actually think they re-use test tubes for their testing?

Back to the question you seem to refuse to answer. What concentrations did Bute and Browne have if the results are public knowledge? How many nanograms was it? I doubt you even have a clue.

Yes, Stiverne took something right in front of the tester in order to facilitate urination. He admitted it, and paid a fine. It was an over-the counter supplement recommended by the gym where he worked out. Not the same as ostarine, which has effects very similar to anabolic steriods.

[boxing_rocks]

Yes, Stiverne took something right in front of the tester in order to facilitate urination. He admitted it, and paid a fine. It was an over-the counter supplement recommended by the gym where he worked out. Not the same as ostarine, which has effects very similar to anabolic steriods.

Him taking something right in front of the tester likely means that he was trying to hide something else.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Kalan,

You keep spewing the same bullshit about the drug Povetkin got caught with for the Wilder fight. Ok, he had it in his system but was under the allowable limit. We all get that.

How about the recent dirty test with Ostarine? You seem to avoid that, along with my previous question about what concentration Bute or Browne had. If no one has any idea what Bute or Browne had, we have no idea what Povetkin had.

Are you joking???? You're the guy spewing BS... Povetkin didn't get caught for ANYTHING before the Wilder fight.. He was WAY under the allowable concentration, which means you pass the test... They inferred to the world that he DIDN'T pass which was BULLCRAP

VADA absolutely KNEW Povetkin was WAY in the clear on all his PED tests for Wilder... Yet they chose to smear Povetkin's reputation and destroy Ryabinsky's promotion.. After that smear job, WHY would you trust them when all of Povetkin's tests came up negative for Stiverne for months... and then 20 hours before the fight they smear him again for an unbelievably small trace of a drug that was legal for decades, and is not a steroid.. Again they DIDN'T announce the extremely small concentration that was in Povetkin's sample, just said he was "positive" ... I think they contaminated his sample because Povetkin said he never took Ostarine... Bute and Browne said the same thing... Stiverne ADMITTED to taking methylhexaneamine and had a good amount of that banned PED in his sample that was performance enhancing -- but VADA let him slide and let the fight go forward.

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

When a boxer is caught with a positive test for a banned drug, especially both samples when previous tests are clean, there are red flags and an investigation is done. I told you Povetkin tested under the allowable limit, but to have any in your system after being told the drug would be banned in October of the previous year seems to me like justifiable to investigate further. Do you actually think they re-use test tubes for their testing?

Back to the question you seem to refuse to answer. What concentrations did Bute and Browne have if the results are public knowledge? How many nanograms was it? I doubt you even have a clue.

Yes, Stiverne took something right in front of the tester in order to facilitate urination. He admitted it, and paid a fine. It was an over-the counter supplement recommended by the gym where he worked out. Not the same as ostarine, which has effects very similar to anabolic steriods.

at done

[greg]

Yes, Stiverne took something right in front of the tester in order to facilitate urination. He admitted it, and paid a fine. ....

...Stiverne claims he actually took something containing forbidden substance right in front of the tester prior to taking a piss test in oder to facilitate it and then got fined 70 000 dollars? Did I get it right? - well, he's not the smartest dude on the block or is he?

[Rob3_142]

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

I love it how everything that Povetkin takes is in minute doses, and everything that Stiverne takes is in high dose. I guess you must work in the lab where these tests are done?

Do you even know what Methylhexaneamine is? It's a vasoconstrictor you generally find in decongestants which has a stimulant side effect. The effects are barely as strong as a cup of coffee. That said, it has been known to increase heart rate and blood pressure and is generally pretty short acting. Many over the counter products don't contain the drug name on the label, and not all countries include it on their banned lists (although WADA does).

At the end of the day, I think if it is on a banned list, Stiverne should pick up a 2 year ban. As should Povetkin. That is of course, providing both B samples come back as positive. To be honest, I'm not sure why the B samples have not been done yet, and if they have, why we haven't heard anything.

[Kalan]

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

I love it how everything that Povetkin takes is in minute doses, and everything that Stiverne takes is in high dose. I guess you must work in the lab where these tests are done?

Do you even know what Methylhexaneamine is? It's a vasoconstrictor you generally find in decongestants which has a stimulant side effect. The effects are barely as strong as a cup of coffee. That said, it has been known to increase heart rate and blood pressure and is generally pretty short acting. Many over the counter products don't contain the drug name on the label, and not all countries include it on their banned lists (although WADA does).

At the end of the day, I think if it is on a banned list, Stiverne should pick up a 2 year ban. As should Povetkin. That is of course, providing both B samples come back as positive. To be honest, I'm not sure why the B samples have not been done yet, and if they have, why we haven't heard anything.

You're an ignorant simpleton Rob3... Methylhexaneamine is much more dynamic than caffeine. The commercial name is Dimethylamylamine and it has a wide range of nootropic effects that boost mental performance and energy. It was a favorite with athletes for years because of the intense energy rush and concentration it provides, which obviously improve athletic performance and results, and why it's banned... It's also more potent than Meldonium, which can also be purchased over-the-counter or online... Just because you can buy a performance enhancer in a store or online, doesn't mean you're allowed to take it as a professional or Olympic class athlete... The effects of caffeine are so mild it will never be banned.

[Rob3_142]

This is not even handedness... They treated a guy who passed all tests like a criminal.. They were out to get Povetkin and Ryabinsky.. And when Stiverne tests positive for a high dose of methylhexaneamine they fall all over themselves making excuses for him.

I love it how everything that Povetkin takes is in minute doses, and everything that Stiverne takes is in high dose. I guess you must work in the lab where these tests are done?

Do you even know what Methylhexaneamine is? It's a vasoconstrictor you generally find in decongestants which has a stimulant side effect. The effects are barely as strong as a cup of coffee. That said, it has been known to increase heart rate and blood pressure and is generally pretty short acting. Many over the counter products don't contain the drug name on the label, and not all countries include it on their banned lists (although WADA does).

At the end of the day, I think if it is on a banned list, Stiverne should pick up a 2 year ban. As should Povetkin. That is of course, providing both B samples come back as positive. To be honest, I'm not sure why the B samples have not been done yet, and if they have, why we haven't heard anything.

You're an ignorant simpleton Rob3... Methylhexaneamine is much more dynamic than caffeine. The commercial name is Dimethylamylamine and it has a wide range of nootropic effects that boost mental performance and energy. It was a favorite with athletes for years because of the intense energy rush and concentration it provides, which obviously improve athletic performance and results, and why it's banned... It's also more potent than Meldonium, which can also be purchased over-the-counter or online... Just because you can buy a performance enhancer in a store or online, doesn't mean you're allowed to take it as a professional or Olympic class athlete... The effects of caffeine are so mild it will never be banned.

Kalan, that the hell is wrong with you? Is it possible you can open a post without firing insults inside the first sentence? Is your point of argument so redundant that you have to resort to just insulting everyone you're posting to? It's just moronic. When you cannot construct an objective argument, it is not a leveller to try belittle the opposition in the debate. Why don't you stick to telling us what a microgram is, you're good at that.

Let me ask you this, what happens if Povetkin's B sample comes back positive too?