Joe Louis vs. Mike Tyson

[Duch]

I see this as a bad matchup for Louis . I rank him the #1 heavyweight BTW. I could definitely see Tyson winning by knockout

i agree with this! people seem to love to say that anybody that wouldnt be afraid of tyson would easily beat him. and while maybe he did have that slight bully mentality, you also had to have a great chin, elite mental and physical tougness, fitness and good boxing ability to beat mike tyson. and even with all of those things, theres still a possibility you get clipped and put away in the first 4 rounds.
i think joe louis is in the top 3 heavyweights of all time, but that doesnt mean he beats everyone else so easily. stylewise, against tyson, it doesnt bode well that he didnt have that fastest feet in the world and he definitely could be hurt if tyson landed the right shots! (and those things arent a knock on Louis, thats just my opinion).

if they fought ten times, id bet that tyson would win a couple no doubt.

I think when sb asks about who would win in the fight between X and Y he means who has a better chance to do it, not who would definitely win because even average boxers could throw a lucky punch and you cannot underrate anybody when you're in a ring. If you think that Tyson would win "a couple" of times in ten fights, it means that still you think Joe Louis has more to say between ropes with Mike than vice versa. So, maybe it wouldn't be easy fight for Louis as you say but still you wouldn't agree with sb who pick Mike in this fight, right?

[drunkenpiper36]

While Joe Louis had the right set of skills to defeat Mike Tyson, he'd be faced with the problem of having to weather a dangerous storm early before Mike's weaknesses would come into play. Tyson was the type of fighter who required a sustained beating over many rounds before he folded. Joe could provide this, but again he'd have to survive Mike's early round onslaughts.. Louis often got in trouble early and against far lesser men. Braddock, Galento, Schmeling, and Buddy Bear had him down in the early rounds. None of these men were Tyson's superior in the fast starting category. In addition, Louis said that shorter fighters who crowded him and hit with a good left hook always gave him problems. Once again, if Joe could get past the mid way point of the fight, when Tyson began to tire and let his guard down, I could see him landing some of those deadly combinations. But if Mike started out of the gate hammering away at him, he might get knocked out..

[DaveyMac]

Joe Louis was from an era where Heavyweights resemble the current day Crusierweights in size.

In historical terms, its a 190-200lb Louis against a 220lb Tyson. I couldn't see a much smaller Louis KO-ing Tyson.
If it were a Jou Louis by 1980s physical standards and they were comparable in size I would favour Louis.... however as they were its Tyson by KO.

The smaller 195lb Roy Jones did beat Ruiz in 2003, but it was punch and run... and John Ruiz was no prime Tyson

Louis was a bigger man than Holyfield and Evander sure managed to kick his a$$.

Tyson was a bigger, faster, harder puncher than Max Schmeling who managed to kick Louis' ass.

Once. And altho Schmeling's peak may not seem to us what Tyson's was it was very very high, and the guy was an absolute beast. Really for career he had more success than Tyson, maybe his peak wasn't as high, but it was pretty damn high.

And don't forget the rematch :)

Schmeling would have have murdered Buster Douglas 19 nights out of 20.

[sugarramos]

Id pick mike by a early KO joe never fought anyone with Tyson's speed or head movement however if joe louis was to catch mike and wobble him he would KO Tyson joe was a excellent finisher

[Syntax Error]

Mike tyson wins by KO, joe louis was the best of his era but as time moved on boxers developed better skills and tyson's aggressive style destroyed good boxers when he was in his prime.

when louis fought marciano he was well past his prime but tyson was even more aggressive than marciano was and probably stronger and better conditioned.

I'm not sure Tyson was better conditioned than Marciano.

Marciano's fitness & conditioning was legendary

Marciano was relentless & just as dangerous in the latter part of a fight as we was in the early part of it.

With Tyson; if he didn't finish you in the first half of a fight, he wasn't finishing you at all.

I think it's only Tyrell Biggs that he knocked out in the second half of a fight & that's probably because he carried Biggs.

Tyson was obviously bigger, faster & stronger though & more dangerous to fight in the early part of a contest.

[ClivePatrickLyons]

Louis is certainly a Legend but I cannot see Joe who punched a lot slower then Tyson and seemed slower on his feet I think Iron Mike overwhelms The Brown Bomber to win in 5 hectic round's.

[Oiky]

Tyson

[Give up]

Louis UD or Tyson flash KO

[Klee Gluckman]

Louis Kos Tyson. He's such an accurate puncher. Louis will eventually get into Tyson's head. Louis was a champion for such a long time, he outwills Mike.

[Kalan]

In the past there were FAR fewer distractions for fighters. That's why although time has passed, and some things have improved....like the science of training, and diet.....that has been neutralized by the myriad of distractions fighters have. In the past a fighter could focus like a lazer on his craft....now fighters can be busy playing with lazers instead of training.


My long winded way of saying...in this case....the older era fighter is likely to take the more modern...FAR MORE DISTRACTED and weak willed fighter apart in the later rounds.

You're loaded with generational bias... The fact is, Gymnasts, Figure Skaters, Spring Board and Platform Divers, and Olympic athletes in general are displaying skills and degrees of difficulty rarely if ever approached 50 years ago in their sports... Swimmers, Sprinters, and Runners are shattering Olympic and world records with each generation. As Mike Tyson said "Athletes get better not worse."

There were plenty more distractions before cameras and social media could track your every move and blab it all over the Internet.. Louis was a night clubber and womanizer and so was Henry Armstrong.. Ali wasn't in the best condition for every fight because of his pursuit of women and he admitted it.. Ray Robinson admitted to many affairs with women and being in lousy shape for some fights -- as did Mike Tyson.. Today fighters are more disciplined and training camps are longer and harder... And you don't see as many guys putting on 40 to 70 pounds between fights like Blubber Douglas and Blubber Mathis -- who often still had a lot of fat hanging on when they entered a ring.

[Cygnus475]

Weight is not a valid argument if fighter A beat several guys who were heavier than fighter B.

Tyson being 10 or 15 lbs heavier than Joe was on average is not going to give him an enormous advantage. You cant have it both ways. If "weight" and size are your primary arguments then Joe would have lost to the guys he beat who were bigger and heavier than Tyson (baer, carnera, etc).

Besides Joe trained down to be in he low 200's range for speed and stamina. It wasnt like he was scrawny or malnourished. He could have easily been Tysons weight without lifting weights, overreating, or using steroids he was a naturally large guy at 6'2 with a 76' reach. In fact he did weigh in the 210+ range in the army and carried the weight well.

[BitPlayer]

I think Louis would win this, just a level above.

[Kalan]

In the past there were FAR fewer distractions for fighters. That's why although time has passed, and some things have improved....like the science of training, and diet.....that has been neutralized by the myriad of distractions fighters have. In the past a fighter could focus like a lazer on his craft....now fighters can be busy playing with lazers instead of training.


My long winded way of saying...in this case....the older era fighter is likely to take the more modern...FAR MORE DISTRACTED and weak willed fighter apart in the later rounds.

It kind of funny how the badly distracted modern athlete shatters all the Olympic records of Joe Louis's day.. Women often beat the men's records of that day... Both Louis and Tyson were distracted by nightlife, booze, and women. But Louis, although a poor player, was also distracted by golf. Louis also suffered suffered various ramifications due to mental illness. He thought mafia types were shooting poison gas in on him at night. He deteriorated faster than Tyson and looked pathetic by the time he fought Walcott. Tyson looked better against Etienne at 36 than Louis looked against Charles at 35. Mike looked as strong and fit as ever -- while Louis looked soft, fat, weak, and slow. Even in his prime Louis often fought poorly -- due to the lack of skilled Heavyweights or top competition in the mid 30's -- when punchable types like Carnera, Baer, and Braddock traded the title quickly.

I believe both Tyson and Louis reached their peak at 21... Louis against Baer and Tyson against Michael Spinks.. Louis I believe weighed 197 while Tyson weighed 218 for their best fights.. Both were very sharp from fighting many fights in a very short period of time.. I believe Tyson would have prevailed due to his greater size and strength.. But Louis's jab, speed, and pinpoint accuracy vs Baer would have made things very interesting.

[davie]

After years of being an Ali man, I'm gradually swaying towards my Heavyweight list looking like
1. Louis
2.Ali

Also worth noting Tyson exists somewhere just outside the top 10.

Louis was just too good IMO. Tyson has the obvious punchers chance and Louis slow footwork and naturally aggressive style makes Tyson a risky proposition, but I think 7 or 8 out of 10 times Louis beats him

The size argument is not as significant a factor as it was in the Tyson v Marciano debate and more importantly, Louis was a level above both, I think he wins more often than not in his prime vs Mike

[Keko]

Louis is the best hw after Ali the time but it does not mean anything in mutual fight.

Louis is known to have problems with boxers systems using movement as well with Walcott or Conn at first their mutual fights.

I'm not saying that to lose or win but it could be interesting

[Kalan]

After years of being an Ali man, I'm gradually swaying towards my Heavyweight list looking like
1. Louis
2.Ali

Also worth noting Tyson exists somewhere just outside the top 10.

Louis was just too good IMO. Tyson has the obvious punchers chance and Louis slow footwork and naturally aggressive style makes Tyson a risky proposition, but I think 7 or 8 out of 10 times Louis beats him

The size argument is not as significant a factor as it was in the Tyson v Marciano debate and more importantly, Louis was a level above both, I think he wins more often than not in his prime vs Mike

Louis too good???????? Galento decked him.. Conn really tagged Louis up...with about everything don't you think??? Conn didn't have a Tunney like jab and he certain lacked size and strength. Do you think Conn was better than Michael Spinks??? Do you think Conn's hand speed was better than Mike Tyson's??? Conn started as a Lightweight and his record is spotted with many losses. Boxrec lists him as 174 for Louis and that's a couple pounds inflated. They also exaggerate Conn's height by at least 2 inches. Spinks was 6'2" X 212 for Tyson. A much bigger man than Conn. He was a World Heavyweight Champion and undefeated. He was blown away by Tyson for his only career loss.

Tyson tended to crush very small Heavyweights who's natural weight was 212 or less... The big, tall, strong, fast and skilled guys 6'4" X 230 or more Mike had trouble with.. Holyfield was an exception.. He ran only 6'2" X 218 for Tyson, but he peaked for Tyson.. Evander had a chin and brute strength Louis never had.

[elmersalsa]

I think the great Mike Tyson destroys every single heavyweight champion before the great Sonny Liston. He would have been too strong, too big and too fast for those guys.

Tyson destroys the great Joe Louis in one or two rounds.

[BoxBuzz]

Ay yi yi yi yi yi!!!

Jabberwocky. Mike Tyson COULD KO Louis that quick sure...anything can happen with two greats in the ring. Maybe you imagine Louis just standing there and waiting for the incoming. Maybe hiding behind the ref?

But my guess is, that Joe would remember that it was a boxing match, and go right to work.

Mike could KO anyone.....but with Joe....he's not in their with anyone.

I assume both of you would also take Mike over Evander......and yet.....it didn't quite happen that way.

[Kalan]

You ASSume too much too much as usual BuzzBox.. We're analyzing a matchup and you're traipsing through moonbeams again..

Think a little bit.. Evander weighed 218 for Tyson.. Louis weighed 197 for his best fight against Max Baer, and that was 14 months into his pro career. Baer couldn't box, couldn't jab, and couldn't do much but load and swing.. The first time Holyfield was matched with Tyson I said Holyfield would win.. Tyson conveniently got a rib injury in sparring and the fight didn't happen for 7 more years.. Were it up to Evander the fight would have happened a lot earlier.. Holyfield was a workhorse and worked on his skills every single day -- unlike Tyson and Louis.

However let's get back to Louis's problems as a boxer. As I said, Conn tagged Louis up freely, which was unlike the Heavyweights Louis fought who couldn't box worth a damn, possibly except for the 192-pound Schmeling of their 1st fight... Schmeling had a nice right counter and hit Louis freely with it -- knocking him out for the full count and then some... Schmeling was supposed to get a title shot at Braddock but was denied the shot. Braddock was inactive for 2 years and then fought Louis. Funny how those things happen. Over the next 2 years after his defeat by Schmeling Louis got many fights and Schmeling got very few fights. Let's just say that America controlled the Heavyweight scene and there's nothing anybody could do about it.

A prime Louis never met a Heavyweight Challenger (a real Heavyweight) who could box well, and was also well prepared to take his title... Louis had extremely weak competition to say the least.. Sportswriters contemptuously referred to Louis's challengers as "The Bum of the Month Club" because they were so bad they literally stunk out the joint.

Now for contrast, let’s take a look at Tyson’s bigger and better challengers: Tony Tucker was undefeated. He wasn’t slow he and could box a little bit, going 6’5” X 223... Tyrell Biggs was an Olympic Champion and could box a little bit, going 6’5” X 229... Carl Williams and Pinklon Thomas were fairly big and tall, fairly quick. They could box a bit... Michael Spinks was 6’2” X 212 and was a great boxer and puncher – plus he was an undefeated World Heavyweight Champion.

But where was the array of talent in the late 30’s and 40’s??? The big guys Louis fought, such as Buddy Baer and Abe Simon were terrible. Not that they didn’t tag Louis on the chin and even knock him out of the ring in the case of Buddy Baer – but they were super slow and super hittable. Minus good skills they were like sandlot football players or minor league baseball players who couldn’t hack it. A prime Louis never had any competition except for 192-pound Schmeling and the small and anemic Conn.

If Louis fought Mike Tyson it would be like going from sandlot football to the NFL... or at least from sandlot football to the top colligate teams.

[Rexob]

I see this as a bad matchup for Louis . I rank him the #1 heavyweight BTW. I could definitely see Tyson winning by knockout

?

[Rexob]

Tyson would win and quickly. Louis a great champion in his day but he wouldn't be able to take it off a young quick power punching Tyson.

[Kalan]

Weight is not a valid argument if fighter A beat several guys who were heavier than fighter B.

Tyson being 10 or 15 lbs heavier than Joe was on average is not going to give him an enormous advantage. You cant have it both ways. If "weight" and size are your primary arguments then Joe would have lost to the guys he beat who were bigger and heavier than Tyson (baer, carnera, etc).

Besides Joe trained down to be in he low 200's range for speed and stamina. It wasnt like he was scrawny or malnourished. He could have easily been Tysons weight without lifting weights, overreating, or using steroids he was a naturally large guy at 6'2 with a 76' reach. In fact he did weigh in the 210+ range in the army and carried the weight well.

You're so full of crap... Louis trained down to his fighting weight for speed and stamina??? Doesn't everybody??? Tyson at 21 was 218 rock solid for the 212 MIchael Spinks a built up Light Heavyweight.. Louis at the same age was 197 for Baer so that's a 21 pound advantage for Tyson. It's significant. The guys who were bigger than Louis were no good.. Buddy Baer and Carnera sucked to beat Hell. Tyson was an ATG and no slow slug. There is no way Louis could be Tyson's weight and retain his athleticism, because he'd be fat like he was for Marciano. At 217 he was totally out of shape, fat and bloated at 37. The youthful Brown Bomber was sleek and fast. So was the youthful Tyson. Mike was just a lot bigger, stronger, and faster -- and he punched harder. Mike faced much better competition, and a Light Heavyweight like Conn wouldn't punch the sh!t out of him.

[walshb]

Some of the sh1t being posted here. Tyson absolutely annihilates Louis. Too big and too heavy hitting for a man that is 20 lbs lighter. Tyson's chin was solid. Joe's wasn't. How the hell would Louis take a Tyson shot when he was getting rocked and dropped by guys like Conn and Schmeling? No more than 2 rds max, and likely rd 1. Louis is right there to be hit, and Tyson would not be having to shoot too high, as Joe is only an inch or two taller.

[DaveyMac]

I'm surprised so many people think Tyson. I think Louis is a solid favorite here. Perhaps it's the passing years that have dulled his remarkable skills but I think he's at least a 3-2 favorite over Tyson.

[walshb]

What happens when Mike lands a clean power shot to a man who is 20 lbs lighter and who was dropped and rocked by far less hitters than Tyson?

BTW, Joe's remarkable skills won't stop his chin getting whacked hard.