Who is the best Boxer ever?

[gilgamesh]

An old coked out and fat deLahoya arguably beat prime mayweather. Why not include oscar?

He won 3 rounds.

And saying Oscar won 3 rounds is generous

I'd say it's spot on accurate. I had him winning exactly 3 rounds in that fight as well.

[Badhusker]

#1 to me is pretty clear. Notes from ESPN sum it up well.

1. Sugar Ray Robinson

Welterweight, middleweight
Ring career: 1940-65 Record: 175-19-6-2 (109 KOs)
Career notes: Won world welterweight title in December 1946, and defended it four times before stepping up in weight and winning, in 1951, first of five stints as middleweight champ. … Attempted to win light heavyweight title from Joey Maxim in 1952, but was stopped in the 14th round. … Born Walker Smith in Ailey, Ga. … Was the most complete boxer yet to grace the squared circle. … Lost just one of first 123 fights, to Jake LaMotta, a defeat avenged five times in a classic ring rivalry. … A near-perfect pugilist at welterweight, was less dominant at middleweight, but was still able to win the title five times, including three times after he had retired for two and a half years. … Only stoppage defeat was when challenging Maxim for light heavyweight crown, and then was leading on points until overcome by heat so extreme that it had forced the replacement of the referee in the 10th.

Robinson had the best combination of speed, power in both hands, size, footwork, and stamina. Joe Louis, Ali, and Patterson said he was the best PFP ever. He would have KO'd Floyd, SRL, Hagler, Hearns, any modern welter, you name em. Was something like 85-0 in amateurs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqCW_O1m8AM

You disagreed with yourself earlier in the thread.

That's OK, I'm still right.

[Luckybattles]

floyd didnt win one round convincingly. Never made any kind of statement to show he was superior.he got lucky that some judges reward that . He beat oscar like Trinidad did. Without landing a punch. I'm not saying oscar did anything but it was more of a non fight sparring match where the only losers were the fans. Oscar a way more electrifying boxer over the course of his career. Fought much better opposition too.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He won 3 rounds.

And saying Oscar won 3 rounds is generous

I'd say it's spot on accurate. I had him winning exactly 3 rounds in that fight as well.

I rewatching it a few times and.always have the same score. It was 3-3 and then Floyd dominated. Oscar's wildly ineffective flurry somehow won him the 12th for many. That was a defensive master class. Oscar was a credit to the sport, he was just below the level of Mayweather, Whitaker and Hopkins.all of which I'd rate over roy.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

#1 to me is pretty clear. Notes from ESPN sum it up well.

1. Sugar Ray Robinson

Welterweight, middleweight
Ring career: 1940-65 Record: 175-19-6-2 (109 KOs)
Career notes: Won world welterweight title in December 1946, and defended it four times before stepping up in weight and winning, in 1951, first of five stints as middleweight champ. … Attempted to win light heavyweight title from Joey Maxim in 1952, but was stopped in the 14th round. … Born Walker Smith in Ailey, Ga. … Was the most complete boxer yet to grace the squared circle. … Lost just one of first 123 fights, to Jake LaMotta, a defeat avenged five times in a classic ring rivalry. … A near-perfect pugilist at welterweight, was less dominant at middleweight, but was still able to win the title five times, including three times after he had retired for two and a half years. … Only stoppage defeat was when challenging Maxim for light heavyweight crown, and then was leading on points until overcome by heat so extreme that it had forced the replacement of the referee in the 10th.

Robinson had the best combination of speed, power in both hands, size, footwork, and stamina. Joe Louis, Ali, and Patterson said he was the best PFP ever. He would have KO'd Floyd, SRL, Hagler, Hearns, any modern welter, you name em. Was something like 85-0 in amateurs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqCW_O1m8AM

You disagreed with yourself earlier in the thread.

That's OK, I'm still right.

You can always change your mind. Greb was > Tunney anyway.

[Jip]

You disagreed with yourself earlier in the thread.

That's OK, I'm still right.

You can always change your mind. Greb was > Tunney anyway.

you right about robinson. how would prime jones had done against the top 154, middleweight and super middleweights, against hearns, against hagler, against leonard, ggg, hopkins, toney, mc clellan and calzaghe? how was roys amateur record, wasnt he undefeated, with 1 robbery at the olympics, correct me i am wrong.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Prime hagler would beat Roy decisively IMO. He could approach Roy athletically and was much more technical. Anyway, dream fights don't come into it for me. Whitaker was a better boxer than Roy for me. They were contemporaries and pea was the man for much of it.

[Jip]

Prime hagler would beat Roy decisively IMO. He could approach Roy athletically and was much more technical. Anyway, dream fights don't come into it for me. Whitaker was a better boxer than Roy for me. They were contemporaries and pea was the man for much of it.

roy over pernell all day. hagler wouldnt touch prime roy, nobody touched prime roy, no hopkins, no toney, no nobody. pernell and hagler will tell you that roy is the best ever.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Prime hagler would beat Roy decisively IMO. He could approach Roy athletically and was much more technical. Anyway, dream fights don't come into it for me. Whitaker was a better boxer than Roy for me. They were contemporaries and pea was the man for much of it.

roy over pernell all day. hagler wouldnt touch prime roy, nobody touched prime roy, no hopkins, no toney, no nobody. pernell and hagler will tell you that roy is the best ever.

They'd have no reason to lie. What would tarver say? Lol. Roy hated southpaws.

[Jip]

Prime hagler would beat Roy decisively IMO. He could approach Roy athletically and was much more technical. Anyway, dream fights don't come into it for me. Whitaker was a better boxer than Roy for me. They were contemporaries and pea was the man for much of it.

roy over pernell all day. hagler wouldnt touch prime roy, nobody touched prime roy, no hopkins, no toney, no nobody. pernell and hagler will tell you that roy is the best ever.

They'd have no reason to lie. What would tarver say? Lol. Roy hated southpaws.

come on, you an expert? you know better than that. you know roy was over the hill ones he drained himself from rui fight back to light h. tarver ko doesnt count, this was past prime roy.

prime roy beat the back than arguably p4p king toney and toney couldnt do absolutly nothing, he looked like a c level boxer against prime jones. on top he beat young hopkins, who couldnt do much either. than one time griffin was lucky to get a dq win and than angry roy came back and showed how could he is when he is angry and beat griffin in 1.

athletic nobody touches roy, no leonard, no pernell, no nobody. when we talk athletic, speed, reflexes, these 3 categorys prime roy owns and those 3 atributes are super important in boxing.

now i am gonne tell you something you never heard, but its true and you should think about it. floyd mayweather is regarded by a lot of people the best defensive boxer ever. right. when was floyd at his best? when he was younger, lets say "the corrales fight". now look. what is the main definition of a great defensive boxer, whats the #1 thing a defensive oriented boxer should be able to do? not be touched by an opponent, right. prime roy was rarely touched than prime mayweather prime roy therefore was a better defensive boxer than prime mayweather

[SaadOffTheDeck]

No, he wasn't over the hill for tarver. As a Jones fan the first fight was my favorite performance. He lost, he could have won the third fight but he was afraid of getting knocked out again. Floyd is greater than Roy too. Sorry kid.

[ClivePatrickLyons]

SRR.........................How many great fighter's copy his nickname......His nickname must be the most copied

[Kalan]

to in prime shape jones, robinson and leonard are the 3 best boxers who ever existed. the combination of speed, power, footwork, athletiscm these guys had were on another level.

to me, there might never come a boxer as good or better as a prime roy jones jr., sad that he doesnt know when to stop, but what he was in his prime thats from another world.

They weren't that good... They were flashy but not solid technicians...

Jones was easily blasted out by Glen Johnson and Antonio Tarver who were both older than Roy when they clocked him out...

Leonard was solidly out-boxed by the China-chinned underdog, Terry Norris, and also whipped by a couple of Lightweights...

Ray Robinson was easily out-boxed and dominated by 3rd rate Ralph Jones--who was cherry-picked by Robinson fight because he had 5 straight losses coming into their fight... Robinson also lost to such woeful plodders as -- Gene Fullmer, who went 26 straight fights in his prime without scoring a KO. That streak included his first 2 Robinson fights -- Jake LaMotta, a punching bag who lost to many people you never heard of -- Carmen Basilio, a small and crude Welterweight who couldn't even hold 160 pounds -- and Paul Pender, who was built like Wally Peepers and moved like Chuck Wepner.

Better boxers were: Vasyl Lomachenko... Gene Tunney... Floyd Mayweather... Willie Pep... Eder Jofre... Roman Gonzalez... and Guillermo Rigondeax

[Ricky_]

What happened to chepppaaa?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

What happened to chepppaaa?

Really? Lol, didn't you see jip's post about being a boxing expert?

[jezzamundo]

to in prime shape jones, robinson and leonard are the 3 best boxers who ever existed. the combination of speed, power, footwork, athletiscm these guys had were on another level.

to me, there might never come a boxer as good or better as a prime roy jones jr., sad that he doesnt know when to stop, but what he was in his prime thats from another world.

They weren't that good... They were flashy but not solid technicians...

Jones was easily blasted out by Glen Johnson and Antonio Tarver who were both older than Roy when they clocked him out...

Leonard was solidly out-boxed by the China-chinned underdog, Terry Norris, and also whipped by a couple of Lightweights...

Ray Robinson was easily out-boxed and dominated by 3rd rate Ralph Jones--who was cherry-picked by Robinson fight because he had 5 straight losses coming into their fight... Robinson also lost to such woeful plodders as -- Gene Fullmer, who went 26 straight fights in his prime without scoring a KO. That streak included his first 2 Robinson fights -- Jake LaMotta, a punching bag who lost to many people you never heard of -- Carmen Basilio, a small and crude Welterweight who couldn't even hold 160 pounds -- and Paul Pender, who was built like Wally Peepers and moved like Chuck Wepner.

Better boxers were: Vasyl Lomachenko... Gene Tunney... Floyd Mayweather... Willie Pep... Eder Jofre... Roman Gonzalez... and Guillermo Rigondeax

With the exception of Robinson's loss to LaMotta - a top middleweight who outweighed Sugar Ray by 16lb - all of the fights you've mentioned occurred when the fighters were clearly past their prime and therefore shouldn't be given much importance when evaluating how great they were.

[Ricky_]

What happened to chepppaaa?

Really? Lol, didn't you see jip's post about being a boxing expert?

Chepppaaa is jip now? Makes sense. Overrating rjj as the goat must be a fairly niche market.

[Kalan]

Not a chance... Robinson was NOT past his prime when he lost to Ralph Jones at 33 and Randy Turpin at 31 or so.

Robinson also padded his record with 150 bums who Daniel Jacobs wouldn't hire for sparring partners.. Robinson got decked hard by Artie Levine, Jake LaMotta, Tommy Bell, and even Rocky Graziano... How many times was Gennady Golovkin decked in 386 amateur and professional fights?? Never.

Robinson's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 3-3 with 2 KO wins.

Golovkin's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 17-0 with 17 KO wins.

[cocka09]

Not a chance... Robinson was NOT past his prime when he lost to Ralph Jones at 33 and Randy Turpin at 31 or so.

Robinson also padded his record with 150 bums who Daniel Jacobs wouldn't hire for sparring partners.. Robinson got decked hard by Artie Levine, Jake LaMotta, Tommy Bell, and even Rocky Graziano... How many times was Gennady Golovkin decked in 386 amateur and professional fights?? Never.

Robinson's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 3-3 with 2 KO wins.

Golovkin's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 17-0 with 17 KO wins.

GGG is better than SRR?

[tiny_acres]

Not a chance... Robinson was NOT past his prime when he lost to Ralph Jones at 33 and Randy Turpin at 31 or so.

Robinson also padded his record with 150 bums who Daniel Jacobs wouldn't hire for sparring partners.. Robinson got decked hard by Artie Levine, Jake LaMotta, Tommy Bell, and even Rocky Graziano... How many times was Gennady Golovkin decked in 386 amateur and professional fights?? Never.

Robinson's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 3-3 with 2 KO wins.

Golovkin's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 17-0 with 17 KO wins.

GGG is better than SRR?

Don't worry about that. Wilt Chamberlain is better than them all

[Jip]

you funny kalan and you truly believe what you sayn hahaha

[SaadOffTheDeck]

What happened to chepppaaa?

Really? Lol, didn't you see jip's post about being a boxing expert?

Chepppaaa is jip now? Makes sense. Overrating rjj as the goat must be a fairly niche market.

he's certainly part of it.

[jezzamundo]

Not a chance... Robinson was NOT past his prime when he lost to Ralph Jones at 33 and Randy Turpin at 31 or so.

Robinson also padded his record with 150 bums who Daniel Jacobs wouldn't hire for sparring partners.. Robinson got decked hard by Artie Levine, Jake LaMotta, Tommy Bell, and even Rocky Graziano... How many times was Gennady Golovkin decked in 386 amateur and professional fights?? Never.

Robinson's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 3-3 with 2 KO wins.

Golovkin's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 17-0 with 17 KO wins.

If you really believe that then you're even more clueless than most here already believe you to be. I'm not saying he was shot, but he certainly wasn't the fighter he had been at welterweight.

I actually think Robinson is overrated at middleweight by many, but his prime division and prime years were certainly at welterweight.

[Kalan]

Not a chance... Robinson was NOT past his prime when he lost to Ralph Jones at 33 and Randy Turpin at 31 or so.

Robinson also padded his record with 150 bums who Daniel Jacobs wouldn't hire for sparring partners.. Robinson got decked hard by Artie Levine, Jake LaMotta, Tommy Bell, and even Rocky Graziano... How many times was Gennady Golovkin decked in 386 amateur and professional fights?? Never.

Robinson's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 3-3 with 2 KO wins.

Golovkin's record in Middleweight TItle Defenses 17-0 with 17 KO wins.

GGG is better than SRR?

He sure as Hell is a better Middleweight... And in Robinson's first World Title fight at Welterweight he was decked hard by a mediocre Tommy Bell, and that was for a vacant version of the Welterweight Title.. I thought it was interesting that he was matched with Bell for a vacant title because he'd beaten Bell easily before.. Robinson was also decked and almost knocked cold in his previous Welterweight fight by Artie Levine.. GGG has never been down.

[davie]

pernell and hagler will tell you that roy is the best ever.

No they wouldn't. They'd probably tell you SRR like any other sane person would