Heavyweights: Mike Tyson vs Lennox Lewis

[elmersalsa]

I told you your an idiot of the highest order. It is well documented Tyson and Lewis sparred when Lewis was 17 and Tyson 16, and after the 3rd session in which Lewis made Tyson look stupid and started knocking him about the ring D' Amato told his ( Lewis's ) trainer to take him out of the catskills. The fact you are unaware of that is your problem and yours alone. That is why Tyson paid him step aside money rather than fight him and got battered by another underdog in Holyfield.

Oh please post your moronic theory again about how a fighter paying another guy step aside money doesn't mean he is ducking him. I could do with another laugh.

What part of " Norris lost to guys who were a lot slower than he was " is too difficult for you to comprehend? Or are you going to stick to your frankly idiotic claim that both Brown and Jackson were quicker than him?

What you consider Lewis to be is worth NOTHING. The FACTS are he beat every man he ever faced, unlike the gutless little cretin who found it much easier to rape and assault girls than get back in the ring and beat his conquerors.

Not that I am overly interested but who exactly do you think claimed " Norris would beat Leonard anytime " because it certainly wasn't me?

But yes, prime Lewis beats ANY version of the bully boy ( who was only happy abusing women ) with consummate ease. It would be easier for Lennox making Tyson look amateur than it was making Tua look the same. One has a brain, the other is a retard, who is completely unable to think his way out of trouble. It doesn't get much simpler to work out than that.

Retarded troll. I told you to be short and to the point. You gotta be out of your mind or you gotta be RETARDED OR BOTH.

I TOLD YOU TO BRING ME FACTS. YOU'RE RETARDED ASS DIDN'T DO WHAT I ASKED YOU.

Where in the clips Lennox Lewis ever whupped Mike Tyson in sparring? Can somebody besides THIS RETARDED FOOL SHOW ME ANY EVIDENCE THAT LEWIS WHUUPPED TYSON IN SPARRING SESSIONS?

Is that a true fact of a classic moron that doesn't has any proof of those old sparring sessions? I am not ten years old. Go tell that to your kids if you have some.

Now, what raping women got to do with the subject? This is a classic moronic troll.

Crawl back into your cave you moron. There is no need for footage, as there is enough WRITTEN reports of their encounter in boxing mags and books. Look around and find them, I'm not educating pork. Are you that moronic you need to see something on film to know its true?

Look up the word " editing " you numb skull. Film is the least credible example of truth, idiot.

Anyway, post your moronic garbage about fighters NOT ducking when they pay step aside money to another fighter again, there must still be plenty of folks looking for a good laugh. Though I must admit claiming Brown, Jackson, and Santana were as fast as Terry Norris is almost as funny.

It shows the character of the cretin being discussed knuckle dragger. It shows that while the filth is willing to rape and batter women, it can't fight back against someone equally violent, but stronger willed.

Most normal folks do NOT worship rapist scum, which says plenty about you.

You RETARDED PIECE OF SHIT, I told you again to be short to the point. Are you RETARDED or what?

Those reports ain't found. I can see your garbage lies to state a point. Give me facts, MORON!

I NEVER ROOTED FOR TYSON when he fought Holyfield or Lewis. I didn't like him ever since he joined Don King.

And again, YOU PIECE OF SHIT, GIVE ME SOME FACTS. It's up to you to find them, not me, ASSHOLE!

[Barkley]

I believe tyson would have always struggled with Lewis. Tyson was never comfortable with the super heavy s and any one with a decent jab. I think a prime tyson v Lewis would have been a longer tougher fight for lennox, perhaps even been rocked several times but eventually round about the tenth Lewis would send tyson to the canvas. With Lewis slightly ahead on the cards

[Barkley]

Tyson had a very short prime and yes in the time he accomplished a lot but I think if he had met Lewis with both in there prime it would have been a victory for lennox

[elmersalsa]

This guy golden oldie must be the biggest asshole of this whole forum. He claims that there are evidence of Lewis kicking Tyson's ass in sparring. But his RETARDED ASS can't find the evidence. It's a whole bunch of lies, just to prove a point.

I need concrete facts. Can someone please help him find the evidences?

Go and find the WRITTEN evidence yourself. It is not the job of forum members to educate inbred pork like you. You know less than nothing about the sport of boxing, as evidenced by your moronic criticism of Lewis's ability. If you knew anything about the man you would criticise him for his genuine faults, which were over confidence to the point of arrogance and contempt for opponents which he thought were not worth bothering with. Which is why,

1.He didn't even bother preparing or going to South Africa to acclimatise for Rahman, preferring instead to hang around Las Vegas with Hollywood nonentities making a crap film.

and

2. He considered Kirk Johnson to be worth no more than going through the motions and was prepared to enter the ring at his heaviest and in poor condition believing it would be an early round blow out like Grant, or Golota, but left it too late to get fit for Vitali.

Both of those performances were his fault, and he DESERVED to lose, luckily for him Vitali's skin opened up the way it did, but don't kid yourself that a fully fit Lewis doesn't beat Vitali, just as easily as he beat Tyson, Tua, Mavrovic or Tucker.

If you were half as clever as you think you are you would be twice as clever as you ACTUALLY are, you moronic fool. So go and find the written reports of Tyson / Lewis sparring sessions for your USELESS self instead of crying like a bitch for someone else to do it.

You are a waste of good air. The only concrete you need is boots, or a flyover as a permanent bed.

Find the EVIDENCES. You're the one that's claiming them. Nobody else in this forum has said that LYING GARBAGE.

And you're nothing but a PUSSYHOLE in my view. Nuff said.

FIND THE EVIDENCES. YOU'RE THE ONE CLAIMING THEM. I AM WAITING!

[Kalan]

Anybody that takes extra amount of punishment like Iron Mike did, especially in the Douglas and Holyfield fights would eventually go down. There is no way in hell that a fighter could take that amount of punishment and don't go down. It was the accumulation of punches that stopped Tyson.

If you're a heavyweight receiving all kinds of wicked shots like Tyson took, you gotta go down. No matter how great of a chin you got. Tyson proved that he had a great chin. He took a lot of shots from two heavyweights that can put you down and out if they keep repeatedly hitting someone like that.

The question is, could Lennox Lewis take that amount of shots in a fight? THE EVIDENCE WAS CLEARLY SEEN. HE CANNOT. END OF STORY.

Mike couldn't take those shots either. That's why Mike was knocked out 5 X and Lewis wasn't.

But Lewis didn't have to take hard shots... He was a good boxer... Mike had to take those shots... He WASN'T a good boxer... END OF STORY!!!

Tyson was taking those shots because his skills eroded by 1989. No more trainer Kevin Rooney in his corner. When Rooney was there, Tyson could slip punches and come back with left hooks, uppercuts and wicked combinations.

Lewis could not take those shots. It was evidently seen by TWO BUMS that knocked him out....END OF STORY!

Rahman and McCall were BUMS??? They each beat more than 1 Heavyweight Champ.. Lewis was KO'd by 2 Heavyweight Champs who he beat in rematches.. Tyson was knocked out by 3 Heavyweight Champs who were all older than him...and was also stopped by 1 mediocre Heavyweight and 1 punch bag for a total of 5 KO losses... Mike wasn't able to beat any of them in rematches.

[elmersalsa]

Go and find the WRITTEN evidence yourself. It is not the job of forum members to educate inbred pork like you. You know less than nothing about the sport of boxing, as evidenced by your moronic criticism of Lewis's ability. If you knew anything about the man you would criticise him for his genuine faults, which were over confidence to the point of arrogance and contempt for opponents which he thought were not worth bothering with. Which is why,

1.He didn't even bother preparing or going to South Africa to acclimatise for Rahman, preferring instead to hang around Las Vegas with Hollywood nonentities making a crap film.

and

2. He considered Kirk Johnson to be worth no more than going through the motions and was prepared to enter the ring at his heaviest and in poor condition believing it would be an early round blow out like Grant, or Golota, but left it too late to get fit for Vitali.

Both of those performances were his fault, and he DESERVED to lose, luckily for him Vitali's skin opened up the way it did, but don't kid yourself that a fully fit Lewis doesn't beat Vitali, just as easily as he beat Tyson, Tua, Mavrovic or Tucker.

If you were half as clever as you think you are you would be twice as clever as you ACTUALLY are, you moronic fool. So go and find the written reports of Tyson / Lewis sparring sessions for your USELESS self instead of crying like a bitch for someone else to do it.

You are a waste of good air. The only concrete you need is boots, or a flyover as a permanent bed.

Find the EVIDENCES. You're the one that's claiming them. Nobody else in this forum has said that LYING GARBAGE.

And you're nothing but a PUSSYHOLE in my view. Nuff said.

FIND THE EVIDENCES. YOU'RE THE ONE CLAIMING THEM. I AM WAITING!

I find it hard to believe anyone was actually born as moronic and useless as you are. You must have worked extremely hard at it. I wouldn't put myself out to " prove " anything to someone as insignificant as you, I am stating it is a fact that Lewis and Tyson sparred as teenagers, and old tomato asked Arnie Boehm to take Lewis away after their 3rd session because Lennox was getting the upper hand. The fact that a nonentity like you is unaware of this is your problem, not mine.

Aaaagggghhhh! Go to hell, YOU LYING SON A BITCH!

GIVE E ME THE EVIDENCES!

[elmersalsa]

Mike couldn't take those shots either. That's why Mike was knocked out 5 X and Lewis wasn't.

But Lewis didn't have to take hard shots... He was a good boxer... Mike had to take those shots... He WASN'T a good boxer... END OF STORY!!!

Tyson was taking those shots because his skills eroded by 1989. No more trainer Kevin Rooney in his corner. When Rooney was there, Tyson could slip punches and come back with left hooks, uppercuts and wicked combinations.

Lewis could not take those shots. It was evidently seen by TWO BUMS that knocked him out....END OF STORY!

Rahman and McCall were BUMS??? They each beat more than 1 Heavyweight Champ.. Lewis was KO'd by 2 Heavyweight Champs who he beat in rematches.. Tyson was knocked out by 3 Heavyweight Champs who were all older than him...and was also stopped by 1 mediocre Heavyweight and 1 punch bag for a total of 5 KO losses... Mike wasn't able to beat any of them in rematches.

Iron Mike would not lose to those BUMS that Lewis lost to. No way in hell. I can't see it, Kalan!

[elmersalsa]

You are a lying moron. You don't have any credibility whatsoever. I told you to bring the evidences, and you could not do it.

Again, find me the evidences!

[Covfefe]

It's fairly common knowledge the two sparred when they were younger.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

It's fairly common knowledge the two sparred when they were younger.

Absolutely, who is refuting that? Then again it means nothing.

[Covfefe]

It's fairly common knowledge the two sparred when they were younger.

Absolutely, who is refuting that? Then again it means nothing.

Elmersalsa doesn't seem to believe it happened for some reason.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

It's fairly common knowledge the two sparred when they were younger.

Absolutely, who is refuting that? Then again it means nothing.

Elmersalsa doesn't seem to believe it happened for some reason.

Lol, I stopped reading his posts in this thread ages ago. Just popped in to see what you had to say.

[Kalan]

They sparred once... D'Amato said "You'll both be Heavyweight Champions" and he never let Tyson spar Lewis again because Mike got his ass kicked in.

[elmersalsa]

Can you give me sources, Kalan? Any proof that Lennox Lewis used to whupped him?

That is the same GARBAGE some people claimed that the great Aaron Pryor used to whupped Sugar Ray's ass in sparring sessions. But, no evidence of that.

[Cojimar 1946]

It's interesting that Tyson can't beat Lewis yet Rahman managed the feat.

[Kalan]

You saw the true Lewis in the rematch... He caught a fluke punch which is always possible in Boxing... Lightning didn't strike twice for Rahman though

But Tyson generally didn't rematch anybody who kicked his ass in... Mike tried it once with Holyfield and deliberately fouled out... It's hard to win that way.

[elmersalsa]

You are a lying moron. You don't have any credibility whatsoever. I told you to bring the evidences, and you could not do it.

Again, find me the evidences!

I consider you to be an oxygen thief, unworthy of any effort required to alleviate your ignorance. Find it yourself, or remain pig poo ignorant. I couldn't care less either way.

Find the proof, you pussy hole!

[elmersalsa]

They sparred once... D'Amato said "You'll both be Heavyweight Champions" and he never let Tyson spar Lewis again because Mike got his ass kicked in.

I think they actually sparred 3 times over a few days, which was supposed to be a week's trip. Old tomato was happy whilst Tyson was trying to rip LL's head off, but as soon as the tide turned and Lewis made Tyson look foolish, by forcing him to miss, then went on to start knocking him around the ring, Arnie Boehm was told the trip was to be cut short, and don't come back.

Everybody got their own side of the story. What about Iron Mike's?

To believe that Lennox Lewis used to beat him down in sparring back then in the 80s it's really hard for me, at least, to believe that GARBAGE.

[elmersalsa]

I think they actually sparred 3 times over a few days, which was supposed to be a week's trip. Old tomato was happy whilst Tyson was trying to rip LL's head off, but as soon as the tide turned and Lewis made Tyson look foolish, by forcing him to miss, then went on to start knocking him around the ring, Arnie Boehm was told the trip was to be cut short, and don't come back.

Everybody got their own side of the story. What about Iron Mike's?

To believe that Lennox Lewis used to beat him down in sparring back then in the 80s it's really hard for me, at least, to believe that GARBAGE.

The " proof " has been shown to you though NEVER by me, because I honestly believe everytime you breathe in, you are stealing someone else's oxygen. If you are too dumb to understand it, again that is your problem.

Find concrete proof for crying out loud, moron!

[Kalan]

I didn't know anyone who actually thought Ali would win. He was clearly well past his best the last time he had fought, which was more than two years previously. I remember a lot of fight fans (not just the general public) that were confident that Tyson would or at least could win.

Tyson clearly had more left than Ali had.
Holmes was in his prime, Lewis was not.

Even those that thought Lewis would win, thought Tyson had a least a puncher's chance.

Well, if odds went to 9-5 it's obvious that many people bet on Ali. Casuals are what they are. The want to believe in unbeliveable. And, by the way, Lewis himself said many times he was at his absolute best in Rahman-2 fight. In my opinion, his first fight against Holyfield and second fight against Rahman were by far his best, his peak performances. And Tyson fight was just 7 months after Lewis demolished Rahman in epic performance. But I agree that Lennox looked slightly slower against Tyson than before. But he was only slightly worse than his peak version, while Tyson was beyond shot. Even Ali, who who also beyond shot and had Parkinson desease, looked much better against Berbick than Tyson looked against Danny Williams. And Berbick is MUCH better than Danny Williams.

Yeah that's true -- but everybody says Tyson was at his best at 21... Tyson crushed ATG Light Heavyweight Michael Spinks in 90 seconds at that age... Ali struggled mightily to beat mediocre Light Heavyweight Doug Jones at the same age... Peak for peak, I believe Tyson beats Ali because Ali had the perfect style for Mike to look good against.. The way Mike ran over Holmes, Spinks, Truth Williams, and Berbick, he beats Ali Quick.. Nobody else ever knocked Larry Holmes out. Nobody else ever knocked Michael Spinks out---so it's not a big deal if you've never been knocked out. They weren't real big and strong and they lacked firepower, so Mike ran them over. Ali had the same vulnerabilities they had.

The guys who beat a prime Tyson---I would say Douglas, Holyfield, and Lewis---were big, tall, strong, and fast. Holyfield wasn't that big and tall and he didn't punch super hard, but he trained like an SOB for every fight. He could fight inside and outside. He could put a head on you. He built himself up like crazy, and was a rock solid 218 for Tyson. Holyfield was a strong guy when he was 34. Maybe that was his peak. People forget that Foreman was only 217 for his best fight of his life. He looked so formidable versus Frazier because he was ripped like a rock... It makes a big difference how well you train and how strong you feel. If you know you've done everything humanly possible that could be done.

[Tomasino]

I didn't know anyone who actually thought Ali would win. He was clearly well past his best the last time he had fought, which was more than two years previously. I remember a lot of fight fans (not just the general public) that were confident that Tyson would or at least could win.

Tyson clearly had more left than Ali had.
Holmes was in his prime, Lewis was not.

Even those that thought Lewis would win, thought Tyson had a least a puncher's chance.

Well, if odds went to 9-5 it's obvious that many people bet on Ali. Casuals are what they are. The want to believe in unbeliveable. And, by the way, Lewis himself said many times he was at his absolute best in Rahman-2 fight. In my opinion, his first fight against Holyfield and second fight against Rahman were by far his best, his peak performances. And Tyson fight was just 7 months after Lewis demolished Rahman in epic performance. But I agree that Lennox looked slightly slower against Tyson than before. But he was only slightly worse than his peak version, while Tyson was beyond shot. Even Ali, who who also beyond shot and had Parkinson desease, looked much better against Berbick than Tyson looked against Danny Williams. And Berbick is MUCH better than Danny Williams.

Yeah that's true -- but everybody says Tyson was at his best at 21... Tyson crushed ATG Light Heavyweight Michael Spinks in 90 seconds at that age... Ali struggled mightily to beat mediocre Light Heavyweight Doug Jones at the same age... Peak for peak, I believe Tyson beats Ali because Ali had the perfect style for Mike to look good against.. The way Mike ran over Holmes, Spinks, Truth Williams, and Berbick, he beats Ali Quick.. Nobody else ever knocked Larry Holmes out. Nobody else ever knocked Michael Spinks out---so it's not a big deal if you've never been knocked out. They weren't real big and strong and they lacked firepower, so Mike ran them over. Ali had the same vulnerabilities they had.

The guys who beat a prime Tyson---I would say Douglas, Holyfield, and Lewis---were big, tall, strong, and fast. Holyfield wasn't that big and tall and he didn't punch super hard, but he trained like an SOB for every fight. He could fight inside and outside. He could put a head on you. He built himself up like crazy, and was a rock solid 218 for Tyson. Holyfield was a strong guy when he was 34. Maybe that was his peak. People forget that Foreman was only 217 for his best fight of his life. He looked so formidable versus Frazier because he was ripped like a rock... It makes a big difference how well you train and how strong you feel. If you know you've done everything humanly possible that could be done.

Lewis beat a prime Tyson? Really?

[Kalan]

They were both prime fighters... Prime is not peak... Peak is your best fight ever.. Prime is when you can still perform fairly well and are expected by many to win a big fight.. Obviously a lot of people expected Tyson to beat both Holyfield and Lewis when he fought them and he drew a lot of bets.

Tyson was younger than Lewis but wasn't trained that well for the fight... He wasn't well trained for Douglas either and he was only 23...

[Tomasino]

They were both prime fighters... Prime is not peak... Peak is your best fight ever.. Prime is when you can still perform fairly well and are expected by many to win a big fight.. Obviously a lot of people expected Tyson to beat both Holyfield and Lewis when he fought them and he drew a lot of bets.

Tyson was younger than Lewis but wasn't trained that well for the fight... He wasn't well trained for Douglas either and he was only 23...

I can't agree with that. Everyone anywhere knows Mike was shot completely in the Lewis fight.

[elmersalsa]

Well, if odds went to 9-5 it's obvious that many people bet on Ali. Casuals are what they are. The want to believe in unbeliveable. And, by the way, Lewis himself said many times he was at his absolute best in Rahman-2 fight. In my opinion, his first fight against Holyfield and second fight against Rahman were by far his best, his peak performances. And Tyson fight was just 7 months after Lewis demolished Rahman in epic performance. But I agree that Lennox looked slightly slower against Tyson than before. But he was only slightly worse than his peak version, while Tyson was beyond shot. Even Ali, who who also beyond shot and had Parkinson desease, looked much better against Berbick than Tyson looked against Danny Williams. And Berbick is MUCH better than Danny Williams.

Yeah that's true -- but everybody says Tyson was at his best at 21... Tyson crushed ATG Light Heavyweight Michael Spinks in 90 seconds at that age... Ali struggled mightily to beat mediocre Light Heavyweight Doug Jones at the same age... Peak for peak, I believe Tyson beats Ali because Ali had the perfect style for Mike to look good against.. The way Mike ran over Holmes, Spinks, Truth Williams, and Berbick, he beats Ali Quick.. Nobody else ever knocked Larry Holmes out. Nobody else ever knocked Michael Spinks out---so it's not a big deal if you've never been knocked out. They weren't real big and strong and they lacked firepower, so Mike ran them over. Ali had the same vulnerabilities they had.

The guys who beat a prime Tyson---I would say Douglas, Holyfield, and Lewis---were big, tall, strong, and fast. Holyfield wasn't that big and tall and he didn't punch super hard, but he trained like an SOB for every fight. He could fight inside and outside. He could put a head on you. He built himself up like crazy, and was a rock solid 218 for Tyson. Holyfield was a strong guy when he was 34. Maybe that was his peak. People forget that Foreman was only 217 for his best fight of his life. He looked so formidable versus Frazier because he was ripped like a rock... It makes a big difference how well you train and how strong you feel. If you know you've done everything humanly possible that could be done.

Lewis beat a prime Tyson? Really?

[elmersalsa]

The " proof " has been shown to you though NEVER by me, because I honestly believe everytime you breathe in, you are stealing someone else's oxygen. If you are too dumb to understand it, again that is your problem.

Find concrete proof for crying out loud, moron!

What has been posted is more than enough proof for scum like you.

The "proof" was NOT GOOD ENOUGH. Good bye!