I wonder how JCCJr will look at 164.5, if it's hard for him to make 168 lbs ?

[apollo creed]

I must say that Oscar and Canelo are some evil conmen by trying to do this fight against Jr at this weight. Even with all top nutrition and meds in the world Jr would look sick and drained as fuk.

[Ossyrules]

I agree, I'm not a fan of catch weights tbh, although if 2 guys agree to it what can you do?

The theory is good, 2 guys from different weights making a super fight happen by both conceding either side to make it happen

The reality is the extortionist types fleece it as much as they can, as there's always one side that "need" the fight more than the other, call it money or opportunity etc.

Canelo and golden boy are the first and won't be the last but it still stinks imo. If canelo wants to fight Chavez at super middle it should be 168 limit.

Out of interest wasn't it ray Leonard who was a pioneer of catch weights!?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I agree, I'm not a fan of catch weights tbh, although if 2 guys agree to it what can you do?

The theory is good, 2 guys from different weights making a super fight happen by both conceding either side to make it happen

The reality is the extortionist types fleece it as much as they can, as there's always one side that "need" the fight more than the other, call it money or opportunity etc.

Canelo and golden boy are the first and won't be the last but it still stinks imo. If canelo wants to fight Chavez at super middle it should be 168 limit.

Out of interest wasn't it ray Leonard who was a pioneer of catch weights!?

Leonard certainly used them to his advantage, but they date back long before him. He pioneered dragging a champion out of his weight class and making him defend his title because he was jealous of hearns. Not sure when the first one was, I think Joe Walcott had a couple, I know Armstrong did.

[Enlightened-One]

I agree, I'm not a fan of catch weights tbh, although if 2 guys agree to it what can you do?

The theory is good, 2 guys from different weights making a super fight happen by both conceding either side to make it happen

The reality is the extortionist types fleece it as much as they can, as there's always one side that "need" the fight more than the other, call it money or opportunity etc.

Canelo and golden boy are the first and won't be the last but it still stinks imo. If canelo wants to fight Chavez at super middle it should be 168 limit.

Out of interest wasn't it ray Leonard who was a pioneer of catch weights!?

Leonard certainly used them to his advantage, but they date back long before him. He pioneered dragging a champion out of his weight class and making him defend his title because he was jealous of hearns. Not sure when the first one was, I think Joe Walcott had a couple, I know Armstrong did.

How many fights did Ray Leonard actually do this? Seriously, cause this is the first time I've heard this accusation.

Donny Lalonde said in an interview that the catchweight wasn't an issue for him, as he'd occasionally dropped around the 167lbs mark anyway before his bout against Sugar Ray.

Other than that, I'm unfamiliar with other instances where Sugar Ray engaged in catchweight bouts, but I'm willing to acquire knowledge of this if it is true.

[apollo creed]

Canelo is a big dude himself. 168 would have not been such a 'sacrifice' for him since I think both fighters will weigh similar on fight night.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I agree, I'm not a fan of catch weights tbh, although if 2 guys agree to it what can you do?

The theory is good, 2 guys from different weights making a super fight happen by both conceding either side to make it happen

The reality is the extortionist types fleece it as much as they can, as there's always one side that "need" the fight more than the other, call it money or opportunity etc.

Canelo and golden boy are the first and won't be the last but it still stinks imo. If canelo wants to fight Chavez at super middle it should be 168 limit.

Out of interest wasn't it ray Leonard who was a pioneer of catch weights!?

Leonard certainly used them to his advantage, but they date back long before him. He pioneered dragging a champion out of his weight class and making him defend his title because he was jealous of hearns. Not sure when the first one was, I think Joe Walcott had a couple, I know Armstrong did.

How many fights did Ray Leonard actually do this? Seriously, cause this is the first time I've heard this accusation.

Donny Lalonde said in an interview that the catchweight wasn't an issue for him, as he'd occasionally dropped around the 167lbs mark anyway before his bout against Sugar Ray.

Other than that, I'm unfamiliar with other instances where Sugar Ray engaged in catchweight bouts, but I'm willing to acquire knowledge of this if it is true.

I can't be explaining shit to you all of the time. First off, lalonde did what he had to do to get the fight. Follow him on fb, he certainly does not say it wasn't a problem. Secondly, hearns only got a rematch because ray thought he was shot, but me made him boil down to 162 just in case. Another one is Whitaker/JCC. Chavez apologists say he wasn't a welter, but that was a catch-weight too.

[Enlightened-One]

Leonard certainly used them to his advantage, but they date back long before him. He pioneered dragging a champion out of his weight class and making him defend his title because he was jealous of hearns. Not sure when the first one was, I think Joe Walcott had a couple, I know Armstrong did.

How many fights did Ray Leonard actually do this? Seriously, cause this is the first time I've heard this accusation.

Donny Lalonde said in an interview that the catchweight wasn't an issue for him, as he'd occasionally dropped around the 167lbs mark anyway before his bout against Sugar Ray.

Other than that, I'm unfamiliar with other instances where Sugar Ray engaged in catchweight bouts, but I'm willing to acquire knowledge of this if it is true.

I can't be explaining poo to you all of the time. First off, lalonde did what he had to do to get the fight. Follow him on fb, he certainly does not say it wasn't a problem. Secondly, hearns only got a rematch because ray thought he was shot, but me made him boil down to 162 just in case. Another one is Whitaker/JCC. Chavez apologists say he wasn't a welter, but that was a catch-weight too.

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

As usual, you're wrong and unwilling to learn. Your death would please me.

[Enlightened-One]

As usual, you're wrong and unwilling to learn. Your death would please me.

That's the difference between me and you... I argue with real-world facts but you resort to insults when you are unable to challenge someone that has researched their claims.

You persistently portray yourself as the Oracle of the sport of boxing, but sadly you resort to insults 100% of the time whenever your knowledge is fact-checked.

Why do you lie so much? Is your real-world existence so dire that you feel compelled to resort to lies and abuse whenever you cannot possibly defend oneself?

Why lie? Seriously, why lie all the time? It's merely an internet discussion forum, so why lie?

Do you really need validation from anonymous middle-aged males? Is your life so empty? Are you that lonely?

[apollo creed]

http://photo.BS.com/uploads/chavez-jr_1.jpg

' I weighed 178 pounds on Wednesday night' - Chavez Jr. Let's say he gets down to the weight of 164.5 but this is not a role in a movie, this is a fooking 12 rds real profesional boxing match.

[ValMar]

http://photo.BS.com/uploads/chavez-jr_1.jpg

' I weighed 178 pounds on Wednesday night' - Chavez Jr. Let's say he gets down to the weight of 164.5 but this is not a role in a movie, this is a fooking 12 rds real profesional boxing match.

You are right, 100 %.....

[apollo creed]

http://photo.BS.com/uploads/chavez-jr_1.jpg

' I weighed 178 pounds on Wednesday night' - Chavez Jr. Let's say he gets down to the weight of 164.5 but this is not a role in a movie, this is a fooking 12 rds real profesional boxing match.

You are right, 100 %.....

I reckon Jr's stamina, power and punch resistance will tend to none after 5-6 rds. Canelo is a sneaky ginger, 164.5 lbs is gonna suit him very well.

[Counter-puncher]

'Sneaky ginger'

[apollo creed]

'Sneaky ginger'

'sneaky gingerboy'

[Badhusker]

How many fights did Ray Leonard actually do this? Seriously, cause this is the first time I've heard this accusation.

Donny Lalonde said in an interview that the catchweight wasn't an issue for him, as he'd occasionally dropped around the 167lbs mark anyway before his bout against Sugar Ray.

Other than that, I'm unfamiliar with other instances where Sugar Ray engaged in catchweight bouts, but I'm willing to acquire knowledge of this if it is true.

I can't be explaining poo to you all of the time. First off, lalonde did what he had to do to get the fight. Follow him on fb, he certainly does not say it wasn't a problem. Secondly, hearns only got a rematch because ray thought he was shot, but me made him boil down to 162 just in case. Another one is Whitaker/JCC. Chavez apologists say he wasn't a welter, but that was a catch-weight too.

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

The Leonard vs Hearns rematch was at a catchweight, with terms dictated by Leonard that huge financial penalties would apply to anyone weighing more than 164. (It was a super-middleweight bout) Leonard did the same thing as Canelo being the 160 champ, and demanding 155. http://boxrec.com/media/index.php?title=Fight:3521 That information took me about 2 minutes to find.

Leonard claimed he had silver dollars in his pockets for the LaLonde weigh in, that added about 5 lbs. He also admitted that Hearns deserved the win.

[Ossyrules]

How many fights did Ray Leonard actually do this? Seriously, cause this is the first time I've heard this accusation.

Donny Lalonde said in an interview that the catchweight wasn't an issue for him, as he'd occasionally dropped around the 167lbs mark anyway before his bout against Sugar Ray.

Other than that, I'm unfamiliar with other instances where Sugar Ray engaged in catchweight bouts, but I'm willing to acquire knowledge of this if it is true.

I can't be explaining poo to you all of the time. First off, lalonde did what he had to do to get the fight. Follow him on fb, he certainly does not say it wasn't a problem. Secondly, hearns only got a rematch because ray thought he was shot, but me made him boil down to 162 just in case. Another one is Whitaker/JCC. Chavez apologists say he wasn't a welter, but that was a catch-weight too.

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

[dickbelden]

YES---leonard made tommie fight @ the catchweight of 164--- i remember it well---tommie never fought below 168 again. also lalonde never made 168 after the leonard fight. leonard weighed in @165 with rolls of silver dollars in his pockets. http://www.thefightcity.com/nov-7-1988- ... s-lalonde/ http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/on-this ... divisions/

[Badhusker]

YES---leonard made tommie fight @ the catchweight of 164--- i remember it well---tommie never fought below 168 again. also lalonde never made 168 after the leonard fight. leonard weighed in @165 with rolls of silver dollars in his pockets. http://www.thefightcity.com/nov-7-1988- ... s-lalonde/ http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/on-this ... divisions/

Wasn't the Leonard vs Lalonde fight at 168 because it was for both the 168 and 175 belts?

[dickbelden]

the fight was for both the 168 & 175 pound WBC titles.

[Enlightened-One]

I can't be explaining poo to you all of the time. First off, lalonde did what he had to do to get the fight. Follow him on fb, he certainly does not say it wasn't a problem. Secondly, hearns only got a rematch because ray thought he was shot, but me made him boil down to 162 just in case. Another one is Whitaker/JCC. Chavez apologists say he wasn't a welter, but that was a catch-weight too.

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

Can you please do me a favour and provide some evidence of your "fact", because I couldn't find any? I'm not saying you're wrong, but this is the first time I've heard about this and I'm genuinely intrigued? I want to learn more about this.

I've spent a fair bit of time researching this, but I couldn't find anything from a reliable source, other than a few comments on various boxing forums.

In my mind, the Leonard-Hearns "catchweight" stipulation is a bit like the "Mandela Effect", since multiple people share a common memory of something that either didn't happen or where the is no proof of it having ever occurred.

[Covfefe]

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

Can you please do me a favour and provide some evidence of your "fact", because I couldn't find any? I'm not saying you're wrong, but this is the first time I've heard about this and I'm genuinely intrigued? I want to learn more about this.

I've spent a fair bit of time researching this, but I couldn't find anything from a reliable source, other than a few comments on various boxing forums.

In my mind, the Leonard-Hearns "catchweight" stipulation is a bit like the "Mandela Effect", since multiple people share a common memory of something where the is no proof of it having ever occurred.

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Sugar ... d_meeting)
http://roundbyroundboxing.com/flashback ... i-the-war/

11.30 Lampley mentions that there was a 164 lb weight limit in their contracts.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LXPYyp4ELUE

[SFW]

I have spoken to Lalonde before, and it most certainly was hard to make 168 and it did have an adverse affect. I've seen him mention it before in interviews as well. Try reading Best I've faced, Donny mentions it there too I believe. So don't buy the bullshit folks. It had an effect in Leonard/Lalonde. Any type of weight stipulation has an impact, some small some big, or it wouldn't be in place.

[Counter-puncher]

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

Can you please do me a favour and provide some evidence of your "fact", because I couldn't find any? I'm not saying you're wrong, but this is the first time I've heard about this and I'm genuinely intrigued? I want to learn more about this.

I've spent a fair bit of time researching this, but I couldn't find anything from a reliable source, other than a few comments on various boxing forums.
.

Have you been following boxing long?

[Enlightened-One]

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

Can you please do me a favour and provide some evidence of your "fact", because I couldn't find any? I'm not saying you're wrong, but this is the first time I've heard about this and I'm genuinely intrigued? I want to learn more about this.

I've spent a fair bit of time researching this, but I couldn't find anything from a reliable source, other than a few comments on various boxing forums.
.

Have you been following boxing long?

I have been following the sport for a very long time, but that doesn’t mean that I’m someone that possesses profound and infinite knowledge of every single aspect of boxing.

A lot of people lie and pretend they know everything, but from personal experience, this cannot possibly be true.

The problem with forums is that people often make claims that are often proven to be utter nonsense when fact-checked. This is because people say things to either support their “heroes” or attack the people they believe to be “villains”… and there’s no in-between – no room for the objective truths of reality, which is the reason why I always check any claims that I believe to be “weird”.

In regards to the “Leonard-Hearns catchweight” claim, many people seem to believe that this is true, but I cannot find any evidence of it. If it was such a widely-know “fact”, as most people claim is the case, then why isn’t there any proof?

Like I said before, I don’t know if this rumour is true or not, but I wouldn’t mind receiving some form of verification. I like to acquire knowledge and there’s nothing wrong with that. I don’t want to go down the lazy route of trusting hearsay.

In my mind though, whenever a “claim” is utterly impossible to prove, then the likelihood is that it’s usually false.

[Ossyrules]

Donny Lalonde has stated several times that he had no problem making weight for the Ray Leonard fight and he also claimed that he felt great on fight night. This is an undeniable truth!

And to be honest, I cannot find any evidence of Sugar Ray Leonard requesting a catch weight to face Thomas Hearns in their rematch. It may or may not be true, but either way, the evidence isn't easy to find.

Even if what you said about the catch weight was accurate, this was possibly the most redundant contractual weight stipulation in the history of the sport of boxing.

If you take one look at the Hitman’s career, you’ll find that he competed as a middleweight for two of his three bouts preceding the Ray Leonard rematch, which covered a two-year timeframe.

Tommy weighed 165½lbs against James Kinchen and was only three pounds lighter when he faced Leonard. Sugar Ray went from 165lbs against Lalonde to 160lbs against Hearns.

Your claim about the ‘Hitman’ boiling down 162½lbs to face Leonard is laughable. He wouldn’t have had any trouble making that weight and he even said so.

Your comments about Whitaker and Chavez Sr. are out-of-scope of the question I posed to you, so I won’t comment on that.

Leonard dictated a catchweight to Hearns. That's an absolute fact. I have no citation but it's a absolute fact Hearns was not allowed to weigh in at the division limit.

You can call it laughable, but if it's not a big deal why stipulate? Why did mayweather stipulate lower weight for canelo, why did cotto do it at middleweight? It's only a few pounds. That my friend makes a big difference.

All these are facts not an opinion. It's happened

Can you please do me a favour and provide some evidence of your "fact", because I couldn't find any? I'm not saying you're wrong, but this is the first time I've heard about this and I'm genuinely intrigued? I want to learn more about this.

I've spent a fair bit of time researching this, but I couldn't find anything from a reliable source, other than a few comments on various boxing forums.

In my mind, the Leonard-Hearns "catchweight" stipulation is a bit like the "Mandela Effect", since multiple people share a common memory of something that either didn't happen or where the is no proof of it having ever occurred.

do me a favour! There's 6 or 7 links posted have you tried them?