Did Wlad deliberately let Joshua get away?

[Loki]

Ok, so at 41 Wlad was just in pretty much his best shape ever, showed loads of abilities to a greater extent than he had before, and had all his power and precision there.

It's not hard to see what's being suggested--basically that at 41, and inactive for 18 months, Wlad achieved his peak against AJ.

I disagree with some of this, at 37, Wlad would've finished him. The performance was offensively amazing, including the comeback, but there is a big difference between 41 and 36. If you add that he looked woeful against Fury and hasn't fought in 18 months, perhaps in defeat his performance was arguably his best.

[crusader]

I actually agree--I was just summing up what other posters have suggested.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

You're inventing that. One of the reasons I find it to be his most impressive performance is due to his age. I can only assume others feel the same way. Mercer was one of Holmes best performances, Hopkins/Tarver & Pavlik, Duran/Barkley, Morales/Maidana, etc..

And he's always in great shape, every fight of his career.

[crusader]

You're inventing that. One of the reasons I find it to be his most impressive performance is due to his age. I can only assume others feel the same way. Mercer was one of Holmes best performances, Hopkins/Tarver & Pavlik, Duran/Barkley, Morales/Maidana, etc..

Not inventing that all, and perhaps you should read harder (had to come back for more than a I see) .

Blowe has suggested that he showed several abilities to a greater extent before, that all his power and precision was there, and that he was in career best shape, or close to it. It's all there on this forum for you to see.

If someone thinks Wlad was really that good, being in roughly career best shape and showing more ability than he ever had, they're essentially arguing that it was against AJ, at 41 years old, that he reached his peak.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

You're inventing that. One of the reasons I find it to be his most impressive performance is due to his age. I can only assume others feel the same way. Mercer was one of Holmes best performances, Hopkins/Tarver & Pavlik, Duran/Barkley, Morales/Maidana, etc..

Not inventing that all, and perhaps you should read harder (had to come back for more than a I see) .

Blowe has suggested that he showed several abilities to a greater extent before, that all his power and precision was there, and that he was in career best shape, or close to it. It's all there on this forum for you to see.

If someone thinks Wlad was really that good, being in roughly career best shape and showing more ability than he ever had, they're essentially arguing that it was against AJ, at 41 years old, that he reached his peak.

I haven't read him claim that Wlad was in his prime. I've only read posters like yourself claim that people have. I get it, it's annoying when longtime haters give props and rob you of throwing it in their face. Whatever, carry on with the fantasy.

[Bard of Boxrec]

We know Wlad's prime was a certain time period, some disagree exactly when, point is it's not now as he is 41 and there has been somewhat of a decline in previous fights, as punchdrunk pointed out and I never disagreed with.

It's hard to explain how something as anomalous as Wlad's performance the other night happened. That's what an anomaly is. Maybe the fabled 'The time out of the ring could do him good!' was actually true this time, maybe he found God, maybe he found a Himalayan salt chamber he liked.

Whatever happened though, the rareness of the event doesn't mean we should ignore what was in front of us to appease stats and orthodoxies; in fact, it's baffling that some people have done that. Many, many others, though, could see Wlad looked awesome. His power was clearly there. His movement, fluidity, volume and intensity were sparkling. He had heart for days. It was all there, and it was a great thing.

[crusader]

You're inventing that. One of the reasons I find it to be his most impressive performance is due to his age. I can only assume others feel the same way. Mercer was one of Holmes best performances, Hopkins/Tarver & Pavlik, Duran/Barkley, Morales/Maidana, etc..

Not inventing that all, and perhaps you should read harder (had to come back for more than a I see) .

Blowe has suggested that he showed several abilities to a greater extent before, that all his power and precision was there, and that he was in career best shape, or close to it. It's all there on this forum for you to see.

If someone thinks Wlad was really that good, being in roughly career best shape and showing more ability than he ever had, they're essentially arguing that it was against AJ, at 41 years old, that he reached his peak.

I haven't read him claim that Wlad was in his prime. I've only read posters like yourself claim that people have. I get it, it's annoying when longtime haters give props and rob you of throwing it in their face. Whatever, carry on with the fantasy.

Carry on missing the point.

If a boxer performs with greater ability and execution than he has at any other point in his career, I think it's fair to say that in this fight the boxer reached their peak. So, if Wlad was in career best shape, took the right approach, and showed more ability than ever against AJ, it's essentially being suggested that he reached his peak at 41, following nearly 70 fights, 21 years pro, and 18 months of inactivity.

You can't seem to tell me what's wrong with this reasoning, and instead are resorting to strawmen. For the record, I think 'prime' (not what I've been focusing on) best describes a stretch of performances, rather than just one fight in particular.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

We know Wlad's prime was a certain time period, some disagree exactly when, point is it's not now as he is 41 and there has been somewhat of a decline in previous fights, as punchdrunk pointed out and I never disagreed with.

It's hard to explain how something as anomalous as Wlad's performance the other night happened. That's what an anomaly is. Maybe the fabled 'The time out of the ring could do him good!' was actually true this time, maybe he found God, maybe he found a Himalayan salt chamber he liked.

Whatever happened though, the rareness of the event doesn't mean we should ignore what was in front of us to appease stats and orthodoxies; in fact, it's baffling that some people have done that. Many, many others, though, could see Wlad looked awesome. His power was clearly there. His movement, fluidity, volume and intensity were sparkling. He had heart for days. It was all there, and it was a great thing.

[crusader]

I don't think Wlad's speed or sharpness were as good as they used to be. I think there have been more capable versions of him in the ring, but he was fresher and so much better than his opposition that he didn't always have to display tools he's had for years.

The heart has always been there too, and it's one of his most underrated qualities. He's always tried to fight on and has never quit when things got tough...people shouldn't' shame him for struggling with Peter, then act like he's never dug deep when he's had to (not accusing anyone in particular, but I see this type of thing a lot).

[punchoutsb]

The funny thing is you've managed to get in such a state you fail to understand that I never said Wlad was in his prime at all. I said it was his best performance and on this night, he showed attributes that matched those of his prime. Do I think he can go back to the well again after this? (or just carry on as he is, if I actually believed he was in his prime) Nope. Do I think he can reign for another 10 years, as you seem to think I implied? Errr, no. So I guess that was your last perceived falsehood of mine quashed. sorry

And you have yet again missed the point as well; I have no problem with the suggestion this was Wlad's best performance. It's the fact that you think his abilities such as speed, timing and power "matched those of his prime" that shows me you haven't the foggiest

I don't think Wlad's speed or sharpness were as good as they used to be. I think there have been more capable versions of him in the ring, but he was fresher and so much better than his opposition that he didn't always have to display tools he's had for years.

The heart has always been there too, and it's one of his most underrated qualities. He's always tried to fight on and has never quit when things got tough...people shouldn't' shame him for struggling with Peter, then act like he's never dug deep when he's had to (not accusing anyone in particular, but I see this type of thing a lot).

This.

[Bard of Boxrec]

Aaaaand just when you thought the conversation had finally turned civil and constructive, back comes punchy with his arms full of mud

[punchoutsb]

We know Wlad's prime was a certain time period, some disagree exactly when, point is it's not now as he is 41 and there has been somewhat of a decline in previous fights, as punchdrunk pointed out and I never disagreed with.

It's hard to explain how something as anomalous as Wlad's performance the other night happened. That's what an anomaly is. Maybe the fabled 'The time out of the ring could do him good!' was actually true this time, maybe he found God, maybe he found a Himalayan salt chamber he liked.

Whatever happened though, the rareness of the event doesn't mean we should ignore what was in front of us to appease stats and orthodoxies; in fact, it's baffling that some people have done that. Many, many others, though, could see Wlad looked awesome. His power was clearly there. His movement, fluidity, volume and intensity were sparkling. He had heart for days. It was all there, and it was a great thing.

Or *maybe* it was always there, you just didn't want to see and since he was in his prime he never allowed opponents the chance to make him need to dip into his entire arsenal?

Nah, the Himalayan salt chamber surely makes more sense

[Bard of Boxrec]

We know Wlad's prime was a certain time period, some disagree exactly when, point is it's not now as he is 41 and there has been somewhat of a decline in previous fights, as punchdrunk pointed out and I never disagreed with.

It's hard to explain how something as anomalous as Wlad's performance the other night happened. That's what an anomaly is. Maybe the fabled 'The time out of the ring could do him good!' was actually true this time, maybe he found God, maybe he found a Himalayan salt chamber he liked.

Whatever happened though, the rareness of the event doesn't mean we should ignore what was in front of us to appease stats and orthodoxies; in fact, it's baffling that some people have done that. Many, many others, though, could see Wlad looked awesome. His power was clearly there. His movement, fluidity, volume and intensity were sparkling. He had heart for days. It was all there, and it was a great thing.

Or *maybe* it was always there, you just didn't want to see and since he was in his prime he never allowed opponents the chance to make him need to dip into his entire arsenal?

Nah, the Himalayan salt chamber surely makes more sense

I'm sure it was always there, the onus was on him to prove it and put it all together, his opposition was poor so he didn't have the chance. Not his fault he didn't have to show his whole skillset/constitution while beating up no marks, not mine either in judging him. Joshua was his greatest performance.

[man]

of course: no.

[man]

Ok, so at 41 Wlad was just in pretty much his best shape ever, showed loads of abilities to a greater extent than he had before, and had all his power and precision there.

It's not hard to see what's being suggested--basically that at 41, and inactive for 18 months, Wlad achieved his peak against AJ.

I disagree with some of this, at 37, Wlad would've finished him. The performance was offensively amazing, including the comeback, but there is a big difference between 41 and 36. If you add that he looked woeful against Fury and hasn't fought in 18 months, perhaps in defeat his performance was arguably his best.

one thing should be mentioned i
think: wlad is 41 but he was not
hit flush in many years. lewis was
way older in terms of ring age in
my opinion at 38, despite having
substantially fewer fights.

[punchoutsb]

We know Wlad's prime was a certain time period, some disagree exactly when, point is it's not now as he is 41 and there has been somewhat of a decline in previous fights, as punchdrunk pointed out and I never disagreed with.

It's hard to explain how something as anomalous as Wlad's performance the other night happened. That's what an anomaly is. Maybe the fabled 'The time out of the ring could do him good!' was actually true this time, maybe he found God, maybe he found a Himalayan salt chamber he liked.

Whatever happened though, the rareness of the event doesn't mean we should ignore what was in front of us to appease stats and orthodoxies; in fact, it's baffling that some people have done that. Many, many others, though, could see Wlad looked awesome. His power was clearly there. His movement, fluidity, volume and intensity were sparkling. He had heart for days. It was all there, and it was a great thing.

Or *maybe* it was always there, you just didn't want to see and since he was in his prime he never allowed opponents the chance to make him need to dip into his entire arsenal?

Nah, the Himalayan salt chamber surely makes more sense

I'm sure it was always there

Then we're done here

[Bard of Boxrec]

And I think we could have been a long time ago

[Impractical Poster]

[montrealsuper]

the wounded fighter is the most dangerous - WK knew that and did not pull the trigger and go all out - respect for AJ - he threw left hooks that barely were off target