worst british heavyweights

Arsenal · Post by **Arsenal** » 23 Mar 2006, 07:26

So here's a question. Did Bruno have a good chin? He had a flash knock down against Tyson, more of a slip and against Smith he was slumped on the ropes and the ref allowed Smith to give him about 15 unanswered punches. But he was never actually knocked down but stopped 5 times. Now if you take the guys with great chins they lost, got knocked down and sometimes stopped. But they are said to have great chins. Bruno is always said to have a glass jaw but he was never knocked down. When he took a shot he just seemed to lose all energy and just stand there. So how do people see it? Surely sometime with a great chin can get knocked down but recover, not someone who is never knocked down but can't survive a big punch?

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 23 Mar 2006, 07:28

dr_devious wrote:Stupid comment on Bruno, I agree with KOJoe that his problems were more to do with stamina and survival instinct than a glass jaw. Bruno was Britains second best ever heavyweight behind Lewis.
I think peope are over-critical of Harrison too. Hes far from Britains worst heavyweight, just a wasted talent. He seemed a bit gun-shy to me against Danny Williams, but I would be too fighting Williams, as would all the other armchair warriors putting posts up about fighters hearts!

How can you be over critical of Harrison & why can't you criticise him just because you are an 'armchair warrior'?

You say that you would probably be scared of the legendary heavyweight Danny Williams; I would be too, that is why I am not a boxer. Unfortunately for boxing fans, Harrison is & he has made a mint out of the sport.

This is boxing we are talking about & there is no place for spinelessnes in this sport.

He can have more physical gifts than Sugar Ray Robinson, but if you don't have any balls, it counts for nothing.

He is definitely the worst of Britain's high profile heavyweights until such time he proves otherwise.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 23 Mar 2006, 07:35

Arsenal wrote:So here's a question. Did Bruno have a good chin? He had a flash knock down against Tyson, more of a slip and against Smith he was slumped on the ropes and the ref allowed Smith to give him about 15 unanswered punches. But he was never actually knocked down but stopped 5 times. Now if you take the guys with great chins they lost, got knocked down and sometimes stopped. But they are said to have great chins. Bruno is always said to have a glass jaw but he was never knocked down. When he took a shot he just seemed to lose all energy and just stand there. So how do people see it? Surely sometime with a great chin can get knocked down but recover, not someone who is never knocked down but can't survive a big punch?

Frank Bruno had a good chin; he was cursed with an over muscled frame, below average stamina & the inability to survive under pressure.

He never suffered repeated knockdowns & was never sparked out for the count of 10.

He took some thunderous shots from the so-called greatest heavyweight that ever lived (1989 Tyson) & apart from a flash knockdown (not a chin shot either) in the 1st round of the 1st fight, he was not decked.

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 23 Mar 2006, 13:31

Arsenal wrote:So he actually recovered to stop Cummings on a TKO in the 7th?

Yes, and I am pretty sure Jumbo is back in The Big House....AGAIN!!!

tigerpomfret · Post by **tigerpomfret** » 24 Mar 2006, 07:00

bruno took massive punches from some of the greatest fighters that even lived???who`s that then?Lewis tysonwitherspoon bonecrusher, don`t make me laugh,lewis was ok,but against the late 60`s 70`s heavies would have won a couple,but would have beenknocked out far to often,as for tyson,so overated,to small,could`nt survive at the long end.
And as for bugner,frank wasn`t good enough to tie has bootlaces
I feel i should opoligise for including Joe Erskine at 5,he was far to classy, better put George (jim)cooper who was a worst fighter than his brother Henry,if that was possible

he cut worst as well

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 24 Mar 2006, 07:03

Syntax Error wrote:
How can you be over critical of Harrison & why can't you criticise him just because you are an 'armchair warrior'?

You say that you would probably be scared of the legendary heavyweight Danny Williams; I would be too, that is why I am not a boxer. Unfortunately for boxing fans, Harrison is & he has made a mint out of the sport.

This is boxing we are talking about & there is no place for spinelessnes in this sport.

He can have more physical gifts than Sugar Ray Robinson, but if you don't have any balls, it counts for nothing.

He is definitely the worst of Britain's high profile heavyweights until such time he proves otherwise.

I agree that Audley was gunshy in his fight against Danny Williams, hes still a very capable boxer and if he discovers some fighting fire can still make an impact. Hes probably the most controversial of Britains high profile heavyweights but he isnt the worst, he would have beaten most of the Brits that have fought for the world heavyweight title, on talent and sheer size.

Crease · Post by **Crease** » 24 Mar 2006, 11:04

AUDLEY HARRISON

Most British guys haven't got the potential or the talent but they've gor balls, and they gruel it out for 12 round before being liformed that they've lost unanimously on points and they're going home with a swollen face for nothing.

BUT Harrison was different, he had the potential and the talent (he proved it, when he won the Olympics) BUT he's fluffed it, he hasn't got the mentality to be a true major world champion.

Slapsie Maxie · Post by **Slapsie Maxie** » 24 Mar 2006, 12:33

Scott Welch

lauded as the next big thing for a while as he knocked out mismatched opponents.

Put on his backside if I remember by James Oyebola(sp?) Came back for a few more easy ones before barely throwing a punch against Akinwande.

Finished with a loss to Julius Francis.

hardly HoF is it?

I think he had very good business interests outside the ring ( property?)so perhaps his heart was just not in it. That fight with Akinwande was almost as noxiously bad as Akinwande's own nadir against Lewis

Slapsie

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 25 Mar 2006, 10:42

Slapsie Maxie wrote:Scott Welch

lauded as the next big thing for a while as he knocked out mismatched opponents.

I seem to remember Scott got most of his hype from Gary Mason whilst he was working for SKY TV.

Slapsie Maxie wrote:I think he had very good business interests outside the ring ( property?)so perhaps his heart was just not in it.

Slapsie

I am sure Scott and his wife owned a number of OAP nursing homes and was a very wealthy man outside of his ring career.

generic screen name · Post by **generic screen name** » 26 Mar 2006, 01:15

All not named Lennox Lewis

RazorKO · Post by **RazorKO** » 26 Mar 2006, 12:42

Audley Harrison is a bad heavyweight, but Bruno is up there as well.

Bruno is what you can a typical overachiever - Nice man outside of the ring but inside he was slow as molasis, threw very few combinations, his chin maybe just as bad as Michael Grants and his stamina was just appaling.

Pitty Coetzee wasnt in his prime when he fought Bruno so he would of put him out of the heavyweight rankings. An old Coetzee also fought Bruno in Wembly which is also a major contribution on why he lost.

Arsenal · Post by **Arsenal** » 26 Mar 2006, 18:40

RazorKO wrote:Audley Harrison is a bad heavyweight, but Bruno is up there as well.

Bruno is what you can a typical overachiever - Nice man outside of the ring but inside he was slow as molasis, threw very few combinations, his chin maybe just as bad as Michael Grants and his stamina was just appaling.

Pitty Coetzee wasnt in his prime when he fought Bruno so he would of put him out of the heavyweight rankings. An old Coetzee also fought Bruno in Wembly which is also a major contribution on why he lost.

Yeah getting stopped is caused by a patizan crowd not the oppenents punches. Razor you really are a stupid, ignorant muppet. Then again I'm not surprized with someone who defends a rapist.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 27 Mar 2006, 03:01

dr_devious wrote:
Syntax Error wrote:
How can you be over critical of Harrison & why can't you criticise him just because you are an 'armchair warrior'?

You say that you would probably be scared of the legendary heavyweight Danny Williams; I would be too, that is why I am not a boxer. Unfortunately for boxing fans, Harrison is & he has made a mint out of the sport.

This is boxing we are talking about & there is no place for spinelessnes in this sport.

He can have more physical gifts than Sugar Ray Robinson, but if you don't have any balls, it counts for nothing.

He is definitely the worst of Britain's high profile heavyweights until such time he proves otherwise.
I agree that Audley was gunshy in his fight against Danny Williams, hes still a very capable boxer and if he discovers some fighting fire can still make an impact. Hes probably the most controversial of Britains high profile heavyweights but he isnt the worst, he would have beaten most of the Brits that have fought for the world heavyweight title, on talent and sheer size.

You are talking about potential & that can be applied to EVERY boxer that ever lived.

You could say that Tommy Hearns would have been greater than SRR if he had Hagler's chin & better stamina, but the fact is, he didn't.

Audley has NO balls, period & you cannot change that. That's part of his make-up & that is why he is IMO the worst high profile UK heavyweight.

He is a boxer, he should not be scared of a man he has insulted for years. He even said that he could beat Danny within 5 fights of turning pro.

Audley is a fool & should not fight again.

HomicideHenry · Post by **HomicideHenry** » 27 Mar 2006, 03:29

Gary Mason myself wasn't that great. He didn't fight a good mix of heavyweights...mostly guys I never even heard of, and had some wins over known fighters. But when he moved up from the British stage to the World Class stage....he was blasted out of there.

Bruno was a good fighter, but I think he had way too much muscle. He was strong man, but having a "body-builder" type frame doesn't suit well with boxing---as you need to have better fluidity in your punches, with bigger arms you don't have that.

Hell Jumbo Cummings had the same problem, his arms were so big he would get tired after a while from swinging punches. Plus Bruno never seemed to know when the hell to get out of the way and protect himself.

I just watched the first Tyson/Bruno fight...and even though he gave Tyson one helluva fight, there was many times that he could have moved out of the way, but opted to stay neutral and slug with Tyson.

I think maybe the WORST British Heavyweight I ever seen...was Shane Woolas. Big huge fat bastard who thought he could do something in boxing but became nothing more than a human punching bag.

Audley Harrison bores me, and his loud mouth makes me flip a channel. He has the size and skills....just not the initative, lacks a killer instinct, plus he never fought anybody in my eyes who was any damn good.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 27 Mar 2006, 04:20

Decagon wrote:There's a difference between a fighter of the past who didn't have something and a fighter of the present, who has shown a weakness in ONE fight. No one who watched the Tucker and White fights could imagine that Buster Douglas would have the heart to knock out Mike Tyson. You have no idea what Harrison has inside.

Neither do you.

Nobody has an idea, but his actions in the Williams fight & the fact that he as taken so long to progress (& still not reached the summit after 5 years & at aged almost 35) are big pointers as to what Harrison really probably has inside.

Yes, he may go on to become greater than Joe Louis, but IMO, I just don't see it.

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 27 Mar 2006, 05:23

I think a large part of the problem with Audley Harrison was the immense hype he generated and his somewhat arrogant attitude. Like I said, he seemed gunshy against Danny Williams, but he did get up off the floor to finish off the fight, which he only lost by split decision.
Decagons parallel with Buster Douglas is spot on - he was timid against Tony Tucker, and went on to KO Tyson a couple of years later.
I wouldnt write off Harrison just yet.

RazorKO · Post by **RazorKO** » 27 Mar 2006, 06:42

Arsenal wrote:
RazorKO wrote:Audley Harrison is a bad heavyweight, but Bruno is up there as well.

Bruno is what you can a typical overachiever - Nice man outside of the ring but inside he was slow as molasis, threw very few combinations, his chin maybe just as bad as Michael Grants and his stamina was just appaling.

Pitty Coetzee wasnt in his prime when he fought Bruno so he would of put him out of the heavyweight rankings. An old Coetzee also fought Bruno in Wembly which is also a major contribution on why he lost.
Yeah getting stopped is caused by a patizan crowd not the oppenents punches. Razor you really are a stupid, ignorant muppet. Then again I'm not surprized with someone who defends a rapist.

It seems that every fighter that goes to the UK now a days is getting beaten because of the sheer abuse these foreign fighters are getting.

Though I wouldnt expect anything who said that he'd rather be a football hooligan which tells me you are a stupid ignorant piece of a shit for a person, you do know that packs of hooligans often attacks families as well getting themselves involved inapropiately with women, and you say I am defending a rapist. Also you say you shouldnt box if they cant take crowd abuse. You ever heard of a polite and sensitive fighter named Floyd Patterson?

Well all this insulting from you is an embarasment so Im ending it here, though I wouldnt expect anything less from a 12 year old.

Syntax Error · Post by **Syntax Error** » 27 Mar 2006, 06:57

dr_devious wrote:I think a large part of the problem with Audley Harrison was the immense hype he generated and his somewhat arrogant attitude. Like I said, he seemed gunshy against Danny Williams, but he did get up off the floor to finish off the fight, which he only lost by split decision.
Decagons parallel with Buster Douglas is spot on - he was timid against Tony Tucker, and went on to KO Tyson a couple of years later.
I wouldnt write off Harrison just yet.

That's a very good point about the hype.

That is the reason why myself in particular have been so scathing.

If he had got on with his career quietly, fought on undercards & fought more often, I wouldn't be as critical of him.

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 27 Mar 2006, 15:17

mercman wrote:For a short time big things were also expected from Welsh heavy Rudi Pika. He was undefeated as a pro but drifted out of the sport and, I think, got mixed up in bad company. He died very young:not sure wether it was murder or suicide though.

Pika took his own life I am sad to say.

Bit more info on one of my threads from years ago here.

http://www.boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11345

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 27 Mar 2006, 15:22

IrishRufusMurphy wrote:Gary Mason myself wasn't that great. He didn't fight a good mix of heavyweights...mostly guys I never even heard of, and had some wins over known fighters. But when he moved up from the British stage to the World Class stage....he was blasted out of there.

Not wishing to split hairs here, but to be fair to Mason I think saying Lewis blasted him out is a bit strong. Mason was never off his feet and put up a brave and gutsy display against the much more talented Lewis, in my opinion anyway.

Crease · Post by **Crease** » 13 Apr 2006, 09:31

I agree with KO artisit, Bruno gave his all against Tyson, just Tyson was a wee it too much for oul Frank.

Audley Harrison should become a politioan.

Here are some fantastic quotes by the mighty "oddball" Harrison.

2001. (Following his first pro victory)
"I will be World Champion, but there's a long way to go".

2004. (Being stripped of the WBF title)
I'm moving on to bigger and better things. The road is clear, watch out! The A Force is coming"!

2005. (Pre-Williams fight)
I will defeat Danny Williams, he will pay. He will learn who Audley Harrison is. This is a stepping stone to my world title bid"...

2005. (post-Williams fight)
"I thought I deserved to win. But this is only a minor set-back, I will still be World Champion".

2006. (3 days ago).
"I need a big name on my record, Dominick Guinn is that big name. It's far from over"...

AYE, AUDLEY, DEAD ON.......

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 13 Apr 2006, 22:07

silkov wrote:If Bruno had a bad chin he would have been koed by Cummings who was a huge puncher.... even Smith only put Frank down after hitting flush about 15 to 20 odd times in that last round... Bruno actually had a good chin, better than Lennox Lewis' I think, his problem was confidence and stamina... the fact that he did what he did in his career speaks volumes for the mans courage and determination and anyone who can knock that is nothing short of a turd....

I agree. Bruno froze when hit clean, I never thought he had a bad chin. Talking of Cummings, he cracked one hell of a shot off Brunos jaw and Bruno was all over the place, 30 seconds earlier and it would've been over cos Bruno was out on his feet.......lucky for him the bell went and saved him.........but he never went down and Cummings could punch.

RazorKO · Post by **RazorKO** » 14 Apr 2006, 08:15

I take back what I said about Bruno in this thread. I was being very harsh and I agree with most here that he was a good fighter. Bruno got stunned when he was hit by a big punch, but he had never been KO'ed to 10 unlike Lewis. As someone pointed out, Bruno was hit by Bonecrusher Smith's 8 punch combination until Bruno finally went own.....but Frank STILL got up and Bruno also was the first man to knock Coetzee out flat and gave Witherspoon a good fight. Bruno deserves praise on his career.

davidsweet · Post by **davidsweet** » 02 Jul 2020, 06:39

Some interesting comments. but the five worst listed is surely wrong. Those of an age, and who have studied their boxing history, would be able to identify the likes of Reggie Meen, Joe Becket, Phil Scott and Jack London as being far and away less worthy than Frank Bruno and Joe Erskine. Erskine is an interesting case. Could have been a near-great if (big word) he had been managed better and as Angelo Dundee actually said , he could have developed something like a telling punch. Beat some good boys all the same: Cooper, Johnny Williams, Richardson, Pastrano and Chuvalo.

Noxy · Post by **Noxy** » 02 Jul 2020, 06:49

Audley got shown up a few times but he was a good fighter. His temperament was possibly suspect but he had the size and skills. He was European champion.

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