Ike Ibeabuchi vs Ernie Shavers

[Autobarn]

I didn't think the fight was great, but. I thought it was pretty universal that Ike deserved to win.

Many felt Tua's cleaner blows warranted him the verdict, including Ring's reporter

I felt it was a superb heavyweight battle, amazing workrate from Ibeabuchi and some of Tua's best sustained power punching.

It certainly didn't suck, but it lacked drama. One thing is certain, Ike never faced a puncher anywhere near the caliber of shavers.

For workrate it was very very high for a heavyweight battle. No lulls whatsoever, rare for big men. And Tua landed some crushing shots - actually in combination - with Ibeabuchi punching with him all the way. Very good fight.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Many felt Tua's cleaner blows warranted him the verdict, including Ring's reporter

I felt it was a superb heavyweight battle, amazing workrate from Ibeabuchi and some of Tua's best sustained power punching.

It certainly didn't suck, but it lacked drama. One thing is certain, Ike never faced a puncher anywhere near the caliber of shavers.

For workrate it was very very high for a heavyweight battle. No lulls whatsoever, rare for big men. And Tua landed some crushing shots - actually in combination - with Ibeabuchi punching with him all the way. Very good fight.

It's up there with Ali/foreman for my most overrated fights.

[Counter-puncher]

if anyone else was defensively-inept enough to let Tua, 5'9 midget/ insert other frazier-type insults here, to punch him 400 times full power in the face, kalan would be screaming how shite they were and that they couldn't box for sh!t

however kalan has a MASSIVE hardon for Ike so those rules don't apply here

[Kalan]

Yes, Byrd had been on the wane for a couple of years when Wlad rematched him. He went 12 in his 2000 prime, where he also KOd Vitali.

We have seen such size disparities in Dempsey flattening Willard, Sharkey and Baer knocking Carnera around, Louis doing a number on B. Baer and Simon, Spinks wrecking Cooney, etc, but nothing ever counts because these men were natural born behemoths whereas Wlad is one who added extra muscle via weight lifting, which also greatly reduces his punch output and stamina in a tough fight.

We know empirically that a 190lb puncher can put giants on their back, but could they catch one as evasive as Wlad? My guess is that those far more intelligent operators of the past would note pretty quickly that his primary defence was leaping backwards in straight lines and elect to make him pay for such obvious readable strategy.

You are badly misinformed about Sharkey-Carnera and other many other fights...

Sharkey didn't knock Carnera around.. Sharkey was knocked COLD by Carnera.. Carnera was an extremely inept athlete but he was so big and strong that he easily out-pointed master boxer Tommy Loughran over 15 rounds.. That was due only to his size and strength. He had nothing else going.

Willard was the most inept boxer of any Heavyweight Champion...and he wasn't that big... He weighed in the 220's or lighter for most of his fights.. He only weighed 230 or more when he was excessively fat... He had no interest at all in Boxing except as a vehicle to make money. He was so disinterested in Boxing that he only defended his title once in 4 years... That's why he looked and fought so horrendously versus Dempsey. Age, disinterest, fat. and ring rust did him in.

Now for Byrd... Part of the reason Byrd went on the wane is Wladimir beat the living crap out of him the 1st time they fought -- and big Ike Ibeabuchi (19 fights) put the little shrimp out.. Byrd didn't KO Vitali and you know it.. Vitali suffered some shoulder problems in training camp, rested the shoulder, and thought he could make it through the fight.. His rotator cuff assembly started to tear early in the fight.. It actually was so completely wrecked that it tore into 2 different pieces. Vitali was winning the fight handily on all scorecards with one good arm -- but was forced to quit while he was well ahead because he figured he might wreck his shoulder for good and he had a whole career ahead of him.. So Byrd's record against good big men was 1 lucky win in 4 tries.

[Tuan_Jim]

Yes, Byrd had been on the wane for a couple of years when Wlad rematched him. He went 12 in his 2000 prime, where he also KOd Vitali.

We have seen such size disparities in Dempsey flattening Willard, Sharkey and Baer knocking Carnera around, Louis doing a number on B. Baer and Simon, Spinks wrecking Cooney, etc, but nothing ever counts because these men were natural born behemoths whereas Wlad is one who added extra muscle via weight lifting, which also greatly reduces his punch output and stamina in a tough fight.

We know empirically that a 190lb puncher can put giants on their back, but could they catch one as evasive as Wlad? My guess is that those far more intelligent operators of the past would note pretty quickly that his primary defence was leaping backwards in straight lines and elect to make him pay for such obvious readable strategy.

You are badly misinformed about Sharkey-Carnera and other many other fights...

Sharkey didn't knock Carnera around.. Sharkey was knocked COLD by Carnera.. Carnera was an extremely inept athlete but he was so big and strong that he easily out-pointed master boxer Tommy Loughran over 15 rounds.. That was due only to his size and strength. He had nothing else going.

Willard was the most inept boxer of any Heavyweight Champion...and he wasn't that big... He weighed in the 220's or lighter for most of his fights.. He only weighed 230 or more when he was excessively fat... He had no interest at all in Boxing except as a vehicle to make money. He was so disinterested in Boxing that he only defended his title once in 4 years... That's why he looked and fought so horrendously versus Dempsey. Age, disinterest, fat. and ring rust did him in.

Now for Byrd... Part of the reason Byrd went on the wane is Wladimir beat the living crap out of him the 1st time they fought -- and big Ike Ibeabuchi (19 fights) put the little shrimp out.. Byrd didn't KO Vitali and you know it.. Vitali suffered some shoulder problems in training camp, rested the shoulder, and thought he could make it through the fight.. His rotator cuff assembly started to tear early in the fight.. It actually was so completely wrecked that it tore into 2 different pieces. Vitali was winning the fight handily on all scorecards with one good arm -- but was forced to quit while he was well ahead because he figured he might wreck his shoulder for good and he had a whole career ahead of him.. So Byrd's record against good big men was 1 lucky win in 4 tries.

I only read your opening two lines so will not comment on the rest, Boxbuzz.

October 12, 1931, Jack Sharkey did win an easy 15 round decision over Primo Carnera, knocking him down in the process. Seems like you are badly informed.

Sharkey was knocked out by Carnera in that murky rematch.

Zero interest in whatever else you wrote under your troll alter ego. I'm sorry you're a failed writer, buzz. I'm sorry no one will pay you to write for a living. But this is not the way to get even with the world.

[BoxBuzz]

Between Saad and Kalan, I need to get my alter ego's in check.

It's so difficult having so many personalities, and having so much to say on these subjects.

Good thing I'm a protected class of citizen, and am free to roam about the cabin, despite my faults.


Just to be sure Tuan....please say your are not "me" as well are you?

As you know....I have no knowledge of these various aspects of my self.


By the way...."BoxBuzz" thinks that the Sharkey Carnera fight was fixed....that Sharkey took a dive, and few champs have been more inept than Carnera.
I think Sharkey accomplished it by allowing Carnera access to his chin. So he kinda sorta went out realistically on his sword.

But had every skillset to win.....and would in 8 out of 10 events with the Alp.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

What's the difference? If you drop kalan you'll just bring back that golden oldie creature.

[BoxBuzz]

What's the difference? If you drop kalan you'll just bring back that golden oldie creature.

As always, if I want your opinion, I'll give it to ya.

[Kalan]

Ibeabuchi gave a strong performance versus Byrd - a remarkable result - but he seemed to be about to lose his rag. Right at the time of the stoppage. If Byrd had been more durable or able to survive I wonder what would've happened.

Anyway great talent that didn't last long.

I love the revisionism... Ike wasn't about to lose a damned thing... He was in complete control of the fight at the finish and the referee saved Byrd's life.

Byrd WAS durable... He beat Tua and Holyfield and survived 19 rounds with Wladimir getting slaughtered all the way.. His chin in his prime was primo.

On the other hand Foreman flagged like crazy against little soft puncher Jimmy Young... He didn't have the balance, hand speed, finesse, or endurance Ike had.. With only 16 pro fights Ibeabuchi went a hard distance fight with David Tua... He threw a record number of punches ... and was never even winded.

[Kalan]

By the way...."BoxBuzz" thinks that the Sharkey Carnera fight was fixed....that Sharkey took a dive, and few champs have been more inept than Carnera.
I think Sharkey accomplished it by allowing Carnera access to his chin. So he kinda sorta went out realistically on his sword.

But had every skillset to win.....and would in 8 out of 10 events with the Alp.

You have nothing to base such nonsense on BuzzBox.. Especially not on the very spotty record of Sharkey who seemed to be slipping badly at that stage of his career.. Sharkey was ready to be taken by anybody with moderate ability.. He won only 4 of his final 12 fights.

Besides getting knocked cold by Carnera, Sharkey also lost to the much smaller Tommy loughran who he stopped easily in an early fight.. Carnera beat Loughran easily in a title defense around that time.. Sharkey drew with Middleweight Mickey Walker, looking terrible -- and he had that bitterly criticized decision over Schmeling.. He wasn't looking on top of it as he came into the 2nd Carnera fight and got iced.. That's what happens when you hit the skids.

[Ambling Alp II]

Between Saad and Kalan, I need to get my alter ego's in check.

It's so difficult having so many personalities, and having so much to say on these subjects.

Good thing I'm a protected class of citizen, and am free to roam about the cabin, despite my faults.


Just to be sure Tuan....please say your are not "me" as well are you?

As you know....I have no knowledge of these various aspects of my self.


By the way...."BoxBuzz" thinks that the Sharkey Carnera fight was fixed....that Sharkey took a dive, and few champs have been more inept than Carnera.
I think Sharkey accomplished it by allowing Carnera access to his chin. So he kinda sorta went out realistically on his sword.

But had every skillset to win.....and would in 8 out of 10 events with the Alp.

I agree, Sharkey was better than Carnera and would have beaten him more often than not. Sharkey was in his prime and hasd no signs of slipping before the fight. However, he gave Carnera an opening and it cost him. It happens once in a while; Lewis got hit with a punch from left field by Rahman. Tate was way a head of Weaver and then clocked in the 15th round.

However, it isn't accurrate to say the fight was fixed. It wasn't.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

What's the difference? If you drop kalan you'll just bring back that golden oldie creature.

As always, if I want your opinion, I'll give it to ya.

Fuckyou

[BoxBuzz]

What's the difference? If you drop kalan you'll just bring back that golden oldie creature.

As always, if I want your opinion, I'll give it to ya.

Fuckyou

I had that comin' I suppose, I'll be more gentle with my rough and tumble clever yet cutting retorts in the future.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

As always, if I want your opinion, I'll give it to ya.

Fuckyou

I had that comin' I suppose, I'll be more gentle with my rough and tumble clever yet cutting retorts in the future.

[Kalan]

Don't try BuzzBox... Just die... Or else start using your brain before you comment -- 1 of the 2.

[BoxBuzz]

I see sleepy and grumpy are in agreement. I commit to walk the path of excellence henceforth.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I'd be happy if I could just put you on ignore like the rest of the trolls. Oh well, I'll just ignore this section of the forum. Your antics have made it the worst on the forum anyway.

[BoxBuzz]

I'd be happy if I could just put you on ignore like the rest of the trolls. Oh well, I'll just ignore this section of the forum. Your antics have made it the worst on the forum anyway.

Well, if that is how it must be, then thanks for the parting sentiment. Won't be the same without ya. Ciao!

[Kalan]

Buzz you take more threads off subject than anybody I've ever seen... Posters desert in droves... You wrecked another thread boy

[zojo]

Ernie was a cruiserweight. Ike was a heavyweight.

Ike wins

[Kalan]

I rewatched Ibeabuchi/Tua over the weekend and despite the tremendous punch output, found it fairly dull. Most of the rounds are identical and it was crying out for one of them to change their tactics and try something more effective.

Not Ibeabuchi... What he was doing was very effective and he cruised to a UD.. He threw punches in record numbers.. It was up to Tua to change tactics.

[Counter-puncher]

I rewatched Ibeabuchi/Tua over the weekend and despite the tremendous punch output, found it fairly dull. Most of the rounds are identical and it was crying out for one of them to change their tactics and try something more effective.

Not Ibeabuchi... What he was doing was very effective and he cruised to a UD.. He threw punches in record numbers.. It was up to Tua to change tactics.

He was effective at letting Tua punch him repeatedly in the face

[Counter-puncher]

Just as a point of comparison:

Ibeabuchi. Allowed tiny short armed Tua to punch him repeatedly in the face

Lewis. Beat Tua whilst hardly taking a punch.

[Autobarn]

Ibeabuchi v Tua dull, I never thought of it that way.

[Autobarn]

Ibeabuchi gave a strong performance versus Byrd - a remarkable result - but he seemed to be about to lose his rag. Right at the time of the stoppage. If Byrd had been more durable or able to survive I wonder what would've happened.

Anyway great talent that didn't last long.

I love the revisionism... Ike wasn't about to lose a damned thing... He was in complete control of the fight at the finish and the referee saved Byrd's life.

Byrd WAS durable... He beat Tua and Holyfield and survived 19 rounds with Wladimir getting slaughtered all the way.. His chin in his prime was primo.

On the other hand Foreman flagged like crazy against little soft puncher Jimmy Young... He didn't have the balance, hand speed, finesse, or endurance Ike had.. With only 16 pro fights Ibeabuchi went a hard distance fight with David Tua... He threw a record number of punches ... and was never even winded.

Hi, I'm not revising anything. Ike did everything right, and showed how to beat a frustrating southpaw, in a truly world class showing of educated aggression. but I saw some kind of shortcoming, not in his quality as a fighter, but in his temperament as he was stopping Byrd. I'm talking about his demeanour, as I could see that this was a headcase. Whatever madness he has, he kept it under control enough to win this fight. But it stopped him having the career he should've.

"Losing his Rag" doesn't mean "losing the fight"