Is it unfair to say Brook quit ?

kbackup408 · Post by **kbackup408** » 28 May 2017, 11:28

Afternoon lads, just watched the fight again and honestly I think the eye was clearly a problem but his Dr's words from the GGG bout about going blind really influenced his decision to take the knee.

Is it unfair to question Brook's heart ?

Boxerbeetle · Post by **Boxerbeetle** » 28 May 2017, 11:37

I don't think anyone disputes that Brook quit? The only real argument I've seen is that some (stupid) people think he should have fought until he was ko'd or damaged irreparably.

kbackup408 · Post by **kbackup408** » 28 May 2017, 11:43

Boxerbeetle wrote:I don't think anyone disputes that Brook quit? The only real argument I've seen is that some (stupid) people think he should have fought until he was ko'd or damaged irreparably.

Aye, I think he put everything into the ring but when you can't see it doesn't give you many options

Tarkus · Post by **Tarkus** » 28 May 2017, 11:47

Kell "the double vision" Brook.

kbackup408 · Post by **kbackup408** » 28 May 2017, 11:53

Tarkus wrote:Kell "the double vision" Brook.

Double Vision vs Glass Jaw in 2018 mate ?

BitPlayer · Post by **BitPlayer** » 28 May 2017, 11:55

kbackup408 wrote:
Tarkus wrote:Kell "the double vision" Brook.
Double Vision vs Glass Jaw in 2018 mate ?

Glass eyesockets. It's a shame.

craigjenkins05 · Post by **craigjenkins05** » 28 May 2017, 11:56

Iv changed my opinion since last night I thought when he went back to his corner after the sixth or seventh he was being paranoid or looking for a way out asking ingle if his eye had gone again now it's come out today he broke his eye socket again this time the other one I think if anyone he was brave to fight on for another four rounds if not foolish

Tarkus · Post by **Tarkus** » 28 May 2017, 12:02

BitPlayer wrote:
kbackup408 wrote:
Tarkus wrote:Kell "the double vision" Brook.
Double Vision vs Glass Jaw in 2018 mate ?
Glass eyesockets. It's a shame.

Titanium eyesockets bebbe.

ScottDetonator · Post by **ScottDetonator** » 28 May 2017, 12:03

I think that Kell has cashed in on his career. The Golovkin fight was for 3-4 million and Spence 2.5-3 million. Takes his career to around 8-10 million depending on what you source you read.

Looking back, Golovkin was the cash out fight. The damage done surely must play a part in this fight against Spence.

Brook won a lot of the early rounds for me but looked to slow and tire too easy - looked old to me.

Spence didn't look like the next undisputed champ either.

Was it bad management putting him in with Golovkin? Or was it just Kell cashing out at the end of his career? Hard to see where he goes now after suffering 2 bad injuries on his eye sockets and carrying the leg injury.

kbackup408 · Post by **kbackup408** » 28 May 2017, 12:06

ScottDetonator wrote:I think that Kell has cashed in on his career. The Golovkin fight was for 3-4 million and Spence 2.5-3 million. Takes his career to around 8-10 million depending on what you source you read.

Looking back, Golovkin was the cash out fight. The damage done surely must play a part in this fight against Spence.

Brook won a lot of the early rounds for me but looked to slow and tire too easy - looked old to me.

Spence didn't look like the next undisputed champ either.

Was it bad management putting him in with Golovkin? Or was it just Kell cashing out at the end of his career? Hard to see where he goes now after suffering 2 bad injuries on his eye sockets and carrying the leg injury.

Great breakdown mate sums up Brook's last year up perfectly I think the weight was a major issue you could see him getting zapped after the 6th. I would be happy for Brook to hang his gloves up and enjoy his life !

Tanzio · Post by **Tanzio** » 28 May 2017, 12:10

ScottDetonator wrote:I think that Kell has cashed in on his career. The Golovkin fight was for 3-4 million and Spence 2.5-3 million. Takes his career to around 8-10 million depending on what you source you read.

Looking back, Golovkin was the cash out fight. The damage done surely must play a part in this fight against Spence.

Brook won a lot of the early rounds for me but looked to slow and tire too easy - looked old to me.

Spence didn't look like the next undisputed champ either.

Was it bad management putting him in with Golovkin? Or was it just Kell cashing out at the end of his career? Hard to see where he goes now after suffering 2 bad injuries on his eye sockets and carrying the leg injury.

X2.

Maybe the final Khan (cash out), but if he retires now nobody could legitimately criticize him for it.

bigjack · Post by **bigjack** » 28 May 2017, 12:14

Tanzio wrote:
ScottDetonator wrote:I think that Kell has cashed in on his career. The Golovkin fight was for 3-4 million and Spence 2.5-3 million. Takes his career to around 8-10 million depending on what you source you read.

Looking back, Golovkin was the cash out fight. The damage done surely must play a part in this fight against Spence.

Brook won a lot of the early rounds for me but looked to slow and tire too easy - looked old to me.

Spence didn't look like the next undisputed champ either.

Was it bad management putting him in with Golovkin? Or was it just Kell cashing out at the end of his career? Hard to see where he goes now after suffering 2 bad injuries on his eye sockets and carrying the leg injury.
X2.

Maybe the final Khan (cash out), but if he retires now nobody could legitimately criticize him for it.

I think the way he is getting busted up now that he stands a good chance of being beaten by Khan.

Tanzio · Post by **Tanzio** » 28 May 2017, 12:18

bigjack wrote:
Tanzio wrote:
ScottDetonator wrote:I think that Kell has cashed in on his career. The Golovkin fight was for 3-4 million and Spence 2.5-3 million. Takes his career to around 8-10 million depending on what you source you read.

Looking back, Golovkin was the cash out fight. The damage done surely must play a part in this fight against Spence.

Brook won a lot of the early rounds for me but looked to slow and tire too easy - looked old to me.

Spence didn't look like the next undisputed champ either.

Was it bad management putting him in with Golovkin? Or was it just Kell cashing out at the end of his career? Hard to see where he goes now after suffering 2 bad injuries on his eye sockets and carrying the leg injury.
X2.

Maybe the final Khan (cash out), but if he retires now nobody could legitimately criticize him for it.
I think the way he is getting busted up now that he stands a good chance of being beaten by Khan.

I agree. Especially if it is at 147.

lefthook82 · Post by **lefthook82** » 28 May 2017, 12:27

It just looked bad tbh. The type of surrender you'd expect from an overmatched Latvian. Its funny but if he had just covered his face and just taken one to the body and acted like he couldn't get up he wouldn't have any criticism

bigjack · Post by **bigjack** » 28 May 2017, 12:54

It is unfair to say he quit,he gave it a good go after receiving the injury and also had the experience of the other eye last time out and obviously what the doctors told him had an impact,very brave effort i thought.

tobyh5 · Post by **tobyh5** » 28 May 2017, 13:13

I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history

Noxy · Post by **Noxy** » 28 May 2017, 13:19

tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history

Yep, I was wondering about that myself. It's awful luck or has his face suddenly become more fragile or what.

craigjenkins05 · Post by **craigjenkins05** » 28 May 2017, 15:02

I'm finding it surprising abot the people saying he should hang m up be lost to the number one middleweight in the world early a stone above his normal weight and to an amazing talent at 147 which was levelish or he potentially was a round or two up when his eye socket went its very unfortunate the same injury he had in his last fight happened again especially when the last one was fresh in his mind especially with the doctors warnings of blindness

rpms · Post by **rpms** » 28 May 2017, 15:24

Watching the fight again earlier I think the bodyshots had a bearing on the fight too.
Spence attacked Brook`s torso hard and consistently didn`t he

Teddy's Toupee · Post by **Teddy's Toupee** » 28 May 2017, 15:51

Noxy wrote:
tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history
Yep, I was wondering about that myself. It's awful luck or has his face suddenly become more fragile or what.

I think tobyh5 might be hinting that he believes Brook's eye socket wasn't broken. I'm inclined to agree. If anyone has any evidence to the contrary I'll happily apologize for my mistaken opinion.

Covfefe · Post by **Covfefe** » 28 May 2017, 15:54

Teddy's Toupee wrote:
Noxy wrote:
tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history
Yep, I was wondering about that myself. It's awful luck or has his face suddenly become more fragile or what.
I think tobyh5 might be hinting that he believes Brook's eye socket wasn't broken. I'm inclined to agree. If anyone has any evidence to the contrary I'll happily apologize for my mistaken opinion.

Ingle told the BBC it was broken.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/boxing/40075800

Noxy · Post by **Noxy** » 28 May 2017, 15:55

Teddy's Toupee wrote:
Noxy wrote:
tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history
Yep, I was wondering about that myself. It's awful luck or has his face suddenly become more fragile or what.
I think tobyh5 might be hinting that he believes Brook's eye socket wasn't broken. I'm inclined to agree. If anyone has any evidence to the contrary I'll happily apologize for my mistaken opinion.

It's official, CT scan according to Sky.

lefty · Post by **lefty** » 28 May 2017, 16:02

Totally off-topic I know, but what happened to the suspect in Brooks stabbing? Did they ever get caught? It's odd that the media stopped talking about it.

There was some guy on youtube (i know, i know) saying that he was stabbed by the ex boyfriend of his fiance/wife and that it was covered up.

No idea if that was total bullshit though.

Jackson328 · Post by **Jackson328** » 28 May 2017, 16:03

tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history

He did quit if you are being pedantic at him taking a 'voluntary knee count' but I think it is very unfair to call him a quitter. As others have already said, this was no 'No Mas' he did the right thing allowing it to be stopped and no-one should seriously criticise him for that in my opinion, he'd given his all and was seriously impaired at that point. Its hard to quit in the 11th round unless you are in big, big trouble, he was 5 minutes from the final bell and could have put his faith in the judges in a home bout but he knew deep down he didn't want to risk any more hard shots on that injured eye. Self preservation is human instinct.

It is a strange one but the eye socket injuries have both happened in his two hardest fights which came consecutively and where he took the most shots, Golovkin and Spence both hit pretty hard and often, especially the former when Kell had no right to be at 160 in the first place. In retrospect it seems the GGG fight was the fight that exposed Brook to getting hit hard and there is no shame in that, he really shouldn't have been in there with him but I assume and hope he got well paid for the defeat.

Team Brook wanted him to step up to 154 after the GGG defeat according to Hearn but Kell was adamant he wanted to keep his IBF 147 belt so he can't blame anyone else for this defeat, he made the weight easily in the end but looked a pale shadow at the halfway point despite being well ahead on the cards (I had him 4-2 up after rd 6). I don't know if he has a problem with the eye socket bones or if its just a coincidence but he has earned well in his last two bouts so maybe he will look to cash out one more time vs Khan or quit

TheLeprechaun · Post by **TheLeprechaun** » 28 May 2017, 16:05

Noxy wrote:
tobyh5 wrote:I am wondering about the actual literal fact his eyesocket has gone twice in a row. Opposite sides. Susceptible, defective in some way? How did he manage a long amateur career and 36 pro fights without it happening but then twice in a row having something happen that I have hardly ever heard happening to any fighters in history
Yep, I was wondering about that myself. It's awful luck or has his face suddenly become more fragile or what.

He's a welterweight and was taking probably the hardest punches hes ever taken from GGG. I'm not surprised his body didn't hold up in that fight. I think draining down to 147 weakened him for the Spence fight and the other eye went.

If he stays at 147 and defends his belt instead of going for the GGG cash out, he might have stood a better chance against the Spences and Thurmans. After quiting like that and going through another surgery where his eyeball will be removed again and another metal plate inserted... It's not good for the confidence is it? The doctors will be telling him to hang them up no doubt. And if he does get into the ring and takes a good right hand to the eye he'll be in crisis mode again thinking he doesn't want to go blind after the fight.

Looks like he has to retire for me.