very misleading, sharkey was on his way to a clear points win before dempsey cheated.Tunney beat Dempsey twice. Sharkey got ko'd by Dempsey.
- also one must remember sharkey was very inconsistent, but in his biggest fights, he ALWAYS brought his A game.
- i wouldnt say tunney was a harderpuncher. sharkey hurt dempsey far more than tunney did. tunney may have floored an off balance dempsey but sharkey had dempsey on the verge of KO in early rounds. i believe dempsey said sharkey hit him harder than tunney.
If you look at their strengths and weaknesses, Tunney has almost every major advantage. Tunney was faster, the harder puncher, had the better chin, was harder to hit, better technical skills, and was a smarter fighter than Sharkey. If Tunney didn't knock out Sharkey, Tunney would win a lopsided decision.
- sharkey also knocked out tommy loughran with 1 punch. tunney could not knock out a green tommy loughran. Sharkey in his prime has a pretty devastating left hook and solid right hand. he had several hand injuries throughout his career which explains his low KO percentage.
- tunney had the better chin? maybe, but who besides dempsey at heavyweight really tested his chin? tunney was unproven at heavyweight. sharkey fought some big heavyweight punchers throughout his career and his only KO loss in his prime was a controverial loss to dempsey in which you could see sharkey grabbing his balls as the ref counted him out. Sharkey defintley should have got the title shot over tom heeney considering the way sharkey handled dempsey and the fact heeney didnt beat him.
- tunney defintley had faster feet which is clear on film. but handspeed is close. jack sharkey had very good handspeed, and tunney also had good handspeed so its close.
- better technicial skills? I would give the edge to tunney. I don't think he is as great as u make him out to be, but he had very good boxing skills, ring smarts, very good movement, he threw very accurate and well timed combos, good jab. however he was very herky jerky, not very smooth , and he kept his hands way too low. one of the reasons dempsey caught him like he did, was because tunney when he backed up into the ropes had his gaurd completley down, his hands were at his waist. hows he gonna block that left hook when his hands are by his waist? I like the way Jack Sharkey boxed. He was more smooth than tunney, better inside fighter, stronger, bigger puncher. the way sharkey leaned in made him an ackward target in there. however, i favor tunney in this matchup cause he was the faster of the two and i see him keeping the fight at a long range and outjabbing sharkey. sharkey would have to get inside on tunney but tunney was very elusive. still i see the ackward capable sharkey confusing tunney and landing his fair share of punches and doing good work on tunney on the inside and landing the harder blows. however tunney CLOSE unanimous dec.
If Tunney didn't knock out Sharkey, Tunney would win a lopsided decision.
tunney would not knock out sharkey. schmeling couldnt and he was a harder puncher than tunney. lopsided?
sharkey at his peak was a great fighter who could do a little bit of everything on film. he was a master boxer and if he could fight 15 even rounds with schmeling, than no way does tunney win a wide decision over a capabable boxer like sharkey. tunney had loads of trouble beating a green tommy loughran.ray arcel called jack sharkey the " greatest heavyweight techncician"
you make it look like tunney was in a different class than these guys in terms of heavyweight division, yet how did tuneyprove this? tunney never fought black fighters and there were some top black fighters of the mid 20s that he could have fought like harry wills, george godfrey, etc. tunney never fought gibbons or loughran when they were in there primes. he never even fought a prime dempsey but i do gime him a lot of credit for beating a still good dempsey twice. schmeling and sharkey beat better heavyweight competition than tunney and proved themselves more but in jack sharkey's case, he also proved himself very inconsitent.
- tunney had just 8 fights against heavyweights, with only 3 of them being top 10 contenders( heeney, past it dempsey, old gibbons). johnny risko was very green at the time. how many fighters did tunney take on that were over 190lb?
bottom line: tunney would not win a lopsided decision. this would be a very close fight.
If Tunney would have kept fighting and fought Schmeling in 1930? Well, we can only speculate since Tunney retired in 1930.
Tunney's skills would probably have declined a little, ( he would have been 33) but she still have most of the same advantages that he had over Sharkey (with the exception of punching power). Tunney should be able to win a relatively comfortable decision over Schmeling.
no way! any declining version of tunney gets thoroughly outpointed by schmeling. schmeling was better than sharkey. tunney would have to be at his best to win. schmeling was a master boxer, who used the lean back in a crouch like charley burley making himself very ackward. schmeling had just as good of defense as tunney. schmeling also kept his right by his chin, and his guard was up a lot more than tunney's, but in fairness schmeling didnt have the speed tunney does to dance and evade the blows. schmeling was defintley the bigger puncher than tunney, and this could spell trouble for tunney. schmeling also was very hard to hit and his reach matched tunney's , so tunney will have trouble working him at long range. tunney's jab will be very effective in this fight, but schmeling will land some hard combos through tunney's low guard during the fight. schmeling was very smart counterpuncher, and this would be a chess match. tunney never faced a first class counterpuncher like schmeling. I think the fight will be even with both outboxing eachother landing there fair share of counterpunches, jabs, and combinations, but I think the harder punching schmeling will land the harder blows and that will be the deciding factor.
schmeling close 15 split tunney
If you would have asked most serious boxing people in the late 1920's or 1930's if they they thought Schmeling or Sharkey was better than Tunney, they probably would have laughed at you. Neither were nearly as well respected as Tunney.
If you would have told most serious boxing people in 1936 prior to louis-schmeling I that Schmeling would beat joe louis, they would probably laugh at you.
- schmeling beat joe louis, who was greater than tunney, so a schmeling win here is not unlikely.
- I watch films, and I think schmeling was just as good if not better than tunney at heavyweight. he certainly accomplished more than tunney at heavyweight.
As far as rating Schmeling over Tunney all time, I don't agree with that either. Schmeling had a great career, but he had some lapses as well. Besides the win over Louis, he had some other nice wins. However, he lost to Hamas, drew with Uzcudun, lost to Baer (very badly) Gains as well as being crushed by Louis. This may seem like nitpicking since these were good fighters, but when you compare him to all time greats you have to mention them.
arn't you the one to pick holes without checking facts!
schmeling was just 19 years old when he lost to gains, he was horribly green and inexperienced.
- baer very badly? i see you havnt seen the fight. the fight was dead even entering the 10th round, in fact schmeling may have been slightly ahead. schmeling suffered a horrible KO, but the fight was dead even when it happened. no way did baer dominate schmeling. i also think this was one of schmelings worst fights, and that schmeling would have beat baer in a rematch. i also might add tunney never fought a fighter like max baer.
- he lost to hamas, BUT CRUSHED HIM IN 9 ROUNDS IN THE REMATCH
- he drew with uzcuden BUT ALSO BEAT UZCUDEN VERY EASILY TWICE
- did you not mention that schmeling also knocked out top contenders and very good fighters johnny risko and young stribling? he knocked out stribling with 1 right hand. THE ONLY TIME IN STRIBLINGS 300 BOUT CAREER HE WAS EVER STOPPED.
* when tunney fought johnny risko, risko was just 22 years old and green.
- schmeling also beat jack sharkey, he was robbed in the rematch.
- however the louis victory should be givem more credit. louis was at the beginning of his prime and i regard louis as the greatest heavyweight of all time. Joe louis was much better than gene tunney, so this victory proves schmeling beat a much better fighter than gene himself. gene tunney can't say the same about schmeling.
schmeling defintley won the 2nd fightHe also had the two controversial fights with Sharkey, and neither really established themselves as the better in that head to head matchup.
you gotta be kidding me. lets see him have 50 fights at heavyweight and then we will see how many losses he has. lets see him fight some of the top black fighters of that era and see how he does.Tunney had at least 8 fights against legitimate heavyweights ( And a few more against ham and eggers). He didn't lose any of them, and won most of them very easily. We know Sharkey couldn't do that, and it's very doubtful that Schmeling would have either.
how come tunney never fought a rematch with a better version of tommy loughran?
why did tunney never fight harry wills in early-mid 20s? how come tunney never fought george godfrey? how come tunney never fought kid norfolk in early 1920s?
-we know sharkey couldnt do that? sharkey was screwed vs dempsey, he proved he was the better fighter than that version of jack. sharkey on his A game desiceley beats heeney.
could tunney beat jack sharkeys heavyweight competition?
- schmeling would have beat tunney's heavyweight competition including far past his prime dempsey.
would tunney have beat schmelings heavyweight competition?? i dont think so, cause he defintley wouldnt beat joe louis.
he was considered a very dangerous fighter at the time, possibly the most dangerous. tunney could have fought him any time, even pre title but never did.
As far as Godfrey, whether some of his fights were fixed or not, the fact remains that he didn't have enough big wins to establish himself as the # 1 contender when Tunney was champion. It's not like Harry Wills not getting a shot against Dempsey.
yes, but they would have been very dangerous fights for tunneyWhen Tunney retired, it wasn't the general opinion that Tunney was ducking Godfrey or Sharkey or anyone else for that matter.
btw i rate schmeling # 17th greatest heavyweight, tunney # 20th greatest heavyweight, and sharkeys in my top 25.
