Ward vs. Kovalev: Who's watching?

[Ricky_]

Watching the stoppage back Mr Weeks breaks them on the ropes... He barely makes Ward take a step back. He was clearly biased. Poor form.

I mentioned that in another thread, dead give away. He seemed to purposefully break them as quickly, and with as little distance as possible so not to break Ward's stride. Abysmal stuff.

[crusader]

Kov has admitted to gassing in many fights, amateur and pro. Stamina is probably his most significant weakness...

[Boxerbeetle]

Kov has admitted to gassing in many fights, amateur and pro. Stamina is probably his most significant weakness...

I saw this interesting quote from Kovalev on Reddit Boxing talking about his camp, not sure if it's been posted on here yet, apologies if so:

I only replaced one man who was in charge of my strength and conditioning . The former specialist didn't give me any recommendations although before the last fight my body was overtrained. A new coach who came instead of him helped me to take my physical condition under a complete control. Before and after training we measured heart rate, blood pressure etc. This would determine what type of training we'll do next whether it's running, walking or gym. Sometimes it's simply going for a walk for a couple of hours. So this aspect was taken under control. I feel I'm not overtrained this time. I almost feel like I didn't do enough somewhere, but the coach says that I should save my energy and desire to fight and give it all away in the ring. He assures that we did enough to be ready for 12 rounds. If this type of program brings success I will stick to it indefinitely.

I'd say this new coach won't be employed for very long, Kovalev's poor engine was even worse than usual...

[Autobarn]

Fighters from Russia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, etc seem to have superior technique and power but seem vulnerable especially after they have peaked and their athleticism, lets them down. They go into a steep physical decline, often having peaked as grown men in the amas (though not the case with Kovalev) and things like injuries really bog them down. Thinking, superlative fighters like Arbachakov and Nazarov, here. And, they can seem genuinely distressed by rough house tactics and illegal or semi legal work - Tszyu wilting under Hatton's low blows and clinching/hitting and now Kovalev with Ward. At their best, when the technique wins out, they can be a joy to watch, especially Kova's beautiful boxing in the first six rounds of the first Ward bout and the efficient work over the second half that should've seen him to a career best win.

[samwbr]

Kosta Tszyu was as rough as they come, dont think he was undone by any rough house stuff just time catching up. it was a great night for Hatton but i think a prime Tszyu would have beaten him.

[boxingknockout]

Fighters from Russia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, etc seem to have superior technique and power but seem vulnerable especially after they have peaked and their athleticism, lets them down. They go into a steep physical decline, often having peaked as grown men in the amas (though not the case with Kovalev) and things like injuries really bog them down. Thinking, superlative fighters like Arbachakov and Nazarov, here. And, they can seem genuinely distressed by rough house tactics and illegal or semi legal work - Tszyu wilting under Hatton's low blows and clinching/hitting and now Kovalev with Ward. At their best, when the technique wins out, they can be a joy to watch, especially Kova's beautiful boxing in the first six rounds of the first Ward bout and the efficient work over the second half that should've seen him to a career best win.

Wow. What a disgusting racist post. Would you make a similar claim against black or African fighters!?

[samwbr]

Fighters from Russia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, etc seem to have superior technique and power but seem vulnerable especially after they have peaked and their athleticism, lets them down. They go into a steep physical decline, often having peaked as grown men in the amas (though not the case with Kovalev) and things like injuries really bog them down. Thinking, superlative fighters like Arbachakov and Nazarov, here. And, they can seem genuinely distressed by rough house tactics and illegal or semi legal work - Tszyu wilting under Hatton's low blows and clinching/hitting and now Kovalev with Ward. At their best, when the technique wins out, they can be a joy to watch, especially Kova's beautiful boxing in the first six rounds of the first Ward bout and the efficient work over the second half that should've seen him to a career best win.

Wow. What a disgusting racist post. Would you make a similar claim against black or African fighters!?

It's not racist, don't be daft.

[CMDY]

I think its worth remembering its quite well know that Kovalev is quite a bit older than his stated age on Boxrec. He even jokes about it himself.

[Autobarn]

Watching the stoppage back Mr Weeks breaks them on the ropes... He barely makes Ward take a step back. He was clearly biased. Poor form.

I mentioned that in another thread, dead give away. He seemed to purposefully break them as quickly, and with as little distance as possible so not to break Ward's stride. Abysmal stuff.

I'd like to see now Ward copes away from home without a referee sympathetic to him or on his side, who won't tolerate his transgressions. I'd like to see how adjustable and mentally strong he is then.

[Autobarn]

Fighters from Russia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine, etc seem to have superior technique and power but seem vulnerable especially after they have peaked and their athleticism, lets them down. They go into a steep physical decline, often having peaked as grown men in the amas (though not the case with Kovalev) and things like injuries really bog them down. Thinking, superlative fighters like Arbachakov and Nazarov, here. And, they can seem genuinely distressed by rough house tactics and illegal or semi legal work - Tszyu wilting under Hatton's low blows and clinching/hitting and now Kovalev with Ward. At their best, when the technique wins out, they can be a joy to watch, especially Kova's beautiful boxing in the first six rounds of the first Ward bout and the efficient work over the second half that should've seen him to a career best win.

Wow. What a disgusting racist post. Would you make a similar claim against black or African fighters!?

Don't be so silly.

They peak early, mostly because they are grown men in the amas able to dominate less experienced, less physically mature opponents. They're mature tactically and physically early in their pro careers and look phenomenal, before wearing out.

These superb fighters have shown some pretty dramatic, drastic fades. Winning championships and looking awesome offensive fighters before the steep decline.

It's a trajectory followed by almost all the great Eastern European and Eurasian fighters. Orzubek Nazarov, Yuri Arbachakov, Kostya Tszyu, Sergei Kovalev now, and Gennady Golovkin has that ragged look about him which is giving me cause for concern. Whoever' strong enough and bold enough to push back Golovkin will have his number.

Sergei Kovalev won that first fight with Ward and it should've been the crowning moment of his career and his ticket to the IBHOF in Canastota. I do believe Kovalev is older than stated, that he's an exceptional technician and the only one with good enough technique to land punches on Andre Ward. But that athletically he appears perhaps not to have it certainly not anymore.

[Autobarn]

I believed that Andre Ward was p4p no.1 before this fight. I based it off of his record, against Barrera and Kovalev at LHW, and Froch, Kessler etc at super middle. I thought Kov won the first fight and was of the belief if anything, Ward didn't deserve to win.

It's funny because second time around he's beaten him by stoppage, but it's more controversy. This is horrible for Kovalev but also not great for Ward, because his talent and performances are being overshadowed by this bullshit.

Weeks has had a nightmare, it looks bad from most angles.

Good post. Ward got 2 wins but neither will get the credit that beating Kovalev should get, since both endings stunk.

i think it's because of every fight seems stacked in his favour

[whiskey]

Ward is a talent, but his wholesome image and politeness hides a very dirty fighter.

The only question we should ask ourselves is was the final blow legal? Everyone can see the shot land right on the Hublot area of Kov's shorts, which is way below the belt line and thus it was a foul.

At best it would have been a warning and a breather, at worst it should have been a count - no way was it a stoppage.

Weeks was absolutely wrong in the way he handled that final 10 seconds.

There is a constant pattern of this in Ward's previous fights. Whereby he gets away with going head-first into opponent's ribs like a billy goat. He was doing it against Kov on Saturday night, whom flagged it to the ref but it was ignored.

Whenever he gets in close, he rams in the head and rubs it around and every ref allows it. Due to Kov's power and strength, Ward was unable to execute the head strategy until the mid point. But eventually he was charging in head-first then wailing to the body. Against lesser fighter's he usually does it straight off the bat and never gets pulled up.

I remember the state of Kessler's face after their fight, and he rightly pointed out that every single dumbell stitch he had was down to Ward's head and nothing else. He never got a point deduction and if that occurred in Kessler's hometown (or maybe anywhere in Europe) he would have been warned and even DQ'd.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1SVvyx8sR0

2.40 "Andre Ward came in like a Billy Goat"

[AntonS]

Fight has had more than sufficient comments in this Forum & Current......Hence LOCKED
What's done is done.....therefore, do yourself a favour & forget it .
Cheers

[Sklar]

Fight has had more than sufficient comments in this Forum & Current......Hence LOCKED
What's done is done.....therefore, do yourself a favour & forget it .
Cheers

Not anymore, dickhead.

[MightyWarrior]

So was Kov just a bully, who got exposed big time once the other guy hit him back, hard ?

Crouching down against the ropes, instead of hitting the other guy back in the balls, I think shows how he would have fared against some of the true warriors a lightheavy, Matthew Saad, Dwight Braxton etc

[Sklar]

I was a little disappointed with Kovalev but mainly impressed with Ward. He's remarkably good.

[Ezzard]

Kov seems a very good one-paced fighter.

But let's not forget most (me included) had him winning a close decision in the first fight. I had him 1 point up going into round 8.

Ward has developed a style of boxing that is highly effective and his head makes up for his lack of top level power (one right hand aside).

I don't blame Ward completely, many of my favourite fighters have been dirty. It's just too obvious that refs have allowed it to happen. The whole career of Ward leaves a bad taste... Not that dissimilar to Mayweather and Hopkins.

The top American fighters used to bring excitement. Mayweather, Hopkins and now Ward always stink the arena out. Often their ref and their judges too.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

So was Kov just a bully, who got exposed big time once the other guy hit him back, hard ?

Crouching down against the ropes, instead of hitting the other guy back in the balls, I think shows how he would have fared against some of the true warriors a lightheavy, Matthew Saad, Dwight Braxton etc

- Prob ko them easy since Kov the better puncher and boxer.

Seems to be quite the denial on the forum that in each fight Kov was warned by the ref more than the sum of his career, wearing the ref as a straight jacket, told he's not allowed the protect himself aginst head first jumps at him.

Quite disturbing for a democracy to see so many blinded, by what? Speaks ill for our future as both a democracy and the future of what is becoming an unwatchable sport. At least Brits had the decency to outlaw bull and bear baiting.

At least with DKing crookery, he put on a personal show of bombast for the rubes to gnash at. Vegas just formless, faceless suits in a rotating cast of crooks that could be said to be representative of big INC in general.

[CaptainSpacerod]

I don''t buy into this line of thought that says Ward has the refs and judges in his pocket. Why would he ? Financially he's no big deal. With Floyd I could see why they would want him to keep on winning but if Ward loses nobody gets hit in the pocket.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I agree, he's what they used to call crafty and officials are incompetent. He generates no money. As I've tried to tell the Povetkin conspiracy theorist, conspiracies aren't concocted without financial gain.

[mickey1975]

Can't people see Ward is just a truly brilliant fighter, yet sly! It doesn't mean Kov, Froch, Dawson, Smigga... Are poor!

[MightyWarrior]

Yep, sometimes boring he may be, but he's a phenomenally brilliant fighter, the definition of someone who always finds a way to win, and he's been in with some of the most fearsome fighters of his generation.

[Ezzard]

It wasn't incompetence. At the very best it was unconscious bias.

Problem is for fans is that it has happened time and time again in Ward's career.

[Autobarn]

It wasn't incompetence. At the very best it was unconscious bias.

Problem is for fans is that it has happened time and time again in Ward's career.

there is a reversal for every situation and one day we will see Ward out of his comfort zone. Maybe the location, maybe the officials. And then that could be the true test of him. And also his undoing.

[Ezzard]

There would be some justice to that but to be honest I just want to see an unbiased ref and judges.