Who were the best Relentless "Pressure" Fighters ?

[Caractacus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LziSgGFaYJs

[Kalan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LziSgGFaYJs

The film on this recording is speeded way up like old time fight films... To make the boxers look better and faster than they are... It's bullcrap all the way... Just show the fight in normal speed because people aren't naive as sh!t!!! Neither of these guys had a jab.. which isn't a no-no for a pressure fighter.

[Caractacus]

The film on this recording is speeded way up like old time fight films... To make the boxers look better and faster than they are... It's bullcrap all the way... Just show the fight in normal speed because people aren't naive as sh!t!!! Neither of these guys had a jab.. which isn't a no-no for a pressure fighter.

sorry,must have been the handful of amphetamines that i took earlier,because i didn't even notice at first.
anyways here is the live American broadcast of Roldan vrs Fletcher(in real-time).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hu3ac7FkZms

[Kalan]

Frazier...Qawi would seem to fit....and the worst one, Leon Spinks.....I really think that's what he thought he was....and he attempted to fit the mold. And nope...didn't work.

Leon became Lineal Heavyweight Champion by beating a highly regarded Heavyweight... and he DIDN'T see himself as a pressure fighter..He WASN'T big, tall, or strong enough -- but Leon DID have a fair amount of speed and athletic ability... What he lacked was skills and experience ... and also self esteem.

The first thing Leon should have done with that money when he became Heavyweight Champion is have his teeth fixed... That would have given him a sense of dignity and stopped all the joksters and comedians.. That was priority number one -- but he listened to mama and that wasn't her priority..

Spinks saw himself as a compact, quick, and skillful boxer-puncher -- but his self image was terrible and he was never given time to develop his skills.. He was pushed into big fights way before he was ready.. That's not really his fault, but the people guiding him.. I ran into Spinks a couple of times at boxing matches, and came away thinking he was too deferential -- and one of the least assertive people who achieved any level of fame and success I ever met.. I felt he needed a Jack Blackburn or somebody who could watch over his affairs and give him a lot of guidance.

He was only 24 when he became Heavyweight Champion and not real swift to begin with.. Even taking into consideration Tyson Fury and Buster Douglas -- I've never seen a Lineal Heavyweight Champion whose career was more of a waste than Leon Spinks'.

[Tomasino]

Frazier...Qawi would seem to fit....and the worst one, Leon Spinks.....I really think that's what he thought he was....and he attempted to fit the mold. And nope...didn't work.

Leon became Lineal Heavyweight Champion by beating a highly regarded Heavyweight... and he DIDN'T see himself as a pressure fighter..He WASN'T big, tall, or strong enough -- but Leon DID have a fair amount of speed and athletic ability... What he lacked was skills and experience ... and also self esteem.

The first thing Leon should have done with that money when he became Heavyweight Champion is have his teeth fixed... That would have given him a sense of dignity and stopped all the joksters and comedians.. That was priority number one -- but he listened to mama and that wasn't her priority..

Spinks saw himself as a compact, quick, and skillful boxer-puncher -- but his self image was terrible and he was never given time to develop his skills.. He was pushed into big fights way before he was ready.. That's not really his fault, but the people guiding him.. I ran into Spinks a couple of times at boxing matches, and came away thinking he was too deferential -- and one of the least assertive people who achieved any level of fame and success I ever met.. I felt he needed a Jack Blackburn or somebody who could watch over his affairs and give him a lot of guidance.

He was only 24 when he became Heavyweight Champion and not real swift to begin with.. Even taking into consideration Tyson Fury and Buster Douglas -- I've never seen a Lineal Heavyweight Champion whose career was more of a waste than Leon Spinks'.

Do you think you'd have beaten Spinks in the ring? Were you both active at the same time?

[BoxBuzz]

Frazier...Qawi would seem to fit....and the worst one, Leon Spinks.....I really think that's what he thought he was....and he attempted to fit the mold. And nope...didn't work.

Leon became Lineal Heavyweight Champion by beating a highly regarded Heavyweight... and he DIDN'T see himself as a pressure fighter..He WASN'T big, tall, or strong enough -- but Leon DID have a fair amount of speed and athletic ability... What he lacked was skills and experience ... and also self esteem.

The first thing Leon should have done with that money when he became Heavyweight Champion is have his teeth fixed... That would have given him a sense of dignity and stopped all the joksters and comedians.. That was priority number one -- but he listened to mama and that wasn't her priority..

Spinks saw himself as a compact, quick, and skillful boxer-puncher -- but his self image was terrible and he was never given time to develop his skills.. He was pushed into big fights way before he was ready.. That's not really his fault, but the people guiding him.. I ran into Spinks a couple of times at boxing matches, and came away thinking he was too deferential -- and one of the least assertive people who achieved any level of fame and success I ever met.. I felt he needed a Jack Blackburn or somebody who could watch over his affairs and give him a lot of guidance.

He was only 24 when he became Heavyweight Champion and not real swift to begin with.. Even taking into consideration Tyson Fury and Buster Douglas -- I've never seen a Lineal Heavyweight Champion whose career was more of a waste than Leon Spinks'.

Hey Kalan, I had the pleasure of being in these guys presence on quite a few occasions. They had dropped into the Club Mali Kai in Hazelwood/Florrisant Mo on a few occasions, where I performed and they would work out publicly at their gym on occasions....also would show up to the late night scene in East St Louis, where I also performed on occasion. I would agree with the self image stuff around Leon...not so much around Michael. But both of these guys were just great human beings, without a bit of vitriol in their good souls. They were about as humble as a person on a world stage could be.

And Michael just had a bad night with Mike....at his best I don't think he would have beaten Mike, (though not impossible if he could survive the early torrents) But he did not have a bit of dishonesty in him. He may well have froze, he surely got whacked, and may just not have had what it would take to keep out of Mikes way in the early going. But that fight was honest. (I'm not saying you question it, you seem to give him good credit, but others have besmirched his honor here, and I always step up to defend this good man, when folks question that performance)

I would agree that Leon saw himself as primarily a boxer puncher, but he did refer to himself on more than one occasion as a guy who put a world of pressure on anyone standing in front of him. So I've described him here, as he had described himself. But I will tell you this.....this good man never saw a party he didn't like, or walk away early from fun, or a good time. Great neighbor, great person to be in the presence of, but maybe not the recipe for a great athlete.

I was a pretty scrawny musician at the time, and had about the same sense of humor as I have here, and would participate in the humor of the ridiculous in their presence. They appreciated my musicianship, and were somewhat kind with their compliments....so I kidded about being "El Kabong" and that they better not test me......thank god they laughed...I took my life into my hands using humor like that around them. That forgiveness is why I still have fingers to type and play my instruments. lol. Leon had more talent than he ever showed, but was more easily distracted by a good time than a dog by a squirrel. Michael had the oddest footwork style I've ever seen. What did you think of the guys footwork? Have you EVER seen anything like it anywhere else? I can't say it looked great, but he sure seemed to make it work for him. Michael was Definitely not in the pressure catagory. He always appeared to me overly relaxed, and in an oddly good mood for a fella in the ring with his life on the line.

Leon also had a sense of humor about his teeth.....I can't remember the exact context...but I overheard him saying words to the effect of ...he was waiting for someone to bring it up to him directly, and he'd think about then...but apparently they are not that apparent/obvious or maybe they are pretty appealing to many. Making fun of the fact of "who is going to tell Leon to do something about that"? .....Or maybe daring someone to...but that would not be likely as he was just too good natured and happy a guy for the most part.

Did you meet them? if so when/where under what circumstances? Just curious.

[Kalan]

Frazier...Qawi would seem to fit....and the worst one, Leon Spinks.....I really think that's what he thought he was....and he attempted to fit the mold. And nope...didn't work.

Leon became Lineal Heavyweight Champion by beating a highly regarded Heavyweight... and he DIDN'T see himself as a pressure fighter..He WASN'T big, tall, or strong enough -- but Leon DID have a fair amount of speed and athletic ability... What he lacked was skills and experience ... and also self esteem.

The first thing Leon should have done with that money when he became Heavyweight Champion is have his teeth fixed... That would have given him a sense of dignity and stopped all the joksters and comedians.. That was priority number one -- but he listened to mama and that wasn't her priority..

Spinks saw himself as a compact, quick, and skillful boxer-puncher -- but his self image was terrible and he was never given time to develop his skills.. He was pushed into big fights way before he was ready.. That's not really his fault, but the people guiding him.. I ran into Spinks a couple of times at boxing matches, and came away thinking he was too deferential -- and one of the least assertive people who achieved any level of fame and success I ever met.. I felt he needed a Jack Blackburn or somebody who could watch over his affairs and give him a lot of guidance.

He was only 24 when he became Heavyweight Champion and not real swift to begin with.. Even taking into consideration Tyson Fury and Buster Douglas -- I've never seen a Lineal Heavyweight Champion whose career was more of a waste than Leon Spinks'.

Hey Kalan, I had the pleasure of being in these guys presence on quite a few occasions. They had dropped into the Club Mali Kai in Hazelwood/Florrisant Mo on a few occasions, where I performed and they would work out publicly at their gym on occasions....also would show up to the late night scene in East St Louis, where I also performed on occasion. I would agree with the self image stuff around Leon...not so much around Michael. But both of these guys were just great human beings, without a bit of vitriol in their good souls. They were about as humble as a person on a world stage could be.

And Michael just had a bad night with Mike....at his best I don't think he would have beaten Mike, (though not impossible if he could survive the early torrents) But he did not have a bit of dishonesty in him. He may well have froze, he surely got whacked, and may just not have had what it would take to keep out of Mikes way in the early going. But that fight was honest. (I'm not saying you question it, you seem to give him good credit, but others have besmirched his honor here, and I always step up to defend this good man, when folks question that performance)

I would agree that Leon saw himself as primarily a boxer puncher, but he did refer to himself on more than one occasion as a guy who put a world of pressure on anyone standing in front of him. So I've described him here, as he had described himself. But I will tell you this.....this good man never saw a party he didn't like, or walk away early from fun, or a good time. Great neighbor, great person to be in the presence of, but maybe not the recipe for a great athlete.

I was a pretty scrawny musician at the time, and had about the same sense of humor as I have here, and would participate in the humor of the ridiculous in their presence. They appreciated my musicianship, and were somewhat kind with their compliments....so I kidded about being "El Kabong" and that they better not test me......thank god they laughed...I took my life into my hands using humor like that around them. That forgiveness is why I still have fingers to type and play my instruments. lol. Leon had more talent than he ever showed, but was more easily distracted by a good time than a dog by a squirrel. Michael had the oddest footwork style I've ever seen. What did you think of the guys footwork? Have you EVER seen anything like it anywhere else? I can't say it looked great, but he sure seemed to make it work for him. Michael was Definitely not in the pressure catagory. He always appeared to me overly relaxed, and in an oddly good mood for a fella in the ring with his life on the line.

Leon also had a sense of humor about his teeth.....I can't remember the exact context...but I overheard him saying words to the effect of ...he was waiting for someone to bring it up to him directly, and he'd think about then...but apparently they are not that apparent/obvious or maybe they are pretty appealing to many. Making fun of the fact of "who is going to tell Leon to do something about that"? .....Or maybe daring someone to...but that would not be likely as he was just too good natured and happy a guy for the most part.

Did you meet them? if so when/where under what circumstances? Just curious.

Wasn't a bad night for Michael Spinks against Mike Tyson. He simply lacked the Heavyweight power to keep a much bigger, stronger, tougher, and harder puncher off him. When Michael got up from the first knockdown I knew he was finished -- because he wasn't running. They both threw hard rights.. Spinks was driven under the bottom rope by Tyson's -- knocked into retirement.. It was like when Tarver and Roy threw simultaneous punches. Roy's got there 1st -- AT's connected better... and Roy was driven under the bottom rope.. He scrambled to his feet because Tarver is no Heavyweight -- but Roy wasn't fit to continue the fight... Spinks wasn't fit to continue his career.

Michael Spinks had really great footwork and upper body movement.. He was unusually clever with his punch selection and trickery.. Holmes had some difficulty getting good shots on Spinks, but he certainly won the rematch by landing heavier punches and almost as many.. Holmes was not a popular guy with judges or treated fairly in that fight.. Holmes hit Norton, Shavers, Ali, Ocasio, Witherspoon, Mercer, and Weaver almost at will...so I would say Spinks was a much better boxer than any of those guys.. He certainly lacked the size and strength of a real Heavyweight, but he got super crude defenders like Cooney and Tangstad out with blizzards of shots coming from everywhere.. He was the best Light Heavyweight so far.

Leon didn't reach his potential. Michael reached his potential very well -- but Leon was pushed too hard, too fast. He wasn't given a time to develop his craft or skills to the degree a small Heavyweight needed to develop them to stay on top.. You need those rounds and fights.. He fought Ali at 24. I don't know what the rush was all about.. It definitely hurt Leon, because he wasn't a "phenom" like they were hyping him ... I can't remember the fights I met him at -- but I think one was the Red Lopez-Jose de Paula fight at the Olympic Auditorium in LA.

[Boxing Prospect]

Chang, Moon, Gushiken

[Sidney Carton]

Henry Armstrong - He never stopped punching.

In between head butting, pushing, shoving and leveraging with his head, shoulders, forearms, elbows, and gloves... More a dirty fighter than a pressure guy... Henry didn't do that to guys like Beau Jack and Ray Robinson... And he stopped punching quite a bit in those fights.

You must know that Armstrong had lost his title and was far past his best when he fought Jack and Robbinson.

[Sidney Carton]

Nobody here heard of Battling Nelson?

[Kalan]

Of course... His battles with Wolgast, Gans, and Attell were legendary... Certainly a durable pressure guy...Not the most clever though.

[gilgamesh]

Henry Armstrong - He never stopped punching.

In between head butting, pushing, shoving and leveraging with his head, shoulders, forearms, elbows, and gloves... More a dirty fighter than a pressure guy... Henry didn't do that to guys like Beau Jack and Ray Robinson... And he stopped punching quite a bit in those fights.

You must know that Armstrong had lost his title and was far past his best when he fought Jack and Robbinson.

The concept that fighters age and aren't forever at their best is lost on Kalan. If you got beat when you're 40 by somebody it means the same to him as if you got beat when you were 25. He just doesn't understand the difference.

[Kalan]

[The concept that fighters age and aren't forever at their best is lost on Kalan. If you got beat when you're 40 by somebody it means the same to him as if you got beat when you were 25. He just doesn't understand the difference.

gilgamesh you're insane... Armstrong lost 8 out of his first 45 fights with 5 draws... AT that point in his career he was 25... His career was spotted with losses.

And he never reached anywhere close to 40 in the prize ring... He quit when he was 35... He got worn out because he walked into punches.

[gilgamesh]

[The concept that fighters age and aren't forever at their best is lost on Kalan. If you got beat when you're 40 by somebody it means the same to him as if you got beat when you were 25. He just doesn't understand the difference.

gilgamesh you're insane... Armstrong lost 8 out of his first 45 fights with 5 draws... AT that point in his career he was 25... His career was spotted with losses.

And he never reached anywhere close to 40 in the prize ring... He quit when he was 35... He got worn out because he walked into punches.

I didn't say Armstrong was 40, I said that YOU don't understand the difference between a fighter being in his prime or being past his prime. You talk about a loss for a fighter the same whether it occurred in his prime or after it. For years it wasn't uncommon for guys to get shopworn in their 30's because they fought about 3 or 4 times more often than guys fight now. Puts more miles on the clock. If the modern day athletes had THAT many fights, they'd be wore out at a younger age too.

[theone]

Julio Cesar Chavez was the best pressure fighter I've ever seen. The way he would cut off the ring, move his head, and control guys against the ropes with his elbows while landing hellacious body shots was awe inspiring. Unfortunately at the peak of his fame he let all the great chin talk get to his head, and started more or less just trying to walk guys down while letting them tee off on him. In additional to all the reports of his excessive partying and not taking training serious anymore, he became more of a slugger, and he just didn't have the kind of power to get away with that for long.
Anyway, an all-time great regardless.

[BoxBuzz]

Julio Cesar Chavez was the best pressure fighter I've ever seen. The way he would cut off the ring, move his head, and control guys against the ropes with his elbows while landing hellacious body shots was awe inspiring. Unfortunately at the peak of his fame he let all the great chin talk get to his head, and started more or less just trying to walk guys down while letting them tee off on him. In additional to all the reports of his excessive partying and not taking training serious anymore, he became more of a slugger, and he just didn't have the kind of power to get away with that for long.
Anyway, an all-time great regardless.

So Pernell Whitaker must be the best antidote to the pressure fighter.

[theone]

Julio Cesar Chavez was the best pressure fighter I've ever seen. The way he would cut off the ring, move his head, and control guys against the ropes with his elbows while landing hellacious body shots was awe inspiring. Unfortunately at the peak of his fame he let all the great chin talk get to his head, and started more or less just trying to walk guys down while letting them tee off on him. In additional to all the reports of his excessive partying and not taking training serious anymore, he became more of a slugger, and he just didn't have the kind of power to get away with that for long.
Anyway, an all-time great regardless.

So Pernell Whitaker must be the best antidote to the pressure fighter.

Yes, to every pressure fighter he ever faced in his prime and perhaps most that ever existed in the weight classes he had fought.

[Caractacus]

Tommy "Hurricane" Jackson

[Caractacus]

[Caractacus]

[Caractacus]

Mickey Walker should also be added to dis listing.

[Syntax Error]

Shawn Porter no doubt deserves a mention, since his career has now ended.