The best LHW since 1980 ?

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 20 Jul 2017, 12:20

What do you think ? Would you explain your choice, please........

Enlightened-One · Post by **Enlightened-One** » 20 Jul 2017, 14:37

Joe Calzaghe, Sergey Kovalev & Andre Ward haven’t achieved anywhere near as much at 175lbs as the likes of Roy Jones Jr. and Michael Spinks.

Therefore, this appears to be a straight shootout between Jinx and Junior.

For me, I have to favour Roy Jones Jr, simply because I believe his overall resume at all of the weights he’s competed at is better than Michael Spinks'.

Here’s a list of their “best” opponents that they defeated:

Jinx:
• Dwight Muhammad Qawi
• Eddie Mustafa Muhammad
• Marvin Johnson
• Larry Holmes
• Mustafa Wasajja
• Ramon Ranquello
• Yaqui Lopez
• David Sears
• Jerry Celestine
• Gerry Cooney
• Jim MacDonald
• Oscar Rivadeneyra
• Johnny Davis
• Eddie Davis
• Murray Sutherland
• Steffen Tangstad

Junior:
• James Toney
• Montell Griffin
• John Ruiz
• Jorge Vaca
• Antonio Tarver
• Vinny Pazienza
• Lou Del Valle
• Virgil Hill
• Mike McCallum
• Merqui Sosa
• Clinton Woods
• Jorge Castro
• Reggie Johnson
• Bernard Hopkins
• Eric Harding
• Thulani Malinga
• Felix Trinidad
• Otis Grant
• David Telesco
• Tony Thornton
• Prince Badi Ajamu
• Antoine Byrd
• Jeff Lacy
• Art Serwano
• Julio Cesar Gonzalez
• Derrick Harmon
• Thomas Tate
• Glen Kelly
• Anthony Hanshaw
• Richard Hall

Ruthless-RKO · Post by **Ruthless-RKO** » 20 Jul 2017, 14:42

No Hopkins?

I would still say RJJ..

Calzaghe had 2 fights at LHW.. should not be polled.

Nathan Clev did more than Calzaghe

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 20 Jul 2017, 14:59

Ruthless-RKO wrote:No Hopkins?

I would still say RJJ..

Calzaghe had 2 fights at LHW.. should not be polled.

Nathan Clev did more than Calzaghe

I wrote : Joe Calzaghe (2008)....I thought it was enough.........

Jip · Post by **Jip** » 20 Jul 2017, 15:01

Jones at sm was unbeatable. Jones at lh was beatable. A atg puncher like adonis, kovalev or bertebiev would have a punchers chance. But jones at lh was still such incredibly gifted, terrefic reflexes, oberall physical ability, that he still is the best lh ever.

1 jones
2-6 in no particular order bertebiev, gvozdyk, kovalev, stevenson, spinks
7-11 in no p. O. Michalchewski, calzaghe, dawson, tarver

gilgamesh · Post by **gilgamesh** » 20 Jul 2017, 15:06

At his peak I'd pick Roy of the choices listed.

squiggy · Post by **squiggy** » 20 Jul 2017, 15:12

Ruthless-RKO wrote:No Hopkins?

I would still say RJJ..

Calzaghe had 2 fights at LHW.. should not be polled.

Nathan Clev did more than Calzaghe

Yeah, I'd rank BHop 2nd, behind Jones.

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 15:18

Spinks by a significant margin. Qawi might be second, spinks handled him easily.

Noxy · Post by **Noxy** » 20 Jul 2017, 15:45

Probably Spinks, he was extremely hard to fight and he could whack. I'm still impressed by his heavyweight career too, I didn't see him beating Holmes at the time.

ldlamb · Post by **ldlamb** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:04

Although overall I might say Jones.....specifically at LHW I'd have to say Spinks.

He cleaned out the division before moving up to face Holmes, with onky the Qawi fight really being remotely close.

Many of those opponents listed under Jones above happened at SM, and he has the bad losses to Tarver and Johnson at that weight.

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:06

ldlamb wrote:Although overall I might say Jones.....specifically at LHW I'd have to say Spinks.

He cleaned out the division before moving up to face Holmes, with onky the Qawi fight really being remotely close.

Eddie Davis was by far Michael's closest fight. He should have lost.

ldlamb · Post by **ldlamb** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:07

Jip wrote:Jones at sm was unbeatable. Jones at lh was beatable. A atg puncher like adonis, kovalev or bertebiev would have a punchers chance. But jones at lh was still such incredibly gifted, terrefic reflexes, oberall physical ability, that he still is the best lh ever.

1 jones
2-6 in no particular order bertebiev, gvozdyk, kovalev, stevenson, spinks
7-11 in no p. O. Michalchewski, calzaghe, dawson, tarver

Anyone that ranks Spinks as even with those guys from 2-6, just isn't old enough to answer the question.

ldlamb · Post by **ldlamb** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:14

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:
ldlamb wrote:Although overall I might say Jones.....specifically at LHW I'd have to say Spinks.

He cleaned out the division before moving up to face Holmes, with onky the Qawi fight really being remotely close.
Eddie Davis was by far Michael's closest fight. He should have lost.

Maybe it was closer than some of the judges cards (11-1 and 10-2) but I certainly don't agree that Davis won.

Lackeos · Post by **Lackeos** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:14

Jip wrote:2-6 in no particular order bertebiev, gvozdyk, kovalev, stevenson...

That's the most non-expert thing I've ever heard. Your rankings of the past 37 years are like the same as today's rankings, but with Andre Ward edited out. You've even got Tarver and Dawson ranked ahead of Hopkins, Ward, and Virgil Hill.

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 19:17

ldlamb wrote:
SaadOffTheDeck wrote:
ldlamb wrote:Although overall I might say Jones.....specifically at LHW I'd have to say Spinks.

He cleaned out the division before moving up to face Holmes, with onky the Qawi fight really being remotely close.
Eddie Davis was by far Michael's closest fight. He should have lost.
Maybe it was closer than some of the judges cards (11-1 and 10-2) but I certainly don't agree that Davis won.

It was much closer than Qawi. The 115-114 card was much better than the two you listed. 116-112 Davis would be more accurate. He got outworked.

Jip · Post by **Jip** » 20 Jul 2017, 20:38

Lackeos wrote:
Jip wrote:2-6 in no particular order bertebiev, gvozdyk, kovalev, stevenson...

That's the most non-expert thing I've ever heard. Your rankings of the past 37 years are like the same as today's rankings, but with Andre Ward edited out. You've even got Tarver and Dawson ranked ahead of Hopkins, Ward, and Virgil Hill.

I got something. Michael moorer destroys michael spinks at lh!

gilgamesh · Post by **gilgamesh** » 20 Jul 2017, 20:40

Jip wrote:
Lackeos wrote:
Jip wrote:2-6 in no particular order bertebiev, gvozdyk, kovalev, stevenson...

That's the most non-expert thing I've ever heard. Your rankings of the past 37 years are like the same as today's rankings, but with Andre Ward edited out. You've even got Tarver and Dawson ranked ahead of Hopkins, Ward, and Virgil Hill.

I got something. Michael moorer destroys michael spinks at lh!

I doubt it very much. Though his run as a Light Heavyweight was impressive he never faced anyone at Spinks' level during his Light Heavyweight tenure.

Frankly you could take 2 of Spinks' Light Heavyweight wins

Qawi and Eddie Mustafa Muhammad or Qawi and Marvin Johnson.

And it beats Moorer's entire Light Heavyweight resume.

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 20:44

Moorer is overrated at light heavy and underrated at heavy. Spinks would have tuned him up at 75.

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 20:46

gilgamesh wrote:
Jip wrote:
Lackeos wrote:
That's the most non-expert thing I've ever heard. Your rankings of the past 37 years are like the same as today's rankings, but with Andre Ward edited out. You've even got Tarver and Dawson ranked ahead of Hopkins, Ward, and Virgil Hill.

I got something. Michael moorer destroys michael spinks at lh!
I doubt it very much. Though his run as a Light Heavyweight was impressive he never faced anyone at Spinks' level during his Light Heavyweight tenure.

Frankly you could take 2 of Spinks' Light Heavyweight wins

Qawi and Eddie Mustafa Muhammad or Qawi and Marvin Johnson.

And it beats Moorer's entire Light Heavyweight resume.

Just one of them would do it.spinks literally has 10 wins at light heavy better than Stewart.

Jip · Post by **Jip** » 20 Jul 2017, 20:58

You guys know me long enough to know that i focus on who is the better boxer and not who had the better record, when asked "who is the best boxer at lh since 80"

Dariusz Michalchewski had over 40 fights, he did nithing but win except 2 fights, he faught much better and much more quality opponents than bertebiev. Does he has a better record than bertebiev? Yes he does. Is he a better boxer than boxer bertebiev? No he isnt.

I said 2-6 in no particular order, meaning that i can see spinks at 3. 3 is high. Jones is a no brainer, best boxer i have ever seen. Moorer would arguably be 2. The guy punched harder than kovalev, had a solid guard, fluid footwork, balanced, controlled with chin. And the perfect size for a light heavyweight 6'2 with long reach, a nighmare for anybody ever at lh. Reminds me of mcclellan, putting guys away in 1

SaadOffTheDeck · Post by **SaadOffTheDeck** » 20 Jul 2017, 21:13

You're consistently wrong picking fights. So your all time ratings based on whom you think would win are garbage.

gilgamesh · Post by **gilgamesh** » 20 Jul 2017, 21:19

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:You're consistently wrong picking fights. So your all time ratings based on whom you think would win are garbage.

TheGingerBomber · Post by **TheGingerBomber** » 20 Jul 2017, 22:05

Ward beat all their dicks off

Jip · Post by **Jip** » 20 Jul 2017, 22:10

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:You're consistently wrong picking fights. So your all time ratings based on whom you think would win are garbage.

Not true.

Go to my thread where i predicted future fights. 80 % i was right, predicting the right winner, sometimes i was wrong the way the fight was won ud tko etc..

I had 2 big wrong pickings that was chavez and canelo and the other i dont remember, i think it was brook spence. Because i wanted to be a bit courageaous and not always predict the easy why always predicting the favourite, which were canelo and spence.

gilgamesh · Post by **gilgamesh** » 20 Jul 2017, 22:15

I've correctly picked 93% of the fights in the last month and a half or so since I started playing on boxing*prophet, and I'd confidently have picked Michael Spinks over Michael Moorer.

Regardless. Ranking guys on all time standings based on who you think will win is generally not a good way to go about it. There's a good chance the guy you think would've won ain't the guy that would've won. That goes for anybody, not just you.

It's a flawed way to rank guys no matter who does it. Nobody is able to call all the fights, all the time.